Need help on a rupes or flex!

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

By the way, where should I apply to Mike Phillips physical conditioning program? Man, nice performance!

I hit the gym almost every morning. IF you don't use it you'll lose it...

Wetsanding and buffing out a car from start to finish and capturing it all on video is one of the most rewarding projects I've ever tackled.

I send the link to the video out all the time now to people that contact me and ask me,

What's involved in wetsanding a car?


I just tell them, watch the video. Click on the pause button once in a while. There's a lot of people that "know" the word wetsanding but have no idea what's involved and there's a lot of steps and a lot of work to do it right the first time and it's really a job you don't want to do a second time.

:xyxthumbs:

For the purpose of the topic, after watching the video above, I've ended watching this video again:

Mike Phillips: How to use the Flex 3401 Dual Action Polisher
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Arn_kVH3BVc&noredirect=1

Do you remember the final results you've got just while demonstrating this tool? I would drive my car with just that test spot on the hood as my business card!

The paint came out great. And unlike what I read everyone else always posting about Ceramiclear paints... I don't find them to be overlay hard. In fact they correct as easy as you see in the video as that was done live on camera. In high definition too...

I don't think you can find a scoured Ceramiclear paint job anywhere else on the Internet being fixed and filmed using both the Flex 3401 or a rotary buffer.

Mike used 1.5 speed setting to apply sealant.

To get constant and UNIFORM pad rotation at 1.5 setting is the 'beauty of the Flex', in my opinion.

That's one benefit to gear driven tools.

So purchase what works for you and concentrate on technique. Just a old mans 2 cents.

And very good advice at that Paul...

lol im really confused now...... ok like i said i have never own a polisher/buffer...ROOKIE!

to bad i aint rich or i would buy both lol.. i don't know what to buy....

Attend my January Detailing Boot Camp Class and you'll get to use all the tools before you buy.


Class Info: January Detailing Boot Camp Class

I have both the Flex and Rupes 21 w/5 inch backing plate. I like them both. There are strengths and weaknesses to both machines.

I have a short reach so I like using the Rupes on hood, roof, trunk lid, or any other large flat horizontal surfaces. I use the Flex for the rest.....especially on curvy panels.

As far as time-saving, I really don't see that much difference.

Asking which is better is like asking which would you rather have... a BMW or a Benz. Both machines will get you there.

I do have to give the Rupes a thumb up in one area. I simply not as tired after a long day with the Rupes than I am with the Flex. rops:

Great reply and it's easy for me to see you have actually used both tools from your feedback.


:dblthumb2:

if you aren't in a rush just wait till spring or summer

there will be a few other options being released that are more affordable and work just as well.

Do tell more...



:dblthumb2:

 

[Duck_]

OK so the flex is what I am going with but now what are the best polishes/glaze/ect and pads to go with?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using AG Online

 

[Just02896]

OK so the flex is what I am going with but now what are the best polishes/glaze/ect and pads to go with?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using AG Online

Grab a 6-pack of assorted CCS pads, menzerna FG400, Pf2500, SF4000, and a bottle of WG sealant and go to town!

 

[The Critic]

OK so the flex is what I am going with but now what are the best polishes/glaze/ect and pads to go with?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using AG Online

I have some 5.5" pads on the way, but I suspect that this may be the best combo for the Flex. IMO it walks a bit too much on the 6.5" pads, and doesn't walk at all with the 4" pads....which is why I suspect that 5.5" will be the best balance. Hopefully someone can confirm this...

As for polishes, I like FG400 for compounding and Sonax Perfect Finish for finishing. Everyone is going to have their opinions though.

 

[Mike@DedicatedPerfection]

OK so the flex is what I am going with but now what are the best polishes/glaze/ect and pads to go with?

IMO, the best performing pads are the hybrid line with the 5" offering the best feel and control with the 3401 allowing you to focus on getting stellar results without worrying so much about "the walking effect". As you get used to the machine and work with it the effect will no longer be an issue.

I really enjoy the Menzerna lineup of products which said advice. You really only need 400, 2500, and 4000 to get started.

 

[psnt1ol]

IMO, the best performing pads are the hybrid line with the 5" offering the best feel and control with the 3401 allowing you to focus on getting stellar results without worrying so much about "the walking effect". As you get used to the machine and work with it the effect will no longer be an issue.

I really enjoy the Menzerna lineup of products which said advice. You really only need 400, 2500, and 4000 to get started.

+1 the 5" Hybrid pads is where its at IMO for the Flex...... You can't go wrong with the Menzerna line as stated by Smack.

 

[wrx495]

i know you've already decided on what you want but personally i am waiting for the rupes lhr 12e and i heard the wolfgang line is good for polishes along with ccs pads

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I have some 5.5" pads on the way, but I suspect that this may be the best combo for the Flex. IMO it walks a bit too much on the 6.5" pads, and doesn't walk at all with the 4" pads....which is why I suspect that 5.5" will be the best balance.

Correct. The larger the diameter of the pad the more you'll feel the walking effect if you don't hold the pad flat to the surface.

The smaller the diameter of the pad the less you'll feel the walking effect if you don't hold the pad flat to the surface.

For most panels you always want to hold the pad flat to the surface. This is also why smaller pads are for most cars better as most modern cars have thin section sandwiched between edges, like a fender edge and a raised body line. With larger pads you are soften times forced to buff either on an edge or a body line. Not a good practice.

Hopefully someone can confirm this...

If you read enough posts on this forum since the 4" backing plate and the 5" Hybrid pads were introduced, you'll see a pattern by myself, Mike aka smack as well as others that the best pads to optimize the functionality of the Flex 3401 are the 5" Hybrids.

You get the perfect diameter for most panels.
A thick pad for cushion and conforming (You only need and want THIN pads for PC style tools)
Reduced walking effect if you're not holding the tool so the pad is flat to the surface


All benefits. You just need to purchase the 4" backing plate from Lake Country.

When the tool is set-up like this I call it optimized. See this thread,

Rupes 21 & Flex 3401 Comparison + Detailer's Paint Coating


From post #4


Flex 3401 "optimized"
Next up we'll test out the Flex 3401 "Optimized" with 5" Hybrid pads and Wolfgang polishes. Like the Rupes polisher, this will be the first time Eric has used the Flex 3401. With the Lake Country 4" Backing Plate and 5" Hybrid pads the Flex 3401 is optimized for maximum efficiency and ease of use.

Optimize your Flex 3401...


:dblthumb2:

 

[Tato]

Hello.

All the way I've posted here trying to help you decide like I would (for the Flex), however, when you've made your decision I've asked to myself: 'What about the Rupes?'... How difficult is to choose one over another. Take a look at Mike's last post with the comparison, having one will always make you miss the other.

For the Flex, I would be looking for 4' BP and LC 5' hybrids also, that looks pretty standard nowadays. Just don't ignore the fact you can like and achieve great results with another Pads, I like CCS pads/flat pads, and I'm about to receive MF pads and LC HT pads, for sure every kind of pad will have it's use.

For polishes I would stick with Wolfgang line, Uber for compound, TSR and Finishing Glaze as follow ups.

If you wish, you can also top your work with Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant, don't forget you can get Wolfgang Paintwork Polish Enhancer if you wish to do the ultimate prep. for WG's sealant.

But that's me, remember Smack (and majority of others) are a lot more experienced - take this in consideration.

If you do pretend to use any coating, do not forget to get a Coating Prep. Polish, maybe DP or even the Pinnacle Black Label Cleansing Polish.

Wish you best of luck,

Kind Regards.

 

[281]

I really didn't think a decision would be this hard to make :/

Sent from my DROID RAZR using AG Online

Everyone will share their experience and give you an opinion of what they think. It's really tough to make a decision based on that but in the end, I believe you'll be happy with either machine.

I'm still a rookie but I love my flex with forced rotation/power it gives me. LC 4" backing plate matched with LC 5" Hyrbid pads is the combo to have!

 

[RFulmer]

To keep it simple and not confusing I would recommend the Wolfgang four, the Uber compound, the total swirl remover, the finishing glaze,and the deep gloss paint sealant.

 

[281]

To keep it simple and not confusing I would recommend the Wolfgang four, the Uber compound, the total swirl remover, the finishing glaze,and the deep gloss paint sealant.

+1 :iagree:

 

[Woob]

Rupes Rupes Rupes!

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I'm still a rookie but I love my flex with forced rotation/power it gives me.

LC 4" backing plate matched with LC 5" Hybrid pads is the combo to have!

Flex 3401 + 4" LC Backing Plate + 5" Hybrids = Optimized Swirl Destroyer

To keep it simple and not confusing I would recommend the Wolfgang four,


Uber Compound
Total Swirl Remover
Finishing Glaze
Deep Gloss Paint Sealant.

The Wolfgang Four

Kind of rolls off the tongue and you're right, that combination of products with just about any tool, any pad and even by hand will produce not only show car results but do it consistently across a VERY wide spectrum of paint systems.

Hard paints, soft paints and everything in-between.

Factory OEM paints and aftermarket repaints at your local body shop or custom paint shop.

Single stage and basecoat clearcoat​

For some reason it makes me think of the,

The Fantastic Four

:xyxthumbs:

 

[Tato]

That's it... However, after using a cleansing polish recently (Pinnacle BL Cleansing) I would add WG Paintwork Polish Enhancer (PPE), as a 'joker'. It has many uses, and may increase versatility of you WG 4.

Wolfgang Pre-Wax Polish Enhancer is absolutely fabulous for producing that elusive, show-ready wet-shine look. This polish actually enhances and

Although I've not used PPE (yet), it probably should work as described, and the sensation of a clean paintwork to seal after is second to none, in my opinion.

Worth at least considering it.

Kind Regards.

 

[RFulmer]

Yes but the 4 are for correction and again keeping it simple, the enhancer would be the beginning of the protection step.

Don't mess with "The Wolfgang Four"

 

[cardaddy]

I hit the gym almost every morning. IF you don't use it you'll lose it...

Wetsanding and buffing out a car from start to finish and capturing it all on video is one of the most rewarding projects I've ever tackled.

I'm afraid I both used it AND lost it in the last 24 hours!

We started yesterday at noon and finished this morning at 7:00!

Was one of those, "one thing leads to another" kind of days. Was supposed to be a light buff on a freshly painted / body shop repaired car and an application of PBL glass and paint coatings. Turned into a multi-step complete correction, hood, entire right side and rear bumper covered in swirls, rids, and buffer trails/holograms! (This was all new 2 months ago in a $12K repair.) Then they covered the left side in overspray!

Owner decided to do it all, at least 95% correction, buff the glass, as well as PBL the wheels! Couldn't keep it 2 days so had to stay up all night.

Me hears a bed calling!!!!!!!!!!:help:

 

[Justin M.]

Lots of good info in the thread. I too have been debating over a Flex 3401 or Rupes 21 to take over as my primary tool. Been leaning toward the Flex for the forced rotation feature as I often grow tired of my DA's stalling on curves. Plus, (I think) my existing stash of 5.5" LC flat pads would work out better with the Flex from my research. However, it sounds like the 5" hybrid pads are the way to go anyways...

The thought of the Rupes being easier on the arms though, is also enticing, hah.

 

[hernandez.art13]

Not sure to how many this would apply to. However, I had to wet sand dirts of a repainted bumper today. (Sorry did't have time to take pictures) I sanded them with 1500 and My Rupes 21 with 5" backing plate and the washer mod. Was very easily able to remove the sanding marks with a blue wool hybrid pad and Menzerna FG400.

I then polished it with M205. Came out easily and looked great too. I think the Flex can only remove 2500? :dunno:

I love my Rupes

 

[Mike@DedicatedPerfection]

Lots of good info in the thread. I too have been debating over a Flex 3401 or Rupes 21 to take over as my primary tool. Been leaning toward the Flex for the forced rotation feature as I often grow tired of my DA's stalling on curves. Plus, (I think) my existing stash of 5.5" LC flat pads would work out better with the Flex from my research. However, it sounds like the 5" hybrid pads are the way to go anyways...

The thought of the Rupes being easier on the arms though, is also enticing, hah.

My vote goes to the 3401 as I felt he same about my G110v2. Get the required amount of pressure on it to do some heavy correction work and everything is great until the panel starts to curve. Then you are constantly adjusting pressure to make sure the pad still rotates. Not so with the Flex. Not to mention you can get into some more difficult areas with the Flex and the pad will rotate no matter the angle.

When you can pick up the Hybrid line. This is the way to go on this machine and your arms won't get as tired.