Need a little help!

[Rossu]

Sounds like you need a new fine polish to me. The way I read it was that the marring was there BEFORE you used the M21. 3M products are not talked about much here and when they are it’s about how they use old abrasive technology. VW paint can be on the hard side which in my experience can lead to marring if the right abrasives are not used. Mike Phillips swears the abrasive is the number one thing you need to get right in polishing. I would use the Rupes yellow polish with the Rupes yellow pad, it’s a proven combination. If it is your LSP and I read it wrong, change LSPs. Find something that works and keep using it.

Could you define LSP for me please? I use Fine COMPOUND as a polish. So maybe replace that with the 3M ultra fine polish, as right now i'm using something that is basically a compound. And i am seriously considering switching to full meguiars - pads and compounds/polishes. But i see people using the 3m fine compound on a rotary as a finisher, and get awesome results.
And the VW in question had been repainted on several occasions in the past. Hardly any original paint on it.

 

[SWETM]

It could be that you are experience a very soft paint. That is able to be marred with a mf towel. So a gentle approach when you have done the last polish. And if it's on the softer side your combo with fine compound and yellow rupes pad is to aggressive.

If it's the old version of 3M compound and polish they are made for rotary polishers. And you don't get the heat up enough to make the abrasive to break down. If it's Perfect-it polishes I think that they work good on DA too. If you where to switch the compound and polish out. I would look into Sonax Cutmax and Sonax Cut & Finish and Sonax EX04-06 or Sonax Perfect Finish. They are simple to work with and has the cut if needed and an awesome finish. The difference between EX04-06 and Perfect Finish is the 04-06 is made for DA and the PF is for rotary polisher. But if you have a finicky soft paint that is hard to finish the PF is a hidden gem that works great even with a DA.

Hope you get it sorted out. And try to find a great lighting when you have those problem. So you can inspect before and after every step and find what it's that you have problem with.

 

[Goonie75]

Could you define LSP for me please? I use Fine COMPOUND as a polish. So maybe replace that with the 3M ultra fine polish, as right now i'm using something that is basically a compound. And i am seriously considering switching to full meguiars - pads and compounds/polishes. But i see people using the 3m fine compound on a rotary as a finisher, and get awesome results.
And the VW in question had been repainted on several occasions in the past. Hardly any original paint on it.

Last Step Product

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[Rossu]

It could be that you are experience a very soft paint. That is able to be marred with a mf towel. So a gentle approach when you have done the last polish. And if it's on the softer side your combo with fine compound and yellow rupes pad is to aggressive.

If it's the old version of 3M compound and polish they are made for rotary polishers. And you don't get the heat up enough to make the abrasive to break down. If it's Perfect-it polishes I think that they work good on DA too. If you where to switch the compound and polish out. I would look into Sonax Cutmax and Sonax Cut & Finish and Sonax EX04-06 or Sonax Perfect Finish. They are simple to work with and has the cut if needed and an awesome finish. The difference between EX04-06 and Perfect Finish is the 04-06 is made for DA and the PF is for rotary polisher. But if you have a finicky soft paint that is hard to finish the PF is a hidden gem that works great even with a DA.

Hope you get it sorted out. And try to find a great lighting when you have those problem. So you can inspect before and after every step and find what it's that you have problem with.

I'm using the perfect it 2 series. All i can think of right now, is to use Ultra Fine Polish with Rupes white pad, do an IPA wipedown before M21, and use higher grade MF towels. Megs supreme shine ones are the best ones available where im located.

 

[fightnews]

I tested on a deep purple metallic today. Used professional grade silicone remover after polishing and applied m21. Still had light marring on top of the front fender line that i tested on. Not terribly visible, especially for someome who doesn't know what to look for, but still means that i am doing something wrong. M21 applied very thinly with a DA. This crap is getting depressing.

You dont need all that. Dont try to reinvent the wheel here. You can remove that polish with a microfiber alone. No need to wash it or use any special removal product. Nobody does that. Maybe try another wax? Use plenty of clean towels

 

[Rossu]

You dont need all that. Dont try to reinvent the wheel here. You can remove that polish with a microfiber alone. No need to wash it or use any special removal product. Nobody does that. Maybe try another wax? Use plenty of clean towels

I've also used Megs Yellow Wax and Finixa Machine wax. Both yield the same crappy result. So that means i'm doing something wrong. I personally think its a matter of not using polish that's fine enough and that my MF towels are not good enough. Just for giggles, i wiped over one panel with an old t-shirt, using a few long swipes. Holograms everywhere. But what i don't understand is that my towels are extremely soft, and brand new(but quite cheap), how can something so soft cause so severe marring. Is there really that big of a difference between high and low grade MF towels?

 

[ACCLAY]

Brp

 

[FrankS]

I've also used Megs Yellow Wax and Finixa Machine wax. Both yield the same crappy result. So that means i'm doing something wrong. I personally think its a matter of not using polish that's fine enough and that my MF towels are not good enough. Just for giggles, i wiped over one panel with an old t-shirt, using a few long swipes. Holograms everywhere. But what i don't understand is that my towels are extremely soft, and brand new(but quite cheap), how can something so soft cause so severe marring. Is there really that big of a difference between high and low grade MF towels?

There is a difference between high and low grade MF towels.

I have used Costco towels, which some consider to be a lower grade towel and are cheap, successfully for applying waxes, sealants and removing coatings without marring the paint.

Just a few questions about your towels:

1. Do you wash your new towels before using them?
2. How do you wash and dry your towels?
3. Do you wash your towels together with your other laundry?

 

[FrankS]

I've also used Megs Yellow Wax and Finixa Machine wax. Both yield the same crappy result. So that means i'm doing something wrong. I personally think its a matter of not using polish that's fine enough and that my MF towels are not good enough. Just for giggles, i wiped over one panel with an old t-shirt, using a few long swipes. Holograms everywhere. But what i don't understand is that my towels are extremely soft, and brand new(but quite cheap), how can something so soft cause so severe marring. Is there really that big of a difference between high and low grade MF towels?

I have seen scratches or marring from wiping on soft paint or using improper towels but I have yet to see holograms caused by wiping.

Holograms normally come from the unique scratch patterns left behind from using a rotary buffer. Compound, polish and wax residue can also have that hologram affect.

 

[Rossu]

I have seen scratches or marring from wiping on soft paint or using improper towels but I have yet to see holograms caused by wiping.

Holograms normally come from the unique scratch patterns left behind from using a rotary buffer. Compound, polish and wax residue can also have that hologram affect.

Sorry, meant to say marring.
I don't wash new towels prior to using them.
Heading to the garage soon. Going to try using a finer polish with a finer pad to finish, and apply M21 by hand. Just to see if that makes a difference in the finish. I'll snap a pic of the finish too.

 

[SWETM]

I'm using the perfect it 2 series. All i can think of right now, is to use Ultra Fine Polish with Rupes white pad, do an IPA wipedown before M21, and use higher grade MF towels. Megs supreme shine ones are the best ones available where im located.

That sounds a good way to go. I read a little about M21 and it's like a synthetic wax. So apply very thin and a yellow foam pad from meguiars. Let it sit for 15-30min and do a swipe test with the finger and it should swipe clean before you wipe it off. This could also cause the smearing you have gotten if it has not dried fully. Start with wipe it off where you started applying it and follow it that way. And the meguiars mf towels would be great for this. It's very important to have mf towels that suits the different tasks you are doing. Saw that the M21 has some filling ability too. So would be filling light haze from the compound you used if got that. But do it over with the ultra fine polish and rupes white pad would be great so you know you have a great finish to start with.

Report back about how it worked out for you. And Good luck!

 

[itsgn]

Also using higher quality MF towels. And i guess IPA wipedowns would not hurt as well.

Well, if you did "dry" wipedowns - especially that of a (cutting) compound -, that could have very well caused the holograms. I always do wipedowns by spritzing an IPA solution on the surface, because that ensures 1. that there's some lubrication, and I'm not scrubbing the paint with the compound residue and I'm not pushing it into the paint, 2. and that any oils or fillers from the compound (provided it's not water based) gets removed, and I can see the surface as it actually is. (The latter would be useful for you to figure out at what stage you're creating the holograms.)

My preferred dilution ratio is 33%, because I don't like to have tens of bottles for different ratios, but just go with one, and 33% is strong enough to remove any and all kind of contamination that can be dissolved by alcohols, but you can go way below that for compound wipedowns, as lubrication is more important there than strength. Probably as low as 10%, which should be still very effective for that purpose.

 

[JCDetails]

When I've had this happen (Onyx black GMC and black velvet Lincoln MKC) it's been while using cheapo, short nap (harbor freight type) MF towels, or towels that weren't cleaned properly.


A prep wipedown (panel wipe, Gyeon Prep, etc) would also be a good idea but **AFTER** the bulk of the polish residue is removed via mf.

 

[Rossu]

When I've had this happen (Onyx black GMC and black velvet Lincoln MKC) it's been while using cheapo, short nap (harbor freight type) MF towels, or towels that weren't cleaned properly.


A prep wipedown (panel wipe, Gyeon Prep, etc) would also be a good idea but **AFTER** the bulk of the polish residue is removed via mf.

So results after ultrafine pad and polish combo and M21.

View attachment 63829

Still notice some light marring after wiping. So i guess it comes down to the MF towels i use.

 

[itsgn]

So results after ultrafine pad and polish combo and M21.

Not much visible in this tiny picture.

 

[Rossu]

Not much visible in this tiny picture.[/QUOTE

Sorry.