I think I'm a new candidate for "Horrendous"

J S Machine

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I posted about this on Corvette Forum, and several people led me here. I figured you guys might want to see this, and offer some advice.

My car was involved in a situation where powder coat paint leaked from a building exhaust fan, landed on my car, and the sun baked it on. I know this sounds weird, but believe me, it happened. The building is a painting facility and has lots of loose powder on thie inside from the operation. Some of it managed to get out, and the wind carried it across a parking lot where my car was.

To get it off, the guy detailing it used a clay bar. It was stuck pretty good, so after dragging the clay bar all over the entire car, the clear looked like someone had taken scotchbrite to it. It was very bad. I'm not sure if he used any type of lubricant or remover to lubricate and facilitate the removal of the stuck on powder.

This first attempt was apparently hidden with the fillers of polish or glaze, because after it rained on the car a few times I started to see the scratches from the claying.

The job was then redone a second time. to fix the claying marks. The detailer came back and supposedly used a light compound to get the scratches out, then a swirl remover, with a rotary buffer.

At first, it looked like the guy did a decent job, but it still didn't look as good as it did before this all happened. I could still slightly see some of the clay bar scratches. Also, I thought I might have seen a slight hologram, but nothing bad. He then used a wax..so anything that the buffer did was probably hidden.

First of all, I don't know what he used as products. From looking at the stuff he had on the shelf, I assume it was either a PRO product or something from AutoMagic. Since he was putting the product into those little PRO detailing bottles, the ones that can be labeled with a marker, I have no idea what he was using.

Second, He did the whole entire job in about two hours..washing, drying, cutting, removing swirls, and waxing. No washing in between steps. Seems like a very rushed job to me, especially when trying to get the scratches out that were there. He also did not focus on one panel at a time; he simply went around the whole car repeatedly.

I did see the wax and have identified it. This is it:
PRO Car Beauty Products: W-41 YELLOW WAX™ PASTE

Now, fast forward to a week after this second "detail"

I went out and checked it out. the car had been sitting in the driveway (I don't have a garage) for about four days. Even through the dust that had now settled on the car, the holograms were unbelievable. It lookes so bad I am embarrassed about it. I decided to wash the car with dishwashing liquid in an effort to possibly cut off this wax the detailer put on. I knew this would expose more of the problems.

What I found shocked me, and anybody else who has seen it.

2012-09-20_17-27-14_849_zps6124cbf7.jpg


2012-09-20_17-27-23_588_zpsd6c50048.jpg


2012-09-20_17-29-26_235_zpseb94fe19.jpg


2012-09-20_17-30-36_939_zpscf8c616f.jpg


2012-09-20_17-29-46_661_zps166e711e.jpg


Now, for my questions.

1.Obviously, this is going to take professional paint correction to fix. I have been on the phone with several detailers, and have gotten some very good advice. I understand the process well now, and am just trying to figure out what to do next.

This is a very delicate situation because of the circumstances around it. Feel free to reply to this thread with any concerns you may have or what it might take to fix it. However, as far as the rest of the story about what actually happened, please send me a pm.

At this point, before I take another step, I think it is smart to get the paint thickness tested. I am having trouble finding anyone local who has one of the ultrasonic testers for fiberglass panels.

Thanks
 
Sorry to see your situation. I hate seeing stories where these hack detailers rush through the job and say it's done.

It will take a some polishing to remove what has been done to the paint, but it can be done. I would post the detailer you are looking to go to on here and have the members here let you know what they think. The last thing you want is to go to another hack that will just put more damage into your paint.

I would definitely get the thickness checked as the previous detailer probably brought that thickness down quite a bit.
 
Yes that is a job .the paint may be fixed only if the clear coat is not gone due to the previous "detailer" .wash the claybar it then do a light polish or light compound be careful cause you can go through the clearcoat .you car is not the worst I have seen .
 
Realistically, the products that he was likely using (Chock full of fillers) and the fact that the job only took 2 hours suggests that he really didn't remove too much clear. These Corvettes have some really hard clear that takes a lot of compounding to level scratches out of. Sure you've lost some clear coat, but I seriously doubt that it is nearly gone. It generally takes about 2 hours just to level the clear on a Corvette hood let alone the whole car.

Sorry to see you have to go through this with the average detail hack. In one respect it upsets me to see this type of work as the industry standards. But it goes to show the difference between an average production detail and a custom paint correction. Threads like this should also reflect the cost difference between the two services. (or the service vs. the dis-service that you got.)

Production work is generally cheap and custom work "done by a detailer who knows his worth" is very expensive.
 
Second, He did the whole entire job in about two hours..washing, drying, cutting, removing swirls, and waxing. No washing in between steps. Seems like a very rushed job to me, especially when trying to get the scratches out that were there. He also did not focus on one panel at a time; he simply went around the whole car repeatedly.

The fastest system to remove swirls and leave a decent looking finish on black FACTORY paint is the Meguiar's DA Microfiber Correction System, see what I did using this system here,


2006 Mustang GT Convertible - Meguiar’s DA Microfiber Polishing System



Mustangs are beautiful cars but not when the paint shimmers with swirls... the paint is supposed to shimmer with a swirl-free shine....
Horrendous002.jpg



Here are the end results...
Horrendous008.jpg



I did the above in about 6 hours not including washing and drying...



Now, for my questions.

1.Obviously, this is going to take professional paint correction to fix. I have been on the phone with several detailers, and have gotten some very good advice. I understand the process well now, and am just trying to figure out what to do next.


My how-to book tells you how to fix this as do multiple articles and videos on our forum.

You have two choices,

1. Purchase a DA Polisher and learn to do it yourself

2. Hire a detailer that actually knows what they are doing​


If you want to hire a guy, start a thread in the Off Topic forum like this guy did,

WANTED: Pro Detailer in Las Vegas


If you're new to detailing, here's my advice. If you don't want to make this your new hobby hire a qualified person to fix the damage AND take care of the car for you.

If you want to learn how to do it yourself then only tackle a single panel a weekend so you don't burn out.

Buffing out an entire car in one day is a LOT of work even for an experienced professional. Tackling just a single panel a day from start to finish, that is,

  • The correction step
  • The polishing step
  • The waxing step


Will still take a Newbie about 4 hours from start to finish. I've helped a lot of Corvette owners buff out their own cars and when they are "older" I always recommend tackling the project panel at a time.


Let us know what you want to do, sorry to hear of your Horror-Story I can guarantee you you're not alone in your experience.


:)
 
Welcome from Memphis

That looks like a 2 hour detail. What part of Alabama are you in?
 
I highly recommend contacting Bryan Burnworth @ Peachstate Detailing in Atlanta, GA. He stays booked several weeks out but I guarantee you it will be worth the wait and the money spent.
 
The fastest system to remove swirls and leave a decent looking finish on black FACTORY paint is the Meguiar's DA Microfiber Correction System, see what I did using this system here,


2006 Mustang GT Convertible - Meguiar’s DA Microfiber Polishing System



Mustangs are beautiful cars but not when the paint shimmers with swirls... the paint is supposed to shimmer with a swirl-free shine....
Horrendous002.jpg



Here are the end results...
Horrendous008.jpg



I did the above in about 6 hours not including washing and drying...






My how-to book tells you how to fix this as do multiple articles and videos on our forum.

You have two choices,
1. Purchase a DA Polisher and learn to do it yourself

2. Hire a detailer that actually knows what they are doing​
If you want to hire a guy, start a thread in the Off Topic forum like this guy did,

WANTED: Pro Detailer in Las Vegas


If you're new to detailing, here's my advice. If you don't want to make this your new hobby hire a qualified person to fix the damage AND take care of the car for you.

If you want to learn how to do it yourself then only tackle a single panel a weekend so you don't burn out.

Buffing out an entire car in one day is a LOT of work even for an experienced professional. Tackling just a single panel a day from start to finish, that is,


  • The correction step
  • The polishing step
  • The waxing step



Will still take a Newbie about 4 hours from start to finish. I've helped a lot of Corvette owners buff out their own cars and when they are "older" I always recommend tackling the project panel at a time.


Let us know what you want to do, sorry to hear of your Horror-Story I can guarantee you you're not alone in your experience.


:)
I second this very sound advice..:xyxthumbs: Mike was the guy who I learned from in the beginning and am still learning from today!!
 
I see Mike responded with very sound advice while I was typing. :D
 
I'm a little north of Montgomery, AL.

Brian Burnworth has already been suggested. I am interested in talking with him. He may be the only one nearby who has a thickness tester that will do my composite panels..

This is not the original paint. About 90% of the car was repainted last year after a collsion with an animal. I actually talked to the painter who painted the car today, and I can't remember the paint manufacturer the body shop uses. He did say that it was a 2 coat high solids clear.

He also showed concern about going any further, given the situation. He agreed that getting it tested would probably be a good idea.
 
I second this very sound advice..:xyxthumbs: Mike was the guy who I learned from in the beginning and am still learning from today!!

Agreed. This man will NOT lead you astray. Mike is beyond knowledgeable and one of the go-to guys in the industry. I'm sorry what happened with that detailer :|. It's a shame that someone can let that leave their possession and feel okay with it. Being that it was repainted I think should work in your favor. It may also mean that the clear is not as hard as the OEM. Certainly keep us updated.
 
If I were you I would get a DA and fix it myself. Those holograms are easy to remove
 
If I were you I would get a DA and fix it myself. Those holograms are easy to remove


While I agree, I do meet people that simply don't want "car detailing" to be their new hobby... the key either way, (fix it yourself or hire a qualified person to do it for you), is to then take care of the finish afterwards via very carefully washing and drying and regular maintenance of whatever it is you end up using for an LSP

"Find something you like and use it often"


As for doing it yourself... I wrote this just the other day...


It's not that hard...


Note these people are not just "learning" on daily drivers aka new cars, they're learning on someone's "toys" or Special Interest Vehicles. More risk for me, more fun for them...



In the below live broadcast I show a 15 year old boy how to machine polish

Live Broadcast Video - 1965 Plymouth Valiant - Extreme Makeover

1965Plymouth034.jpg





And in this one I show a 21 year old girl how to machine polish

Video & Pictures: 1965 Fastback Mustang - Gtechniq EXO Show Car Makeover!

Trista working with the rest of the team to machine polish this 1965 Mustang Fastback 2+2
TristaBuffingFortheFirstTime001.jpg



Trista removing swirls on a show car...

TristaBuffingFortheFirstTime002.jpg




And in this one I show a 80 year old man and a young lady and here boyfriend how to machine polish for their first time...

Video and Pictures - Two 1967 Camaro's - Show Car Makeovers!


CamaroNight001.jpg


CamaroNight002.jpg



PLUS you have everyone on this forum to help you along the way...

:xyxthumbs:
 
Thanks for the great advice Mike, and everyone else.

It isn't that I don't want to learn to do it myself, It's just that I am stuck in a situation right now that is out of my control (at least for the time being).

I have a rotary buffer, a wool pad, a black waffle 3M pad, and some Presta cutting compounds. I actually have two compounds; one is an aggressive cutting and the other is cleaner glaze. I've done some work on some vehicles I've had in the past after wet sanding, but I am not comfortable doing anything to my car. Given the details of the situation I am in, I don't think it is a good idea either, considering someone else could be liable for the damage.

Somebody else on Corvetteforum recommended that if I were to try and fix this myself, I should pick up one of the kits which contains the 7424 orbital (I think that is the right number). He said it comes in a kit and is very easy to learn to use. I am very interested in doing this, but just not at the moment. I do realize that the days of running a rotary are still around, but that one of these smaller, more manageable oribitals would be easier and safer to use. I know I would like the smaller pad for sure, because the big 9 or 10" pad spinning is very hard to control from what I remember.

I was given my two options of what the company would do to fix this yesterday.

1. Take it back to their guy and let him keep trying. I do not like this idea at all, especially when I have had about four or five professional detailers tell me that is not a good idea.

2. Take it somewhere else, but then I have to sign a waiver stating that it is not the company's problem anymore. Since they will have no control over where I take it, they want my signature.

I do think this is fair, but it just kind of leaves me in a bad spot either way.

My main concern right now is getting my clear thickness checked before I make a decsion on what to do. I think this is smart, and I am in no hurry. Finding one of these testers that does composite panels has been a real problem, as not many detailers have them.

I talked to Bryan Burnworth yesterday, and he may be willing to check it. I'm just waiting on him to get back with me at a time that is good for him.
 
I was given my two options of what the company would do to fix this yesterday.

1. Take it back to their guy and let him keep trying. I do not like this idea at all, especially when I have had about four or five professional detailers tell me that is not a good idea.


Here's something I've been posting for over 10 years now and telling people before that because discussion forums weren't invented yet...


If the person couldn't do it right the first time what's changed that will enable them to do it right the second time?

Answer: Nothing.

Most of the time the person will do their best but it's not about intentions, it's the tools, pads, chemicals and training they're using and it's all wrong.

Avoid option 1. Tell the company to send the guy to my next boot camp class in January so they don't have problems.


2. Take it somewhere else, but then I have to sign a waiver stating that it is not the company's problem anymore. Since they will have no control over where I take it, they want my signature.

I do think this is fair, but it just kind of leaves me in a bad spot either way.

Option 2 is the right direction and then with some help from our forum your car will get fixed the right way.



My main concern right now is getting my clear thickness checked before I make a decision on what to do. I think this is smart, and I am in no hurry. Finding one of these testers that does composite panels has been a real problem, as not many detailers have them.

I talked to Bryan Burnworth yesterday, and he may be willing to check it. I'm just waiting on him to get back with me at a time that is good for him.

You have two choices,

  1. Have the car re-detailed
  2. Have the car re-painted

This is another topic I rant and rave about and that is when a detailer does it wrong the first time he removes paint.

Doing it a second time will also remove some paint.

The owner of the car is the loser. Factory paint is thin to start with and that's why it's such a crime for untrained hack detailers to "touch" anyone else's car.


Whoever does the work needs to,

"Use the least aggressive product to get the job done"

Regardless of how thick or thin the paint currently is. That is the only option as it relates to re-detailing the car.


This is called a "Horror-Story". Just another horror story on a detailing discussion forum.

I would e-mail the link to this thread to the owner of the company that did the damage.


:)
 
Mike, I would appreciate the opportunity to talk with you over the phone about this. If you wouldn't mind speaking with me about this, please pm me a phone number and a good time to call.

Thanks
 
I'm not sure if Mike was offering this or not, but it seems to me you should take a couple days vacation and drive down to Autogeek and offer your car up for a class and have the crew fix it up for you!
 
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