Has Marketing Gone Too Far? "Effortlessly"?

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sparkism13

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I have a gripe. I recently used Meguiars SwirlX and was satisfied with the product, but only after using it with the correct technique. My gripe is that one of the bullet points on the front of the bottle clearly states that it "effortlessly removes swirls and enhances...". Well, if by effortlessly they mean that the next day your shoulder will feel like its going to separate from your arm from the soreness, then I would agree. Otherwise, I have to seriously disagree.

Perhaps I was the fool for seriously thinking that I could apply it like a wax, with a bit more pressure, and my swirls would "instantly" disappear as it states on the description. Would that not be effortlessly? If I had not found AG and this forum, I would not know that you have to polish a small section at a time and spend multiple hours on your vehicle. That seems like a far cry from the "effortlessly" claims from Meguiars. Am I way off base? I don't think the majority of the target audience of these products is going to join a forum and learn in detail about this stuff. So, in a way, those claims are meant to sucker you in.

I know its not limited to Meguiars, and that they are just keeping up with the competition, but it's still a bit frustrating. I like the idea of MFGs making consumer friendly products, but this seems very misleading. I've always liked Megs but have since began to try other MFGs. For me, this bad marketing practice has made me rethink my loyalty for the brand. Ok, my rant is over. Thoughts anyone?

Oops, probably should've posted this thread in the off-topic section. Feel free to move it.
 
Marketing - Take it all with a grain of salt.

"The" company's job is to sell the product. If it's legal - most companies will try it to sell the product. The internet has totally changed the way many people (including myself) buy stuff.
Used to everyone would go to the store and compare products by their label. Now people look at the internet reviews of items they are going to buy, then just pick it up (online or in store).

So, when you are looking at labels in the store, remember, they are trying to reach short attention spanned Gen-X'ers that have faith in nothing until it has been through its web-rounds.

DLB
 
Whats the old phrase .... believe none of what you read, and 1/2 of what you hear. Test for yourself, and if it doesnt do as offered then move onto the competitors product. Kinda how we have all found our favorite products.
 
sparkism13 said:
By hand, unfortunately.:eek:
Click to expand...

My comments here are only meant as information, they're not in any way shape or forum judgmental, just comments on the reality of modern clear coats, what it means to remove swirls and marketing.

Modern clear coats are hard when compared to traditional single stage paints. I'm always typing this even though I know a lot of people reading my words have never worked on single stage paints but I have no other point of reference to compare new paints to.

Because modern clear coat paints are harder, and actually a better term is polishable, as in less polishable, it's harder for you and me to remove swirls by hand. That's just the facts.


And for all the lurkers or new members reading this, check out these two articles,


This one shows the time difference in buffing out just one half of a car hood by hand and the other half by machine. It also shows the steps for each approach.

Man versus Machine



This one goes into depth on the softness and hardness factor.

The practical differences between a single stage paints and clear coat paints
​


sparkism13 said:
Which, by the way, there is no distinction made between how effortlessly it is by hand vs machine.
Click to expand...

When I first saw the title to this thread I though someone that had attended one of my classes was making fun of me because I use the word effortlessly during the section of the class when we talk about how to use detailing clay. Like this,

When you first start out claying a section of paint you'll notice the clay will drag a little as its grabbing the paint due to the above surface bonded contaminants still on the paint. As you continue to rub the clay over the paint and remove all the above surface bonded contaminants, the clay will begin gliding effortlessly over the paint.


That's pretty much what I say in each class.


As for marketing, if you were to take a swirled out finish and just wipe the SwirlX over the paint like a wax, then wipe it off, in most cases it will have appeared to remove at least some of the swirls even though chances are better it's just masking them. This is what the average person would do because the average person doesn't now you have to physically work the products over the paint i an effort to actually remove some of the paint to level the surface. The first example being effortlessly, (how the average person is going to apply it), and the latter example being work, how a forum member would work the products.


So yep... there's a little marketing involved with this product and most products on the market, that's business.

At least you learned how to work the product and were successful, lots of people never reach that level by hand.

By the way, where did you learn how to properly work the product by hand?

  • Trial and error?
  • Practice makes perfect?
  • A forum article?
  • All of the above?
:)
 
Mike.Phillips@Autogeek said:
At least you learned how to work the product and were successful, lots of people never reach that level by hand.

By the way, where did you learn how to properly work the product by hand?

  • Trial and error?
  • Practice makes perfect?
  • A forum article?
  • All of the above?
:)
Click to expand...

Funny you should ask. It was actually your article Man vs Machine (or something like that) that pointed me in the right direction. I actually used the technique you described, including doing a test spot, and was much more successful. However, I could only do my trunk and my hood before I gave up. It was just too much work and too time consuming to do by hand (to do it right by hand). Unfortunately, I dont have that kind of time right now. Thats when I decided on getting a polisher. However, I wont be doing that until next summer as its just too cold for detailing to be enjoyable right now.

Still, it makes me think Meguiars is losing touch with enthusiasts and cares more about sheer market share and guys that still use Turtle Wax and Armor All. Their acquisition by 3M, one of the largest companies in the world, makes me even more skeptical. I know business is business, but there are many successful companies that retain their soul while making good business decisions.

If you haven't noticed, I have a love hate relationship with capitalism.
 
sparkism13 said:
Still, it makes me think Meguiars is losing touch with enthusiasts and cares more about sheer market share and guys that still use Turtle Wax and Armor All. Their acquisition by 3M, one of the largest companies in the world, makes me even more skeptical. I know business is business, but there are many successful companies that retain their soul while making good business decisions.
Click to expand...

I have to vigorously disagree with this opinion. No other major detailing manufacturer provides better detailing instruction and customer support than Meguiar's. They have a remarkable range of products, both in the consumer and professional lines. How can you compare them to Turtle Wax and Armor All? How many TW and AA products can begin to compare to Meguiar's consumer line products, much less their professional line products? Until SwirlX and Ultimate Compound were released a year ago, were there any good consumer-line polishes/compounds available for use by hand or DA polisher?

Okay, I agree that SwirlX does not remove swirls effortlessly, but if you are an enthusiast, you already knew that before trying the product. Why zero in on Meguiar's? I can pull out any number of outrageous marketing claims made by any number of boutique product lines. We all understand what is going on.

And no, I don't use Meguiar's exclusively. I did a quick-detail my wife's CR-V today. I used ONR, APC+, UQW, and Stoner's More Shine on the tires.

Respectfully,
Al
 
I agree that I'm tired of the crap as well. False marketing claims, gimicky discount techniques and stuff that actually cost you more etc. I could go on.

It is what it is, I'd much rather deal with a company that is straight up and honest. Tell it like it is. Also, when doing a comparison reveiw, review the best products out there, not just the ones they sell. If they get their tails kicked admit it and go back come up with a better product. Meg's doesn't mention names but the seem to do this which I like.

It's amazing what honesty and straightforwardness will do.

I too purchased swirl x. I used it for 3 minutes on a section and it did absolutely nothing. I think I was putting so much pressure on the applicator at the end that all I was doing is making it worse. (I'm talking about when you put it under bright halogens and scrutinizing it.)

I picked up the phone and called Meg's tech support and explained the process and guy point blank told me I had the wrong product. Explained that swirlx was for "light" scratches? I jokingly replied, "the one's so light you can't see them". His response was pretty much. (Not getting into a debate over whether with a machine and 8 hours you can get it to work, just that it wasn't what was advertised in my opinion.)

Right there I got respect for him and asked for a recommendation and he steered me in the right direction. After that I came on this forum and got some of what he said and verified it. (As well as learning about a lot of other things as well.)

I had a similiar situation with M105 he recommended. I got it and had problems using it. I called in to find out what I was doing wrong and learn the correct techniques. After a couple of minutes, he said it sounds right you could have a bad bottle and then went into temperatures, shipping that could cause a bad "bottle". He sent me a new one to my suprise no charge. Test it last night and worked beautifully. Or at least on the test panel I worked with it on.

So yes I agree with the comments about the product hype but that's about every company out there.

As for Meguiars, I have to say if you call Meg's the people I've spoken with are just top notch. It's the main reason why I try to standardize on their products if at all possible.
 
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