new D166 AIO has some serious issues

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

but does leave a bit of micro-marring in my early trials.

I need some more time to refine my process obviously.

This is where I'm at with D166 - as I've posted elsewhere - I've only used it on three things so far, (3 different paint systems).

Need to do some more work with this product to have a better feel for its capabilities and/or any drawbacks.

Would have nice to have been given a sample back when it was in the testing phase.

 

[Joe@NextLevelDetail]

Thanks for your response. In my experience what a customer values and is willing to pay is often very different from what you and I feel a vehicle "deserves".

This x10000

Just because we feel certain cars deserve the works, Does not mean the customer does. Our eye balls and the customers eye balls see 2 completley different things.

I have done lower level polishing jobs on very rare expensive cars, and have performed higher end paint correction on daily driver type vehicles.

At the end of the day the most important thing is to give the customer What they want and what they are paying for.

Sent from my LG-LS777 using Autogeekonline mobile app

 

[dlc95]

Thanks for all of the responses guys! I want to be clear that I still think it's a great AIO just not really best suited for single stage paints. Thanks for the explanation Mike. I thought I had heard you refer to products "sweating" in the past. Dan, please let me know if you have a similar experience on your SS. Thanks again Fellas.

Will do!

 

[dlc95]

it happens bad with the synergy wax idk why, I thought it was a bonding issue but it happens even with a wipe down or surface polish. a lot less with the surface polish though.

Even when I prepped using the pre wax cleaner, same result.

M26 never does that to me.

 

[Markus Kleis]

View attachment 60046

The first few times I tried D166 Ultra Polishing Wax on medium and hard paints I noticed a small amount sweating but because D166 looked fine (like banana pudding) I assumed it had to be from my pad somehow not being completely dry.

In the past week I've experimented with D166 on numerous other paints, and on different types of pads and machines. On any type of single stage paint on a ferrari or soft porsche paint it was a disaster. As you can see in the photo I took today while polishing a 1991 camaro with a new pad, the moisture in D166 was escaping the emulsion makes my pads soaking wet and the product impossible to work with. No matter if I use a few small pea sized drops or applied it heavy like mike phillips recommends when using cleaner waxes.

I contacted the distributor I purchased it from(before AG had it in stock) and he immediately contacted 4 of the Meguiar's Product Training reps he works with to let them know about my issue and to check and see if I just received a bad batch.

Turns out, all of them had similar experiences with D166 and have experienced this phenomenon on softer paints and especially single stage paints where so much water escapes the emulsion that D166 is virtually unusable. Some of the trainers said they had the problem when using a firm pad while others said the problem only occurs on some paints. They also said there is no point in sending me a new gallon because they all have experienced issue in their testing as well.

In Conclusion, I was extremely excited about D166 because I work on primarily classic cars with single stage paint and HD Speed has been a godsend. The only times I've been able to effectively use D166 was on my mom's 2017 chrysler mini-van and my 2017 Ram big horn. I did not experience hardly any "sweating" on either vehicle.

If you intended to replace HD Speed with D166 for final polishing on soft black paint, for 1-steps on softer paints, or want to use it on single stage paints, you'll be sorely disappointed with it's performance. Even though I know Meguiars has the resources, I feel they didn't allocate enough of those resources into testing on different paint types.

All that said, if you work primarily on modern cars with normal and hard clear coat and prefer soft foam pads, D166 is cost effective and should certainly meet/exceed your expectations as a cleaner wax/AIO.

Love,
Matt

Hi Matt,

Markus Kleis, Meguiar's Pro Product Manager here, thanks for checking out D166 and sharing your feedback. I wanted to touch base with you about what you experienced and try to better understand a few things.

When we worked on this product (for over a year) we only saw a small and insignificant amount of "sweating" one time. It seemed at the time that it was due to a short and incomplete work cycle and we did not find a correlation between single and dual stage paints.

We did, however, find that D166 generally likes to be thoroughly worked and given a chance to perform the correction as this product was tuned towards heavy correction over being a quick "spread and wipe" type solution. When using the slightly longer work cycle, this issue never presented itself for us in our local or national multi-region testing.

Without seeing your process, machine and pads, it's impossible for me to know exactly what could have contributed to this aside from the product itself, but if you want to shoot me a PM to discuss I would be more than happy to help troubleshoot it. I would also like to get some details about who the trainers were that said they had this issue because I am not sure who that would be - none of the team has conveyed anything about this to me and I would like to gather feedback of this nature whenever the opportunity presents itself.

Can you shoot me a PM with info about that? Thanks a bunch!

-Markus

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Thanks for chiming in Markus, it's great to see reps from any company take the time to join our forum and provide info and help.

:dblthumb2:

 

[fightnews]

Even when I prepped using the pre wax cleaner, same result.

M26 never does that to me.

did it happen to you with the synergy wax and surface cleansing polish or another wax?

 

[fightnews]

Hi Matt,

Markus Kleis, Meguiar's Pro Product Manager here, thanks for checking out D166 and sharing your feedback. I wanted to touch base with you about what you experienced and try to better understand a few things.

When we worked on this product (for over a year) we only saw a small and insignificant amount of "sweating" one time. It seemed at the time that it was due to a short and incomplete work cycle and we did not find a correlation between single and dual stage paints.

We did, however, find that D166 generally likes to be thoroughly worked and given a chance to perform the correction as this product was tuned towards heavy correction over being a quick "spread and wipe" type solution. When using the slightly longer work cycle, this issue never presented itself for us in our local or national multi-region testing.

Without seeing your process, machine and pads, it's impossible for me to know exactly what could have contributed to this aside from the product itself, but if you want to shoot me a PM to discuss I would be more than happy to help troubleshoot it. I would also like to get some details about who the trainers were that said they had this issue because I am not sure who that would be - none of the team has conveyed anything about this to me and I would like to gather feedback of this nature whenever the opportunity presents itself.

Can you shoot me a PM with info about that? Thanks a bunch!

-Markus

Looks like they're getting fired, lol just kidding welcome to the forum....

 

[namgrunt51]

Hi Matt,

Markus Kleis, Meguiar's Pro Product Manager here, thanks for checking out D166 and sharing your feedback. I wanted to touch base with you about what you experienced and try to better understand a few things.

When we worked on this product (for over a year) we only saw a small and insignificant amount of "sweating" one time. It seemed at the time that it was due to a short and incomplete work cycle and we did not find a correlation between single and dual stage paints.

We did, however, find that D166 generally likes to be thoroughly worked and given a chance to perform the correction as this product was tuned towards heavy correction over being a quick "spread and wipe" type solution. When using the slightly longer work cycle, this issue never presented itself for us in our local or national multi-region testing.

Without seeing your process, machine and pads, it's impossible for me to know exactly what could have contributed to this aside from the product itself, but if you want to shoot me a PM to discuss I would be more than happy to help troubleshoot it. I would also like to get some details about who the trainers were that said they had this issue because I am not sure who that would be - none of the team has conveyed anything about this to me and I would like to gather feedback of this nature whenever the opportunity presents itself.

Can you shoot me a PM with info about that? Thanks a bunch!

-Markus

After seeing all the positive hype of D166 I am anxious to try it for myself. Detailing as a sideline, I was reluctant to buy a gallon of a product I never tried myself but based on my positive experience with Maguiar's products in the past, I pulled the trigger and ordered a gallon online for $69. An hour later I saw this post, got cold feet, and was able to cancel the order. I originally wanted to buy the 16 oz. size but with shipping I was unwilling to pay $24 for the small bottle. It seems the gallons were readily available in all the places I looked which leads me to think D166 is being marketed more to high volume detailers. These forum's are where enthusiasts and pros get info on making purchase decisions and in my opinion, especially in light of this post, Maguiar's would be wise to make the product readily, and more widely, available in the smaller size to encourage more people to try it and post their feedback. I'm still anxious to try D166 but will be watching for more feedback from the "real" world.

 

[Eldorado2k]

After seeing all the positive hype of D166 I am anxious to try it for myself. Detailing as a sideline, I was reluctant to buy a gallon of a product I never tried myself but based on my positive experience with Maguiar's products in the past, I pulled the trigger and ordered a gallon online for $69. An hour later I saw this post, got cold feet, and was able to cancel the order. I originally wanted to buy the 16 oz. size but with shipping I was unwilling to pay $24 for the small bottle. It seems the gallons were readily available in all the places I looked which leads me to think D166 is being marketed more to high volume detailers. These forum's are where enthusiasts and pros get info on making purchase decisions and in my opinion, especially in light of this post, Maguiar's would be wise to make the product readily, and more widely, available in the smaller size to encourage more people to try it and post their feedback. I'm still anxious to try D166 but will be watching for more feedback from the "real" world.

You're overreacting... I used it for the 1st time yesterday and experienced a minuscule amount of this "sweating" but just as Markus suggested, a quik final pass and it became a total non factor. I only noticed it once while I was polishing the roof.

Btw, I was working on clearcoated paint.

Cancelled your order? Lol. Take it easy.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Just to comment...

Sweating isn't a negative aspect in a product formula - it's just a "characteristic" and I believe it's a characteristic of water based, ECO-FRIENDLY chemistry.

It's being green the in-thing?

I also think it requires more advanced chemistry (that means top notch chemists) to create water based products versus solvent based products. Any chemists please feel free to chime in and correct me and/or share more info.

 

[namgrunt51]

You're overreacting... I used it for the 1st time yesterday and experienced a minuscule amount of this "sweating" but just as Markus suggested, a quik final pass and it became a total non factor. I only noticed it once while I was polishing the roof.

Btw, I was working on clearcoated paint.

Cancelled your order? Lol. Take it easy.

Lol....just popped a Xanax and chased it with a shot of bourbon and everything is better now!


I'm a full time RV'er and I can only carry so many gallon jugs and that's why I didn't want to have that much of a product I wasn't sure I was going to be happy with. Guess I'll just wait till I have a big order to get free shipping on the 16 oz.

BTW.....thanks for the feedback on how it worked for you

 

[mwoywod]

Lol....just popped a Xanax and chased it with a shot of bourbon and everything is better now!


I'm a full time RV'er and I can only carry so many gallon jugs and that's why I didn't want to have that much of a product I wasn't sure I was going to be happy with. Guess I'll just wait till I have a big order to get free shipping on the 16 oz.

BTW.....thanks for the feedback on how it worked for you

lol, It's a great product and an incredible value. Personally, I am very picky about working on an unsaturated perfectly dry pad. It's a pet peeve of mine. I never prime my pad prior to polishing either.

One reason I am such a huge fan of products like HD Speed, HD Polish, Scholl Concepts S20 Black, & S30+ etc is because they have their own lubricating agents and perform best on a dry unprimed pad with a VERY small amount of product. Products like D166 and Sonax Polishes that are heavily water based seem to make your pad damp which isn't ideal for me.

That said, keep in mind I also don't like misting water onto paint to extend the working time of a compound AND the idea of using pad washer in between polishing sets sound horrific. haha