is it just me or...

[ride5150]

is a polishing step after a compounding step really necessary? (when using a non-diminishing-abrasive) maybe its just on my car, but i see zero difference if i use m105 on an orange pad alone, or use m105 on an orange pad and follow up with m205 on a white pad. they look absolutely identical. i am using a GG DA polisher.

ive read some posts where guys use a compound (m105), a polish(m205), another polish(po85), and another polish(ultrafina). is that all really necessary? im sure it differs from car to car, but on my black honda m105 finishes down just as well as m105 on a white pad.

also, ive noticed that its extremely difficult to wipe up m105 residue after im done compounding. it seems that as soon as the surface heats up a little from the pad spinning, the m105 becomes like adhesive residue. im priming my pad with ONR diluted 1:16 as a quick exterior detailer, maybe its contributing to the m105 residue becoming hard to remove? advice?

thanks for the replies in advance

 

[Ted S.]

Perhaps the finer polishes help diminish the micromarring you don't see?

 

[silverfox]

It's just you... Everybody here is crazy... Crazy about detailing thier cars over and over whether needed or not, their lawn mowers in the winter, their wive's toe nails. It's a sickness I tell you... A sickness...!!!

You are too sane for this forum.

 

[tuscarora dave]

It's just you... Everybody here is crazy... Crazy about detailing thier cars over and over whether needed or not, their lawn mowers in the winter, their wive's toe nails. It's a sickness I tell you... A sickness...!!!

You are too sane for this forum.

Good answer, I was going to say the same thing.

 

[BobbyG]

Beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder.

Many products finish up nicely alone especially when the cut density of the pad is reduced. This is why allot of folks use 1-Step products because it gives them just the right balance of correction and gloss.

 

[PPLd]

I have done a similar comparison with D300 DA Compound on orange pad, and D300 followed by SwirlX on white pad.
After using Swirl X, the metal flakes are poping out from the paint like sparkling diamonds! (alright maybe I exaggerated it a bit...)
what I mean is, while Swirl X is rich in oils, the difference may be subtle, but all of these contribute to the result you are going to achieve.

 

[FUNX650]

OP....

Compounding almost always ensures leaving swirls. Further use of swirl remover polishes will remove those swirls with the proper technique. Some folks do use 85rd or ultrafina(ultrafine) to remove even more micro-marring ("jeweling"). Each person has their own recipe for detailing, though. Do you use a "swirl-finder light"?
Everyone, including me, has differing opinions; but, as always, do what you have found works best for you.

he metal flakes are poping out from the paint like sparkling diamonds!

I once worked with a older gentleman that stated, and required of me, to make the paint look like:
"A diamond in a goat's arse"!

I never asked him how he came about this expression, or, never wished to experiment to find out for myself, either!!

Bob

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

but on my black honda m105 finishes down just as well as m105 on a white pad.

How are you doing your comparison testing? Are you taping off with painter's tape, dedicated sections so that there's a very definitive line between your test sections?

Normally you would want to use a thin strip of tape on a horizontal surface and then do one test to one side and one test to the other side so that after you apply and then wipe off the product residue you can stand over the two test section, looking down on them and then inspect using different light sources, for example bright overhead sunlight and a Brinkmann Swirl Finder Light.

Also, do you chemically strip the paint and then inspect or are you just inspecting after product wipe-off?

Just some food for thought...

When Meguiar's introduced the new Super Micro Abrasive Technology with M86 Cut & Polish Cream, they really raised the bar for cutting AND finishing for aggressive compounds.

The SMAT Pack - Everything you ever wanted to know about Meguiar's SMAT products...

Excerpt...

SMAT = Super Micro Abrasive Technology
SMAT products use Unigrit Abrasives for a controlled, even cutting action. There is one exception to the below and that is M95 Super Cut Compound. While the primary cutting ability of M95 comes from SMAT, it does also contain some diminishing abrasives but because the primary performance of it's cutting ability is due to SMAT it is included in the the SMAT category.


SMAT Timeline
Below is a list of all the current SMAT product in the order in which they were introduced to the market...

• October, 2006 - M86 Cut & Polish Cream
• December, 2007 - M105 Ultra Cut Compound
• December, 2007 - M95 Speed Cut Compound
• April, 2008 - D151 Paint Reconditioning Cream
• November, 2008 - M105 Ultra Cut Compound - New Formula: DA Polisher Approved
• November, 2008 - M205 Ultra Finishing Polish
• November, 2008 - Ultimate Compound
• November, 2008 - SwirlX
• November, 2008 - ScratchX - New & Improved with SMAT

If you're not seeing any difference that's just a testimony to the chemist behind the abrasive technology.

How well any paint care product line works always comes down to the abrasive technology being used the the chemist behind the formulas. It's as simple as that.

also, ive noticed that its extremely difficult to wipe up m105 residue after im done compounding. it seems that as soon as the surface heats up a little from the pad spinning, the m105 becomes like adhesive residue.

Here's a tip... from something I posted here last week, the below topic dealt with tips and techniques for using a rotary buffer but the tips about cleaning your pads often or switching to a clean, dry pad apply when using any tool.


Suggestions Paint Correction

Most important --> Clean your pads often and always wipe off any spent residue from a panel before adding fresh product.

Notice how when you first start with a clean, dry pad how easy it is to buff, then notice how as you continue buffing how actually guiding the rotary buffer over the paint becomes more difficult and the residue can become more difficult to wipe off. This happens as your pads become wet with product and get a build-up of residue in them and on the working face.

All you have to do is switch to a fresh clean, dry pad and notice how it gets easy to buff again, this is just the nature of the beast. To make buffing as easy as possible when you have a limited number of buffing pads... clean your pads often...

Cleaning your pads or switching to a clean, dry pad won't solve all the issues with difficult wipe-off characteristic to M105 but it will help as it helps with any machine applied product.


There's a chapter in my first e-book called,

How to carefully wipe off compounds, polishes and waxes by hand
Excerpt...

Compounds and Polishes --> Wipe off immediately after buffing
The most important factor for removing compounds and polishes is to wipe them off immediately after you turn the polisher off and the leftover residues are still a wet film.

If you wipe these types of residues off while they are still wet, (at least to some level), the wetness acts to lubricate the surface during wipe-off. Wet-wipe-off is less aggressive than dry-wipe-off when it comes to these types of products.

When using the wet buffing technique, that is, not buffing to a dry buff when using compounds and polishes. If you're using that technique, then immediately after you buff a section, turn your polisher off, allow the pad to stop spinning and then set the polisher aside. You should have a clean, dry microfiber towel nearby so you can quickly start wiping the leftover compound or polish residue off the paint.

Big Picture…
When it's time to wipe any product off the paint, your job is to remove it without struggling and without inflicting toweling marks back into the paint.

The words toweling marks are a nice way of saying light or shallow swirls and scratches from pushing too hard with your wiping towel or in other words struggling with your wiping towel against the paint as you're trying to remove something that's not coming off easily.

 

[ride5150]

How are you doing your comparison testing? Are you taping off with painter's tape, dedicated sections so that there's a very definitive line between your test sections?

Normally you would want to use a thin strip of tape on a horizontal surface and then do one test to one side and one test to the other side so that after you apply and then wipe off the product residue you can stand over the two test section, looking down on them and then inspect using different light sources, for example bright overhead sunlight and a Brinkmann Swirl Finder Light.

Also, do you chemically strip the paint and then inspect or are you just inspecting after product wipe-off?

Just some food for thought...

When Meguiar's introduced the new Super Micro Abrasive Technology with M86 Cut & Polish Cream, they really raised the bar for cutting AND finishing for aggressive compounds.

The SMAT Pack - Everything you ever wanted to know about Meguiar's SMAT products...

Excerpt...




If you're not seeing any difference that's just a testimony to the chemist behind the abrasive technology.

How well any paint care product line works always comes down to the abrasive technology being used the the chemist behind the formulas. It's as simple as that.





Here's a tip... from something I posted here last week, the below topic dealt with tips and techniques for using a rotary buffer but the tips about cleaning your pads often or switching to a clean, dry pad apply when using any tool.


Suggestions Paint Correction





Cleaning your pads or switching to a clean, dry pad won't solve all the issues with difficult wipe-off characteristic to M105 but it will help as it helps with any machine applied product.


There's a chapter in my first e-book called,

How to carefully wipe off compounds, polishes and waxes by hand
Excerpt...

thanks for the reply. yes, i am using painters tape to do a comparison but i did not chemically strip the paint, i just wiped away. i was using the lights in my garage to inspect and found no difference. after i layed a layer of carnauba (megs #26) on a small section of the hood i noticed that it deepened the color. now im wondering if m150 wouldve deepened the color, at nighttime in my garage i would not have been able to notice this. ill test out the m205 and see if it helps enhance color.

 

[ScottB]

I think alot of the newer polishes finish down quite well, but additional gloss and reflection along with any light marring can be removed with the proper finishing polish.

 

[J504]

I've noticed the same thing as you ride5150. It was the first time i used m105 and m205 with white pad looked no different. However i'm sure if i had better lighting i probably would have found some micromarring. I went over it with m205 anyways. It might have helped a little because I see no micro marring in direct sun light.

My paint has metal flakes so it might help hide any micro marring in direct sunlight.