I really tried-Help me from making it worse

As mentioned...


As a"Black is not a color, it's a full time job"


1956 Ford F150 paint polished by Mike Phillips circa 2006 in Escondido, California
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400_1956_Ford_150_by_Mike_Phillips_001.jpg

The reason for this is because clear coat paints are scratch-sensitive and what this means but can sometimes be hard to wrap your mind around is that even though modern clear coat paints are harder than traditional single stage paints, (the only two major paint systems that have been used since we stopped riding horses and started driving cars), they still will scratch easily.

Since your car is black, any defect shows up easily to your eyes.

It is very difficult to maintain a 100% swirls and scratch free finish on a daily drive with black paint. The people that I know that own black cars PURPOSEFULLY and keep them looking brand new all the time also do something to the paint every other week.

By "do something to the paint", I mean besides washing them carefully, they also machine apply a wax every other week or pay someone to machine apply a wax every other week.

By re-waxing often, fine swirls and scratches are either removed or masked, doesn't matter which because the end result is the same, a nice looking black finish.

You can do the same thing by using any premium quality finishing wax and some spray-on waxes.


White paint or silver metallic tends to be good choices of colors for people that don't want to see swirls and scratches because it's more difficult to see these types of defects on these light colors. It's not that the swirls and scratches are not there, it's just more difficult to see.


While I agree that nothing looks better than a car with a highly and correctly polished black finish, maintaining a black finish on a daily driver is a full time job. You will need to educate yourself on what I call the 3 P's, that is,

  • Paint
  • Products
  • Procedures
You need to know a little bit about each category in order to either do the job yourself or to hire someone and ensure they know what they are doing.


Educate Yourself
The best way to educate yourself is to read a lot on a forum like this, AutogeekOnline.net, watch videos on our YouTube Channel and attend any detailing class you can clear your schedule and attend. If you can attend one of my Detailing Boot Camp Classes I guarantee you will not only learn a lot but you'll also have a lot of fun at the same time.



:)
 
Now on to some help for you...


It's pretty much impossible to keep a black clearcoat finish flawless if the car in question is a daily driver. Garage Queen? Sure. Daily Driver? No way. It's not you it's the paint and the color as explained in the two articles I posted.

Here's what you can do...

Apply a quality paint coating to the paint instead of a car wax or synthetic paint sealant.

Take a look at the Wolfgang Uber Ceramic Paint Coating - I posted a TON of pictures showing how to apply it and the amazing glass-like results you'll get. PLUS ceramic coatings resist LIGHT scratching. You still have to TOUCH the paint carefully.

Review & How-To: Wolfgang Uber Ceramic Paint Coating


watermark.php


Here's the amazing glass-like results I speak of...

watermark.php



Every time I see the owner he tells me he's won another trophy.

Take my word for it... lots of pictures showing the process in the article below. In a format you will NEVER find on Facebook.


Review & How-To: Wolfgang Uber Ceramic Paint Coating





:)
 
Next is you need to practice what I teach in my classes called,

The Gentle Approach to Washing a Car


Sorry to say I don't have a full blown article on the meat of this technique but I do have a video on our ROKU channel.

Here's my article on the opposite method and I think somewhere in this article I explain the gentle approach. Interestingly enough, I've never seen any other "guru" even address this topic anywhere... on a forum, in a video or on FB


The Aggressive Approach to Washing a Car




And how I wash my personal cars is using a foam gun PLUS the gentle approach using a Microfiber Chenille Wash Mitt not the mitt you see in the below article.


How to wash a car with a foam gun


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Then blot the car dry or use something like the McKee's 37 Turbo Car Dryer.



Hope that helps...

For what it's worth.... I once owned a black Honda Pilot. After owing a black DAILY DRIVER I made the commitment to never own another black daily driver.

Now I WOULD own a black cool car, like a 1967 GTO Convertible. But not a mundane, normal, grocery-getter daily driver.


:)
 
I think you are wasting your time with the Klasse. But that is just my opinion your time would be much better served using something like Prima Amigo if you want to go the hand route. A machine is more efficient no doubt but many like to go the hand route. Some of these products work much better by hand than others.

It's just gonna be an ongoing battle find a product that gives the best look you can live with like Prima Amigo for example and use it when you feel you need it. It's a driver so it's very hard to keep perfect


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Whoa....the man himself jumped in. I'm honored Mike. It's much appreciated.

I'll check out all the links/articles you posted over the weekend. I do have a PC-XP.

Not to be overly dramatic about this but I'd be lying if I didn't admit that I am a bit bummed. Not kiss the dog and kick the wife type of bummed... LOL...Just feel like I've been kicked in the twig and berries, turn in your man card. Effort was there just bad execution I guess. I knew black was a PITA. Just washing it yesterday to take pictures within 30 minutes I had a fine layer of yellowish/green pollen developing. The reality has set in over the last few days and I have be enlightened.

Thanks for all of the tips and ideas guys. Even with the winter months I probably still averaged a wash every 3 weeks. Which in hindsight may not have been the best idea. Water has never NOT beaded though. I just want a mulligan. Get it back to close as perfect as possible and the way it looks change just about everything my approach as I move forward. Put some type of sealant/coating to protect the best I can (not just was like I had been) and keep the containments from sinking in so I won't have the urge to wash it so much. I realize most of it fixable and as I mentioned before I do have a "practice" vehicle to start with. Because I've done plenty of mechanical work on vehicles but car finish at this level (for a lack of a better way of putting it), not so much.

I must admit I have a bit of information overload. I truly appreciate all the suggestions for products to use. But man, outside of the basics I never paid attention to the amount of products to choose from. Klasse, HD, WG, McKee's, etc. I don't want to say it's overwhelming....just...WOW. I know everyone has their favorites and I would imagine the quality in these products are pretty close to each other. I guess I'll just have to buy a few different flavors and see what trips my trigger.

Again, I can't thank you guys enough for your comments. I'll unload the chamois use and stick to MF and look into some of the other products mentioned.

Peace and have a safe weekend.
 
Hello,

I Have a PC-XP and some HD products coming. I realize folks have there favorites and for the most part "generally" speaking the performance in pads are pretty close. Or maybe not. LOL

Anyway, I think I need more pads than what I already have (new). I have:

3 CG Hex Light Polishing-Blue
3 CG Hex Ultra light Finishing Pad-Red
3 CG Hex Finishing Pad-Black
1 CG Hex Light-Medium Polishing Pad-White

'15 Nissan Murano-Couple pics on Page 1.

I'm thinking a need more of one those four, or additions to (different color but don't think so for what I need to do), or maybe different brand. Do/Will the thinner LC pads be something better for my needs?

As always, thanks in advance.
 
WeekendDIY,
hello! I have to say I feel like I'm reading my own posts! With the exception of having a mechanical background, I was; and still am to a large degree in your shoes as a newbie. The information and product choice can be overwhelming.
I too was pleasantly surprised last year when Mike replied to my first post to make sure I was comfortable with the project I was getting into. A few "Cars and Coffee" and two "Detailfest" events later and I've learned it is what we've all come to expect: Mike - and everyone at AG are great people and very generous with their knowledge.
My two cents would be follow Mike Phillips' tips to the letter where possible (I'd love to have an air dryer for the car; but it's not in the budget). As for product, I don't think Autogeek would sell anything that didn't meet their standards - which are high. I go with Meguiars and I'm adding in the McKees brand. They tend to have products for folks like us that need a simplified process.
What I would suggest (from my own experience) is to take a breath, make a simple step by step plan based on Mike's tutorials - and have fun! To quote Michael Stoops of Meguiars: this is supposed to be our therapy, not our reason for therapy. : )
Full disclosure, I have quite a few things I'd like to do to my car, and I still get paralysis from analysis! You are definitely on the right forum to get great advice from members and the Autogeek staff.
Best of luck and keep us posted.
PS... make sure the polisher stops spinning before lifting it off the car... my garage still has a few freckles from my first try : )
Peter
 
Hello,...Thanks for the pep talk PGB.

Between the never ending clouds and rain up here in VA for the last two weeks and the annual honey do spring list I'm slowly working my way towards working on my car. I will provide better pics when and if the sun ever comes out again to show exactly what I'm starting with. Supposedly tomorrow.

I want to thank Custmsprty. We have PM'ed a few times and he has been very helpful. The only reason I'm asking my question(s) here is I simply do not want to wear out my welcome of his generous offer to help with tips and advice. I'll save that for later if/when absolutely needed.

I've gone all in with 3D products. (I returned the Klasse Twins)
I have: 3D HD Adapt, Poxy, Speed, Polish, and Express.
I have new PC-XP and a Foam Cannon
A whole range of Orange, white, black, red, and blue polishing pads. A total of 16 pads
12 pack Forest Green Edgeless MF, 3 Mango Breeze, 8 pack Premium grade MF applicators
1 Waffle Weave Matter MF 25"X36"
Mequiars X2020 3 pack MF
Mequiars Clay kit
Mequiars G19216 Ultimate polish (more because I got a good price and to use for practice on my '02 Santa Fe)
2 MF wash Mitts
I hope that generally covers everything.

So------
Foam, wash while using multiple MF's towels
Rinse
Clay Bar
Rinse (Should I use Iron X next or at all????)
Adapt then Poxy (and next is when I figured I'd stop bugging Custmsprty)
Speed???? or Polish???? Or some other LSP or something different?

Every couple of days I keep coming back and reading threads, watching videos, monitoring Q & A's that interest me and I have questions(s) that pop into my head.
I do want to put a sealant on. But If I've read all of these product descriptions correctly I already have a sealant to use. But if not, I was thinking about C-Quartz or WG Ceramic coating. But do I really need to do that with what I already have?
When Mike says "when you buff or compound you're removing paint". Forgive me for what could be a really dumb A question. If you're removing paint how are you not removing the CC?
How often should polish or rather maybe not? Does that depend on variables? Is there a rule of thumb? twice a year?
Just a quick thank you to all of you guys and this forum. Seems like a great community. I appreciate your responses and patience. Just way too much information overload. LOL I do IT for a living but I’m confident I can tackle this and looking forward to getting started.
Thanks again.
 
I thought I knew what I was doing before I found this site. Basics,yes but not to the degree they do here. Wealth of knowledge & happy to help makes this a great site. Once you get the range on the black,it won't seem so intimidating. Good call on the 3D products,I really like Speed topped with Poxy for my daily driver. Both are easy to use,hold up pretty well and easy to remove. I use a cordless leaf blower for drying my truck,it gets 15 min run time per battery & I dry it with one battery. It really does a good job getting water out of crevices & lug nuts on wheels so you won't have drips come to haunt you after you thought you got all the water. Good luck with your task
 
Great advice given, I would just add, it's tough to keep a daily driver perfect. Reduce your expectations a bit. Make it close to perfect a couple of times a year, then enjoy the car.
 
chet31 said:
Great advice given, I would just add, it's tough to keep a daily driver perfect. Reduce your expectations a bit. Make it close to perfect a couple of times a year, then enjoy the car.
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LOL Amen brotha. I get it though. It won't be perfect for a daily driver. Most of my swirls have come from the way I washing it. Bad technique more than anything. Better soap, better drying technique. As careful as I thought I was I've discovered that there is still more I can do to at least reduce it. And that's all I can ask for and will expect.

Also, part of the problem is now that I know the swirls are there I can't just walk by the car anymore without feeling compelled to address it.
 
By the pictures you showed, the swirls seem shallow, I believe you will be successful in repairing it with your PC. Since the clearcoat is soft, start with your softest pad and your finest product.

You didn't mention which polishes and pads you have, maybe if you do, people here would help you choose a start combo for you to try it.

You also seem to have the OCD we all have it here, so I really believe you'll be able to pull this off, and you'll be able to obtain a fine result.

Good luck, and all the best.
 
From what little experience I have and nothing really to compare I believe as well they're shallow and certainly not through out all the car/panels. And yes, a bit OCD, mainly out of frustration. I never noticed others with this affliction :p . But it's all good. I can fix it.

3 CG Red Hex
3 CG Blue Hex
3 CG Black Hex
1 CG White Hex
4 LC Orange
1 LC Blue
1 LC Black

I basically just bought 3D stock. Adapt, Poxy, Speed, Polish, Dress, and Express products.

PC-XP

If the weather cooperates (Finally stopped raining after two weeks straight) I'll practice on my older 02 Santa Fe and hopefully come Memorial Day weekend if the weather is good I'll have 3 days. That's my hope anyway.

Just trying to decide if I want or will need any type of coating when I'm done.
 
For those in Central VA, you know what I mean when I say we finally had some consecutive days of no rain. I waited several weeks to tackle this.

I have a new appreciation for you pro detailers. It took a couple of days.

Pressure washed first
Foam gun
Several MF towels for washing after foaming
Iron X wipe down
Clay bar then a two bucket wash
Used mainly Orange pad w/HD Adapt
Had to break out the 105 for a couple of areas, not so much for the swirls but for the longer scratches I guess you could it. Like something was on my (no longer be used) chamois. Man I wasn't prepared for the dust 105 generates.
IPA'ed
HD polish was next
Then HD Poxy

Question: How long do you work a section before you decide to get more aggressive. I really didn't want to use the 105, but a couple of spots I went over 2 or 3 times before deciding on the 105. It wasn't the swirls. Were they RIDS? So I'm a little concerned using the 105, but it seemed to work.

Anyway, I'm pleased. Thanks for all the info and advise. For a newb, I think I did OK. But it was quite the effort. The sun isn't totally out today but the pics look pretty good.

Thank you to custmsprty for the PM advise and coaching.
 
Don't be bummed, its all learning..
we all thought we knew how to clean and maintain a car until we got into it, and the learning (by mistakes) is never ending..
My wife has a black MB GLA daily driver.. after a full correction coating and wax a month later i cam home to see her and the kids washing it from a single bucket.. They were having a ball.. i was having a siezure !!! swirled to F.. and covered in water spots.. so worse than it had started..
They had the best water fight though..
Reason for blathering, its only a car, and i got to do over a great car all over again.. and show them why they never clean the car again (my wife was stoked to hear this. planned all along..)

have fun nailing that black paint.. once your maintenance practice is good relax knowing every 6 months opf so you may need to buff the odd section.. (thats why i won't coat black again.. re-applying the coating after each area correction gets expensive and kinda defeats the advantage of coatings...

All the best

Regards

Mark.
 
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Question: How long do you work a section before you decide to get more aggressive. I really didn't want to use the 105 said:
In the case where i have done the test spot on the average condition of the paint (so ID what i use for the whole car), when that exact pass / combo doesn't work i mark the spot / defect.. i will complete the vehicle then return to all the marks (i use a square of masking tape)..
I then step up (effectively test spot the defect to correction), step up a pad, if no; original pad with a more agressive compound, if no more agressive pad with more aggressive compound etc.. IF i can feel the scratch with a nail I WILL NOT TRY TO CORRCET THIS WAY.... thats where touch up paint of clear is best used..

Once the correction is to the level required.. carry on.. the rest of your process looks good and the results speak for themselves..

All the best
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