Help with wax/wash process- about to give up!

StuDLei said:
Do coatings really offer some level of scratch resistance? I have never used one and I'd love to try one at some point, but it's probably going to be awhile. It would be interesting if manman tested this on one of his panels to see if it helped prevent these tiny scratches.

Manman-- yesterday I polished about half of my car with Menzerna sf4500, just to clean it up a bit. It had some water spots and light scratches from ONRing the past year. Well, the rear of my car (the bumper) is plastic, so are the rear quater panels. Both have been repainted. Last night I went out to my garage, after reading this thread. I used Eraser in one spot several times to check my work and everything was good. Well, I wanted to throw some protection on the areas I had polished so I used some OCW. Everything was fine, EXCEPT for the plastic, repainted parts. They immediately had light swirls in them and to be honest, they were pretty bad. Not near as bad as the plastic pieces that had not been polished, but something definitely changed. I don't know if the OCW got rid of some fillers in that part of the paint, or if the paint is just that soft there or what, but the swirls were coming back in a hurry. I don't think it has anything to do with being repainted, as all of the parts of my car that are plastic have swirled up much more over the last year (since 105/205) than the metal parts.

I don't get it either. So anyways, we're in somewhat of the same boat.


Oh and for you guys that use coatings, what does it take to become a pro installer of the coatings that require it? How do you go about it? Just curious.
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Here is an example (CQuartz UK).

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFxuy7Tmb7E&feature=share&list=FLMdQgqthzNZRrYFo3sBE0Dw]Cquartz CQUK gloss & scratch test - YouTube[/video]
 
Definitely looks worth checking out for a daily driver. I can't get over the feeling that my wool mitt should really NOT be doing damage with such low pressure etc, but hopefully next time using MFs will show some different results.

I might also try those tips about re-foaming the car and/or using a 2-bucket wash in conjunction to make sure I have enough lubrication. Either way I guess I should be doing some kind of 2 step process to make sure most of the contamination is off of the car, before going in with a little more pressure to make sure it really gets clean. I'm never touching it with that mitt again though!
 
I have a black Yukon and have used almost all of the same products you are using, but I have not had the same issues you are experiencing.


Flex 3401
Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover (Orange CCS Pad)
Wolfgang Finishing Glaze (Blue CCS Pad)
Wolfgang Total Gloss Paint Sealant (Red CCS Pad)
Wolfgang Fuzion (Red CCS Pad)
Chemical Guys Honeydew Soap
Gilmour Foam Gun

Foam Gun
Soak
Hose off with strong stream

Three bucket method.
-One bucket with 2 gallons of water and soap for wheels.
-Black chenille mitt for wheels only
-One bucket with three gallons of water and soap for paint.
-One bucket of plain fresh water for rinsing the CarPro mitt.
-All three of these buckets have a Grit Guard in them.

Use your CarPro Merino Wool Wash Mitt for upper panels
I rinse mine a total of 12 times on a typical wash
Black Chenille Wash Mitt for lower panels
Rinse a total of 4 times on a typical wash

Dry from top to bottom
Use three large waffle weave microfiber towels.
Each folded in 12 total useable sections.
Use each side for a small area, drying a section....flip to a clean, unused section for the next small area.

-One towel for the roof
-One towel for the sides 2/3rds of the way down
-One towel for the lower areas (rockers, lower grill, bumpers)

You mention needing to remove "polish streaks". If you are using WGTSR properly, it will finish down very well. It has Diminishing Abrasive Technology (DAT).

You mention, "going in with a little more pressure to make sure it really gets clean". You shouldn't have to apply pressure; simply glide the wash mitt over the surface. You really shouldn't even be going over the same section of paint more than once.

Good Luck...hope the Forum helps.
 
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StuDLei said:
Do coatings really offer some level of scratch resistance? I have never used one and I'd love to try one at some point, but it's probably going to be awhile. It would be interesting if manman tested this on one of his panels to see if it helped prevent these tiny scratches.

Manman-- yesterday I polished about half of my car with Menzerna sf4500, just to clean it up a bit. It had some water spots and light scratches from ONRing the past year. Well, the rear of my car (the bumper) is plastic, so are the rear quater panels. Both have been repainted. Last night I went out to my garage, after reading this thread. I used Eraser in one spot several times to check my work and everything was good. Well, I wanted to throw some protection on the areas I had polished so I used some OCW. Everything was fine, EXCEPT for the plastic, repainted parts. They immediately had light swirls in them and to be honest, they were pretty bad. Not near as bad as the plastic pieces that had not been polished, but something definitely changed. I don't know if the OCW got rid of some fillers in that part of the paint, or if the paint is just that soft there or what, but the swirls were coming back in a hurry
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SF 4500 is a great polish, but loaded with things that can mask slight defects. The thing is, Im convinced the swirls were never removed from the beginning. SF 4500 can follow up after more aggressive polishes, but doesn't have enough bite to remove the lightest of swirls IMO.

Paint can be soft, but not that soft. Swirls are thousands of tiny scratches. Its hard to believe that someone knowledgeable about detailing (you) could put thousands of tiny scratches in their paint in a single wash while being careful.

I'm pretty sure you washed away the fillers from the SF 4500 and the swirls where never removed to begin with. I've done this same thing on black with Wolfgang Finishing Glaze which is quite similar (same) to SF 4000.
 
Manman- I made a thread, but I just wanted to let you know that the panels I'm having trouble with are ONLY repainted panels. Check out my thread for me info if interested.
 
allenk4 said:
You mention, "going in with a little more pressure to make sure it really gets clean". You shouldn't have to apply pressure; simply glide the wash mitt over the surface. You really shouldn't even be going over the same section of paint more than once.

Good Luck...hope the Forum helps.
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Thanks Allen. For the "more pressure" part, I only did that on parts of the car that I hadn't done this new session of polishing/waxing on, because I knew I'd be polishing those soon, but on the parts I had already done I used no pressure whatsoever and still got the scratches. I have 2 of this mitt and it happened with both, so I don't know man...that mitt just isn't for me (unless I find some other thing I'm doing wrong and correct it.).

You are totally right about the WG products and streaking- that experience was from my first runthrough trying to polish, and I was doing a number of things wrong that time. On this recent try I rarely got streaking except maybe around where I masked or hard to buff out spots. I still did the IPA wipedown though, just because I thought it was good as a prep step before LSP.

Junkman2008 said:
Hell yea it does. :xyxthumbs:
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Junkman- you are the man! I love your videos, a few have been directly responsible for the technique change I just mentioned above that turned my results around. Your video on expectations you should have about touchless washing make a lot of sense about my results/expectations on this thread as well, I'll be thinking about that when I retry this weekend. So- Thank you!
 
swanicyouth said:
SF 4500 is a great polish, but loaded with things that can mask slight defects. The thing is, Im convinced the swirls were never removed from the beginning. SF 4500 can follow up after more aggressive polishes, but doesn't have enough bite to remove the lightest of swirls IMO.

Paint can be soft, but not that soft. Swirls are thousands of tiny scratches. Its hard to believe that someone knowledgeable about detailing (you) could put thousands of tiny scratches in their paint in a single wash while being careful.

I'm pretty sure you washed away the fillers from the SF 4500 and the swirls where never removed to begin with. I've done this same thing on black with Wolfgang Finishing Glaze which is quite similar (same) to SF 4000.
Click to expand...

I'm not that knowledgable, yet, lol.

Seriously, this is a great post. I've considered that maybe they were there to begin with but it looks a lot different to me now under the Brinkmann that it did beforehand. You might be right though. In fact I hope you are. Tomorrow or the next day I'm going to try 105 on orange and really Eraser the heck out it and then continue on with something else.
 
StuDLei said:
I'm not that knowledgable, yet, lol.

Seriously, this is a great post. I've considered that maybe they were there to begin with but it looks a lot different to me now under the Brinkmann that it did beforehand. You might be right though. In fact I hope you are. Tomorrow or the next day I'm going to try 105 on orange and really Eraser the heck out it and then continue on with something else.
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I don't know if his post was meant to be directed at you or me, but in my case I just don't know how that can be the case. If I washed it down with IPA mix and no damage was revealed, and then I wipe it down with 0 pressure using regular washing soap and all these scratches are revealed? That doesn't seem to make sense. The last thing where it doesn't fit is that the tiny scratches were 100% in the direction I moved the mitt, and not in a 'swirl' pattern like the damage I was correcting. I'm pretty sure it was the mitt/wash step, I just don't get why. All I can think of is that the touchless part of the wash didn't get as much contaminants off as I thought, and then using the mitt with only the remaining soap from the foam gun was not providing enough lubricant... I don't know. I guess I'll find out with more experimenting.
 
manman said:
I don't know if his post was meant to be directed at you or me, but in my case I just don't know how that can be the case. If I washed it down with IPA mix and no damage was revealed, and then I wipe it down with 0 pressure using regular washing soap and all these scratches are revealed? That doesn't seem to make sense. The last thing where it doesn't fit is that the tiny scratches were 100% in the direction I moved the mitt, and not in a 'swirl' pattern like the damage I was correcting. I'm pretty sure it was the mitt/wash step, I just don't get why. All I can think of is that the touchless part of the wash didn't get as much contaminants off as I thought, and then using the mitt with only the remaining soap from the foam gun was not providing enough lubricant... I don't know. I guess I'll find out with more experimenting.
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This might not mean anything but did you ever brush the mitt out with a pet comb. Merino Wool has a tendency to get nappy with use. I brush mine out after every use (after it was rinsed and fully air dried).
 
Manman, why don't you try another mitt just for the sake of it? I use a $3 mitt from Walmart and love it. I think it's chenille or whatever.
 
Damn it's my one year anniversary on here, just realized!
 
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