How to strip wax

Eldorado2k said:
NormL people never have an actual decent layer of pre existing wax that you didn’t personally apply. Lol.
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now that's funny! I don't mean to ask the same question again, but this will be my first time using a d/a and even though i have everything i need, i am just trying to make sure i have all my ducks in a row before i get into this and do something wrong. I currently have two vehicles with OCW on them and want to use mk37 360 on vehicle and hd speed on another, with white pads. I will wash, clay and wash again.. after that am i good to go right into the 360 ? Is there anything in between my second wash and 360 application that i need to do to prep the paint for the aio ?
 
You are good to go with the 360 after the wash/clay/wash. The AIO will remove anything that a IPA or panel wipe would do.


Here are some examples of non-abrasive Pre-wax cleanser polishes. Yes you putting a machine on the car (could be done by hand also), but it is a fraction of the time it takes to polish with a fine polish and you are not removing any clear coat (except for the pad action)

Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion
Wolfgang Paintwork Polish Enhancer
Dodo Juice Lime Prime Pre-Wax Cleanser Polish
Four Star Ultimate PreWax Cleanser
P21S Gloss Enhancing Paintwork Cleanser
Poorboy's World Professional Polish
Sonus Paintwork Cleanser Prewax Polish
 
01AUDI said:
I will wash, clay and wash again.. after that am i good to go right into the 360 ? Is there anything in between my second wash and 360 application that i need to do to prep the paint for the aio ?
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You’re good. You really don’t even need to do the 2nd wash after claying. Just wipe off the claylube and by the time you go around the vehicle every panel will be dry and ready for polishing. Or you could just spray on a bit more detailing spray or whatever you’re using for claylube and wipe the panel clean.
 
Well, I guess we should have asked what you were planning on using.

Both are cleaner waxes/AIOs that will remove wax, roadfilm, and what not by use of light polishing abrasives and possibly chemical cleaners.

Claying could/should be done in between like said. Some may do a chemical decon with with products like TarX and IronX before claying to remove as much contamination as possible first.


On another note, I thought I read somewhere that Optimum Car Wax is said to migrate into the clear coat.
 
DBAILEY said:
You are good to go with the 360 after the wash/clay/wash. The AIO will remove anything that a IPA or panel wipe would do.


Here are some examples of non-abrasive Pre-wax cleanser polishes. Yes you putting a machine on the car (could be done by hand also), but it is a fraction of the time it takes to polish with a fine polish and you are not removing any clear coat (except for the pad action)

Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion
Wolfgang Paintwork Polish Enhancer
Dodo Juice Lime Prime Pre-Wax Cleanser Polish
Four Star Ultimate PreWax Cleanser
P21S Gloss Enhancing Paintwork Cleanser
Poorboy's World Professional Polish
Sonus Paintwork Cleanser Prewax Polish
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Ok yes that is exactly what i needed to hear. thank you.

Now, will adding a polish before my AIO do anything for my paint or is its only feature cleaning the paint ? You say that it does not take long and can be done by hand so if it helps my paint and doesn't take long i wouldn't mind adding it. I just don't want to add a step that is not needed.
 
Here's some good info copied from Mike’s IPA for inspection thread.

Mike Phillips said:
How to Mix IPA for Inspecting Correction Results

If you're dead set on removing any previously applied wax or paint sealant by chemically stripping the paint, then a combination of using both a 10% solution of IPA to Water followed by wiping with Mineral Spirits should remove most, if not all, of any previously applied wax or paint sealant.


Personal Recommendation For Removing Waxes and Paint Sealants
To remove any previously applied wax or paint sealant, I recommend using a light paint cleaner or a light polish applied by hand or machine. A light paint cleaner or abrasive polish will effectively remove any previously applied wax or paint sealant AND leave the paint looking clear and glossy. I call this working forward in the process because the goal is to create beauty.

Chemically stripping the paint will tend to dull the paint; it certainly doesn't increase gloss and clarity. You don't see the dulling effect unless you're working on black paint and repeat the process multiple times. Since not everyone works on black paint, and you're not going to make stripping your car's paint a daily routine, it could be you won't see the dulling effect on your car's paint but it does take place.

Wiping a clear coated black finish over and over and over again with any type of solvent isn't going to make the top clear layer of paint more and more clear, it's going to do the opposite, that is dull it down.

So chemically stripping paint is what I call working backwards in the process. I, personally, prefer to work forwards in all my detailing projects but do understand the reasons why some people want to chemically strip their car's paint, or their customer's car's paint, and each person can decide what the best approach is for their needs.

And again, since you're not chemically stripping the paint as a "practice" but only during a detailing session, the dulling effect is not an issue, but I wanted to point it out just for the most detail oriented detailing enthusiasts or Pro Detailers reading this article.


:)
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01AUDI said:
Ok yes that is exactly what i needed to hear. thank you.

Now, will adding a polish before my AIO do anything for my paint or is its only feature cleaning the paint ? You say that it does not take long and can be done by hand so if it helps my paint and doesn't take long i wouldn't mind adding it. I just don't want to add a step that is not needed.
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Stick with the AIO and you are good to go. It cleans, polishes and protects.

Here are few more write up to read that I recommend reading.

The Difference Between a Cleaner/Wax and a Finishing Wax

How to choose and use a one-step cleaner/wax by Mike Phillips
 
thanks a lot everyone. yall are a real great group of people. I thought i knew what i was talking about but there is a lot for me to learn and yall keep giving me help. I appreciate all the advice and articles.
 
I'm curious if mckee37 jeweling wax has enough bite to strip
I know meguiars wash plus+ doesn't..apparently leaves a surfactant behind

About the only things I haven't tested was TFR which I'm sure it won't..and solvent like Denatured alcohol, mineral spirits, paint thinner (same as mineral spirits)and laquer thinner.

Non acid wheel cleaner, fallout remover, tar/adhesive remover, Dawn dish soap, citrus degreaser, APC, IPA,bug remover, bird sh!t remover etc doesn't do anything
 
Mike@ShineStruck said:
I'm curious if mckee37 jeweling wax has enough bite to strip
I know meguiars wash plus+ doesn't..apparently leaves a surfactant behind

About the only things I haven't tested was TFR which I'm sure it won't..and solvent like Denatured alcohol, mineral spirits, paint thinner (same as mineral spirits)and laquer thinner.

Non acid wheel cleaner, fallout remover, tar/adhesive remover, Dawn dish soap, citrus degreaser, APC, IPA,bug remover, bird sh!t remover etc doesn't do anything
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What does IPA leave behind that initially takes away beading yet [according to what you’re saying] only temporarily masks the beading?
 
Mike@ShineStruck said:
I'm curious if mckee37 jeweling wax has enough bite to strip
I know meguiars wash plus+ doesn't..apparently leaves a surfactant behind

About the only things I haven't tested was TFR which I'm sure it won't..and solvent like Denatured alcohol, mineral spirits, paint thinner (same as mineral spirits)and laquer thinner.

Non acid wheel cleaner, fallout remover, tar/adhesive remover, Dawn dish soap, citrus degreaser, APC, IPA,bug remover, bird sh!t remover etc doesn't do anything
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What are you trying to strip?

At the OP. Have you done the baggie test on the cars? Do you have any iron remover products that has bleeding effect? If not do you have a wheel cleaner with the bleeding effect. Why I'm asking is if it was a long time ago you did a chemical decon. You might consider to ad a iron remover step before claying. Test with a bleeding effect product on a small area behind the front wheel and see how much it's bleed. If you get bleeding dots I would do a iron remover like ironx. That breaks down the corrosion around the imbedded iron particle and loosen with either a pressure wash rinse or a rinse from the hose. And if it's not gets washed away the clay have easier to pull it away from the clearcoat.

Then like others says the mck360 and speed will take care of what is left. Do you have McKee's 37 n-914 Rinseless Wash? If you have that I would do a rinseless wash after the claying. To get as much claylube away before the polishing with the AIOs. And you can use with a paint prep strength also. It' not nessecery but if you have it use it.
Good thing that you take your time and good luck.
 
SWETM said:
What are you trying to strip?

At the OP. Have you done the baggie test on the cars? Do you have any iron remover products that has bleeding effect? If not do you have a wheel cleaner with the bleeding effect. Why I'm asking is if it was a long time ago you did a chemical decon. You might consider to ad a iron remover step before claying. Test with a bleeding effect product on a small area behind the front wheel and see how much it's bleed. If you get bleeding dots I would do a iron remover like ironx. That breaks down the corrosion around the imbedded iron particle and loosen with either a pressure wash rinse or a rinse from the hose. And if it's not gets washed away the clay have easier to pull it away from the clearcoat.

Then like others says the mck360 and speed will take care of what is left. Do you have McKee's 37 n-914 Rinseless Wash? If you have that I would do a rinseless wash after the claying. To get as much claylube away before the polishing with the AIOs. And you can use with a paint prep strength also. It' not nessecery but if you have it use it.
Good thing that you take your time and good luck.
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I got tired of people on the forums saying this strips wax that strips wax..I just simply started tests to shut up the dawn soap guys..but also to perhaps find a short cut in case something did work(acid bath)

Real simple test really, just need water bottle for pH balanced and hi alkaline products and some paste wax..and a knife with serrations to produce salt/pepper sized wax.

I used autogylm HD paste in my test videos which has man made polymers .. did it this way to get real time visual of chemical reaction if any.

Spraying some things in an LSP panel will just mask beading/sheeting properties till fully evaporated which is what happened when I tried vigorously rubbing meguiars wash plus+ on trunklid.(this has micro abraisives which didn't strip)

As for why certain products masked lsp properties..I don't remember but Ron Katchum replied to one of my posts stating why ..I'd have to dig it up to find the info
 
01AUDI said:
I have tried searching but canthe seem to get an answer. I cureentry have wax brand A on my vehicle but it's almost gone and now I want to try wax brand B.. sinse they are different I don't want to layer, I want to start fresh.. how? I see you all saying how you took off your wax to add anotber, but I don't see anyone saying how.
Is there a way to get back to start without using a d/a?
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Well worth a light polish to not only remove whatever is left of the wax but if you've had said wax on there long enough to diminish, then you would be best served by also removing the road grime, etc. and freshen up the gloss with said light polish.

That's what I would do.
 
Mike@ShineStruck said:
I got tired of people on the forums saying this strips wax that strips wax..I just simply started tests to shut up the dawn soap guys..but also to perhaps find a short cut in case something did work(acid bath)

Real simple test really, just need water bottle for pH balanced and hi alkaline products and some paste wax..and a knife with serrations to produce salt/pepper sized wax.

I used autogylm HD paste in my test videos which has man made polymers .. did it this way to get real time visual of chemical reaction if any.

Spraying some things in an LSP panel will just mask beading/sheeting properties till fully evaporated which is what happened when I tried vigorously rubbing meguiars wash plus+ on trunklid.(this has micro abraisives which didn't strip)

As for why certain products masked lsp properties..I don't remember but Ron Katchum replied to one of my posts stating why ..I'd have to dig it up to find the info
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I was just wondering. And that kind of synthetic wax is hard to remove as a sealant is. A pure organic wax I think is esier to remove and if a lsp has been in the weather elements and the wear and tear of a time. It's easier to break down after that time. A quality lsp stands up good to most used chemicals in car cleaning. The outside elements is more harsh to them over time than a chemical resistant lsp. And the way and wash media products touching the paint also. The same with some surfactans that cloggs cause it's harder to rinse them away and some cheaper spray waxes and QD and car soap with waxes that alter the lsp water behavior very much so you think it has worn of.

Some cleaner wax has strong and alot of solvent in them and that is why they can clean up a paint really good. And with a da and abrasive from the pads and the abrasive in them. It would take a really strong lsp to stand up to it. The thing I wonder about is the residue from the old lsp have the possibility to interfear with the new lsp longevity and quality. And if it's worth it to a aio like 360 that has a long longevity to do a finish polish first to get the old lsp and road film of the paint first with a paint cleanser polish or a finish polish. The thing I will do is to clean the pad god between sets and switch pads when it's builds up residue on them. That's also why I think a chemical decon and claying as through as possible is benefit to the pads. But to get it all of I think almost impossible before the AIO. Then a paint cleanser polish can be of benefit if you have few pads at hand when AIO polish.
 
Mike@ShineStruck said:
I got tired of people on the forums saying this strips wax that strips wax..I just simply started tests to shut up the dawn soap guys..but also to perhaps find a short cut in case something did work(acid bath)

Real simple test really, just need water bottle for pH balanced and hi alkaline products and some paste wax..and a knife with serrations to produce salt/pepper sized wax.

I used autogylm HD paste in my test videos which has man made polymers .. did it this way to get real time visual of chemical reaction if any.

Spraying some things in an LSP panel will just mask beading/sheeting properties till fully evaporated which is what happened when I tried vigorously rubbing meguiars wash plus+ on trunklid.(this has micro abraisives which didn't strip)

As for why certain products masked lsp properties..I don't remember but Ron Katchum replied to one of my posts stating why ..I'd have to dig it up to find the info
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Big deal you aren't proving anything going by beading since clean clear paint can still bead water
 
From the above linked PipUKs Stripping LSP thread, bottom of page 5.

Willy Wang and his bong said:
Beading occurs on a clean clearcoated surface, or any surface that is free of contaminants for that fact. So to say that the IPA brought back the LSP is completely false.
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PiPUK said:
That is an exaggeration of reality. Yes, a clean and freshly polished surface is not totally hydrophillic. However, most of the time when someone demonstrates this, they will have previously used a polish which is oil heavy and which has left a residue of oil. In practice, every time I have seen a freshly polished surface bead water like a freshly applied sealant - it is the oil from the prep which is responsible.

So, yes, a clean surface will not be totally hydrophillic but the example I have presented is very strongly hydrophobic. No matter how much I were to try polishing this surface, without the sealant on it, it would never be that hydrophobic. Moreover, the sealant in question actually modifies the appearance such that the area applied to appears darker that the surrounding (we are chemical formulators, not photographers so capturing this is just not plausible). None of the tests I have shown managed to remove that which strongly supports my findings. If you look at the second part of the test, the beading was recovered with repeated rinsing, it did not need IPA.

Moreover again, if a totally clean surface beads water - why do the vast majority of detailers, pro or enthusiast, use this characteristic to decide if an LSP is present or not?
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