I have a customer who has an all original Plymouth Superbird. It has 14,000 miles on it and still has all the grease marks from the factory. He parked it in his building and the plywood above the car had sap come out of it and landed on the car. He wants me to detail his car for him but with the value this car has and the fact the sap is on the Superbird decal I am trying to find the safest way to remove the sap without damaging the decal. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
Mike I Need Your Help
- Thread starter DP 08 GXP
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BobbyG
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- Dec 29, 2009
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WOW, an original Plymouth Superbird with 14,000 miles on it. I suspect we're talking about a collectors item with substantial value....:wow:
Do you have any photos?
How much sap?
How long has it been on there?
If the sap is relatively new, I would use a hair dryer and soften it then carefully remove it with a plastic razor blade. Once most of it's removed dampen a cloth with turpentine and gently rub the area.
Turpentine is a mild solvent and a wood product. I've had great results dissolving sap or pine pitch so it should work well for you...
Do you have any photos?
How much sap?
How long has it been on there?
If the sap is relatively new, I would use a hair dryer and soften it then carefully remove it with a plastic razor blade. Once most of it's removed dampen a cloth with turpentine and gently rub the area.
Turpentine is a mild solvent and a wood product. I've had great results dissolving sap or pine pitch so it should work well for you...
57BORNTORUN
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Does anyone know why all Superbirds have vinyl tops?
allenk4
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- Mar 12, 2013
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I would solicit assistance from people who have actually worked on this specific year, make and model and have intimate knowledge.
This Forum is great, but if it were me, I would seek counsel from several sources that have actually worked on this specific vehicle.
Too much is at stake here.
This Forum is great, but if it were me, I would seek counsel from several sources that have actually worked on this specific vehicle.
Too much is at stake here.
Sizzle Chest
Well-known member
- Apr 3, 2011
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57BORN:
All SuperBirds were required to have vinyl tops (black) so as to avoid the high cost of finish work to the roof area around the rear window conversion area before paint could be applied. All cars came equipped with Boar Grain vinyl roofs. The rear window was never tinted, even if the rest of the glass in the car was.
All SuperBirds were required to have vinyl tops (black) so as to avoid the high cost of finish work to the roof area around the rear window conversion area before paint could be applied. All cars came equipped with Boar Grain vinyl roofs. The rear window was never tinted, even if the rest of the glass in the car was.
57BORNTORUN
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You are right but why did`nt they finish the roof so as to not have the vinyl tops?
Mike lambert
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91 percent alcohol on a cloth,dab it and it will come right off. Relax about the value of the car! I do a lot of cars in the 6 and 7 figure range. Common sense and ember it is just a car with paint that needs polishing done responsibly , test spot and the least aggressive method to get where yo want. And have fun!
- Thread starter
- #9
He said it is in the $100k range. I don't know the exact length it has been on the paint and decal but I know it isn't fresh. I have to work on his Harley in a few weeks so I will snap some pictures at that point and post them. During my search I saw that Mike recommended using a towel with warm water to dissolve the sap. Has anyone tried this method?
BobbyG
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I've heard of using warm or hot water to warm an area but wasn't aware it dissolved tree sap. I've also used a cloth with hot water to soften up bird crap...
Mike Phillips
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Mike Phillips
Active member
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First, for those that might not be 100% aware of what a Plymouth Superbird is, they were only built for one year and that was in 1970.
From Wikipedia
1970 Plymouth Superbird
Manufacturer: Chrysler Corporation
Production: 1970
Assembly: Detroit, Michigan
Body and chassis class: Muscle Car
Body style: 2-door coupe
Layout: FR layout
Platform: B-body
Related
Plymouth Road Runner
Dodge Charger Daytona
Powertrain
Engine
426 Hemi V8
440 Super Commando V8
440 Super Commando Six Barrel V8
Transmission
4-speed manual
3-speed or 2-speed automatic
Dimensions
Wheelbase 117.0 in (2,972 mm)
Length 221 in (5,613 mm)[1]
Curb weight 3,841 lb (1,742 kg)[2]
The short-lived Plymouth Road Runner Superbird was a highly modified version of the Plymouth Road Runner with well-known graphics and horn.
It was the factory's follow up stock car racing design for the 1970 season to the Dodge Charger Daytona of 1969, and incorporated many engineering changes and modifications (both minor and major) garnered from the Daytona's season in competition on the track.
The car's primary rival was the Ford Torino Talladega, which in itself was a direct response to the Mopar aero car. It has also been speculated one motivating factor in the production of the car was to lure Richard Petty back to Plymouth.
Both of the Mopar aero cars famously featured a protruding, aerodynamic nosecone, a high-mounted rear wing and, in the case of the Superbird, a horn which mimicked the Road Runner cartoon character.
From Wikipedia
1970 Plymouth Superbird
Manufacturer: Chrysler Corporation
Production: 1970
Assembly: Detroit, Michigan
Body and chassis class: Muscle Car
Body style: 2-door coupe
Layout: FR layout
Platform: B-body
Related
Plymouth Road Runner
Dodge Charger Daytona
Powertrain
Engine
426 Hemi V8
440 Super Commando V8
440 Super Commando Six Barrel V8
Transmission
4-speed manual
3-speed or 2-speed automatic
Dimensions
Wheelbase 117.0 in (2,972 mm)
Length 221 in (5,613 mm)[1]
Curb weight 3,841 lb (1,742 kg)[2]
The short-lived Plymouth Road Runner Superbird was a highly modified version of the Plymouth Road Runner with well-known graphics and horn.
It was the factory's follow up stock car racing design for the 1970 season to the Dodge Charger Daytona of 1969, and incorporated many engineering changes and modifications (both minor and major) garnered from the Daytona's season in competition on the track.
The car's primary rival was the Ford Torino Talladega, which in itself was a direct response to the Mopar aero car. It has also been speculated one motivating factor in the production of the car was to lure Richard Petty back to Plymouth.
Both of the Mopar aero cars famously featured a protruding, aerodynamic nosecone, a high-mounted rear wing and, in the case of the Superbird, a horn which mimicked the Road Runner cartoon character.
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
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Here's a few pictures of what these cars look like.... I personally have only worked on one in my life.
:xyxthumbs:
:xyxthumbs:
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
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Okay back to your original post that I bolded the key points....
You've already received some good advice as to how to remove sap and likely any of these methods will work.
When you say the sap has landed on the Superbird decal, do you mean the actual Roadrunner bird decal?
Or this entire area? Which is a horizontal section of the car sap would fall onto?
You've already received some good advice as to how to remove sap and likely any of these methods will work.
When you say the sap has landed on the Superbird decal, do you mean the actual Roadrunner bird decal?
Or this entire area? Which is a horizontal section of the car sap would fall onto?
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
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Regardless of the area, if you want to try a really safe way before rubbing any chemical to the area or chipping at the sap with something like a plastic razor blade, then here's a suggestion.
Water
Water is very safe. It's also a universal solvent in that just about anything when exposed to water long enough will tend to disintegrate verses become stronger.
The key for something like this is to keep the water on the sap and you can do this with a microfiber towel. I'd suggest using warm water too.
Take a clean microfiber polishing cloth, fold it four ways to create a thick, plush wiping cloth.
Wet the cloth with water until the entire cloth is saturated but not to the point where water is running down the hood. The idea is to have plenty of water present to soak into the dried bird dropping.
Then let it sit.
You could also try keeping the water warm using a hair blow dry or a heating pad.
The idea being to soften the sap to make it easier to remove without damaging the underlying surface or marring it in any way.
The above is the safest approach I can think of and there are certainly many more ways to approach this but each other method starts to bring more potential for problems with it.
So you asked for the safest way and the above I think qualifies.
Besides the above, rubbing like Bobby said with some turpentine, which is a solvent made from the sap taken from Pine Trees, (I think), plus a plastic razor blade should work.
Or like Mike Lambert said, some IPA, the strongest available is 91% from any drug store and then dab a microfiber towel with this and gently rub on the sap marks.
Here's the deal about sap, because the trees it comes from are all different... different types of sap break down differently. Some will re-liquefy with water and some won't.
You don't know what you can do until you try.
In this example you state,
I've worked in a Plywood Mill in Oregon, Simpson's to be exact. I've performed every aspect involved in making a sheet of plywood from pulling on a Green Chain to running the saws that trim and finish the final piece. In-between all these functions I've also been the Glue Mixer and worked in the lay-up of making plywood.
It's possible what dripped off the plywood is sap and it's possible what dripped off the plywood is glue or resin. If it's amber or a clear yellow or gold it's probably sap and if it's reddish in color that's probably glue.
Can you take a picture?
Hope the above helps....
Water
Water is very safe. It's also a universal solvent in that just about anything when exposed to water long enough will tend to disintegrate verses become stronger.
The key for something like this is to keep the water on the sap and you can do this with a microfiber towel. I'd suggest using warm water too.
Take a clean microfiber polishing cloth, fold it four ways to create a thick, plush wiping cloth.
Wet the cloth with water until the entire cloth is saturated but not to the point where water is running down the hood. The idea is to have plenty of water present to soak into the dried bird dropping.
Then let it sit.
You could also try keeping the water warm using a hair blow dry or a heating pad.
The idea being to soften the sap to make it easier to remove without damaging the underlying surface or marring it in any way.
The above is the safest approach I can think of and there are certainly many more ways to approach this but each other method starts to bring more potential for problems with it.
So you asked for the safest way and the above I think qualifies.
Besides the above, rubbing like Bobby said with some turpentine, which is a solvent made from the sap taken from Pine Trees, (I think), plus a plastic razor blade should work.
Or like Mike Lambert said, some IPA, the strongest available is 91% from any drug store and then dab a microfiber towel with this and gently rub on the sap marks.
Here's the deal about sap, because the trees it comes from are all different... different types of sap break down differently. Some will re-liquefy with water and some won't.
You don't know what you can do until you try.
In this example you state,
DP )* GXP said:
I've worked in a Plywood Mill in Oregon, Simpson's to be exact. I've performed every aspect involved in making a sheet of plywood from pulling on a Green Chain to running the saws that trim and finish the final piece. In-between all these functions I've also been the Glue Mixer and worked in the lay-up of making plywood.
It's possible what dripped off the plywood is sap and it's possible what dripped off the plywood is glue or resin. If it's amber or a clear yellow or gold it's probably sap and if it's reddish in color that's probably glue.
Can you take a picture?
Hope the above helps....
Dogfather
New member
- Sep 7, 2012
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Told ya.
bulldog shine
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- Jun 20, 2009
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Superbirds are my dream cars. Value depends on the powerplant (426 Hemi, 440 Super Commando with different carburetor configuations). If I remember correctly they are the first car in NASCAR to run over 200 m.p.h.. The back wings were strong enough to stand on.
Have fun I am green with envy.
Have fun I am green with envy.
- Thread starter
- #18
Thanks for all the info Mike. From what he showed me it was on the Road Runner decal but I am sure it is on other parts. He didn't uncover the whole thing.
When I go to work on his Harley I will snap some pictures and also try a warm towel with water while I work on the bike to see what that does. I am pretty sure it was clear when I saw it.
This will definitely be a nerve racking detail but I have no doubt I'll be able to knock it out. I am also guessing since the car has the factory paint it is a single stage paint? It is the blue color.
When I go to work on his Harley I will snap some pictures and also try a warm towel with water while I work on the bike to see what that does. I am pretty sure it was clear when I saw it.
This will definitely be a nerve racking detail but I have no doubt I'll be able to knock it out. I am also guessing since the car has the factory paint it is a single stage paint? It is the blue color.
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
- 51,004
- 7
Yes. Single stage enamel is my guess.
Definitely get a bottle of #7 Show Car Glaze...
Looking forward to this project you lucky dog!
:dblthumb2:
PhoenixLLC
New member
- Mar 28, 2014
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I live in the country and everyone has tall pines here.I get sap calls more often than I want to admit.I use Mikes method of Micro towel with a twist.I lay the towel over the sap forming around the sap very gentle like till im sure of the exact spot to hit and take my VX5000 and shoot only the sap area with steam multiple times while softly touching the sap area to see how much its softened.Eventually it goes right into the microfiber towel,I very slowly bring the surrounding towel together trying to make the center point the area of sap and lift away.It leaves very little left on the surface to deal with next but there is always a residual to be handle after.The steam is your friend and a great first option to any solvent.
Cheers
Cheers