new paint product adviser

[cdavid]

i have just completed a ppg plus three coat clear paint job on my 1971 datsun 240 z daily driver. please advise the proper first step and maintenance. the color is the metalic silver from the merc/maclaren slr and it has been 4 weeks with a final cure after six.
i have been advised of klasse all in one but need help to the final step. this car will be covered when out of the house and washed once a week. thank you in advance and please let me know what i can do for you in return.
cdavid

 

[ScottB]

Since the car will be covered and garaged I would highly suggest a wax versus a paint sealant (klasse). I would use Max Wax, Sig Series from Pinnacles, or Nattys on silver as have had nice success. I dont believe that your freshly painted and preped car needs a strong chemical cleaner (AIO) currently either.

You might wanna consider the Sig Series kit as possible since it will offer everything needed to keep your silver beauty up for the next year or so. Careful washing, and using the Crystal Mist between wax sessions will keep the pop alive.

http://www.pinnaclewax.com/sisewaxkit.html

 

[FloridaNative]

:applause:Nice paint job. After the paint has fully cured you can use a wax or a sealant as your protection product. The Klasse will give you the most durablility and protection but can be a bit sterile looking if not topped with a good quality carnauba wax. If you are going to be caring for it weekly then you might want to try the Wolfgang sealant or the new DP sealant which look beautiful. For the waxes there are some really good ones out there. Souveran is the best one hands down. It comes in paste and liquid forms. Max Wax, Signature Series II and Natty's Blue and white waxes are all excellent. As far as care, I'm going to be lazy and give you a link. lol Seriously, one of AG's own is a college student and wrote a paper on car care. He did an excellent job and it is a very good read. Scroll down the link to read Neothin's comments. Welcome to our forums, there is no need to do anything in return for us. We are all car lovers here and freely share our advice and experience with each other. Just post some pics of your work to share with us and that is payment enough. I hope this helps you.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/showthread.php?t=1110&highlight=school+paper

 

[Reddwarf]

I love that car! I recently met a lady who is the original owner of a 1970 Datsun 240 Z. It was in beautiful condition. I also saw the Mclaren Merc in the silver. That is one of the most beautiful silver paint jobs I've even seen.

Your car must look awesome in that color.

I've yet to try AIO so I don't know. However, I'd follow Killr's advice. The kits on Autogeek are a great value, I've bought a couple of them myself. I used DP Max Wax on my sister-in-law's white Lexus and it looked great. It was very easy to apply. I used Natty's blue on my british racing green Jag and it is a great wax for the price.

 

[pt91]

I am not an expert on new paint but have read that certain sealants can be used soon after painting and allow the paint to continue curing where waxes do not. I had read this about fk sealants recently but other sealants may be included.

 

[cdavid]

thank you all for the advice and kind words. i am a member of other car forums and the knowledgable response given here is very helpful and much appreciated. i plan to let the paint cure with some sun exposure during the nex week and a half then apply a product in preparation for the zfest in orlando. i would love to know more about the original owner 1970 female and invite her to our events. thanks again and if there are and will be more pics of the car by following the link in my signature..

cheers, cdavid

 

[Reddwarf]

Here is a picture of the 240Z I was talking about.

She entered it in the Classy Chassis car show. I don't recall her name; however, there was a magazine article written about her and the car. I think it was a magazine devoted to 240Z ... maybe.

 

[AAWT]

allow the paint to continue curing where waxes do not. I had read this about fk sealants recently but other sealants may be included.

Yeah wax should never be used on a newly painted vehicle, unless you plan on painting it all over again...

 

[ScottB]

Yeah wax should never be used on a newly painted vehicle, unless you plan on painting it all over again...

absolutely wrong ... you are spreading a myth. A wax is not a sealant, and does not close off paint. Infact, carnauba waxes breathe (as does the plant and leaves from which it comes). The problem is in the products within the wax. Heavy solvents and other chemicals could damage the fresh paint. Thus using a carnauba only, like Pinnacle, is more than ok. It will provide protection from heat, UV, and rain elements while paint fully cures. (outgasses)

 

[AAWT]

absolutely wrong

You might want to tell DuPont that because when we were being trained they specifically told us not to use ANYTHING on a newly painted cars surface for at least 30 days! So if that's 'spreading a myth' then you might want to tell their corporate refinishing trainers at the link provided below. If anyone is spreading a myth it's the companies that sell the wax, so that they can sell more product. Also if the body is of a fiberglass nature then you wouldn't want to wax it with anything for the first 30-60 days because it will cause the fiberglass to yellow. You may be confusing a new cars freshly painted surface, with an after market refinish. New car finishes are fully cured and 'baked' at the factory. However refinished paint jobs are usually not baked, so it takes a while (30-90 days) for the paint to fully cure. However you are right about the carnauba wax having petroleum distolates to soften the naturally hard wax and make them easier to apply, but that doesn't apply to this because I seriously doubt that anyone is going to distill those additives out of the product before they use them. Feel free to contact Dupont by clicking (GOOGLE SEARCH : DUPONT)

Warning! - Never wax over freshly painted surfaces! New paint can take up to six months to cure completely.

Carnauba wax actually seals the surface rather than just coating it.

After-market paint finishes however, are cured at a much lower temperature to ensure the method of baking or heating the paint doesn't melt non-metal components such as wiring and vinyl. For this reason, it's best to follow the specific paint manufactures recommendations for care and maintenance of fresh paint. Most paint manufactures that supply paint to the refinish industry recommend that you allow anywhere from 30 to 90 days curing time after the paint is applied before you apply the first application of wax. GOOGLE SEARCH : Meguairs

 

[ScottB]

Aye yes, Dupont isnt this the same company that came out publicly and warned that Teflon is absolutely no benefit in car care. Then they sold the use of its brand name to more than 10 marketeers, and finally brought their own line of ..... Teflon based products .... to market. Guess their doing a complete 180 all in the name of hype ?? Not the best example of a company doing right by its clients.

Your links are outdated based upon new poly based paints and clears, acrylics, as well as the new ceramic clearcoats and of course the flash curing additives added to most modern paints. And just so you dont continue to imply I would rather sell lots of wax, consider I am a Commercial Banker via day. This is my hobby. Please consider having an intelligent conversation using fact and less links (we actually forbid them), as we can all benefit from your knowledge assuming you are in the field ?? Prove the science wrong, not the forum moderator.

Do some further searching and you will see that ONCE AGAIN the solvents and cleaners used in SOME waxes can harm NEW paint. However most of the curing in paints now are done in chemical form and flash rather quickly. (we are not discussing new factory car paint, as yes it is baked at high temp to intentionally induce outgasing and flash curing). Carnauba allows paint to breathe as it does in its native tree's. It refracts light and UV and only closes itself off (for lack of a better description) when watered. A paint sealant (synthetic wax) truly molecularly locks itself together to form an barrier, and this is not good for curing paint IMO.

So I will stand by assertion that recently painted areas can be waxed, but not necessarily sealed. I have done it with 4 replacement tops on my Vette in the last six months and none had any damage, as well as multiple cars over the last 10 years. In Florida, UV protection is the main and immediate concern. That said, I do understand why paint manufacturers offer the advice of 30-60 days. They cannot control the end-users product choice, and most OTC products are lined with heavily chemicals and cleaners (surfacants) that can damage their paint. It protects them, and makes their attorneys happy from warranty and damage claims, but when pressed they will let you know that SOME products are ok. (its truly ok to drink McDonalds coffee in your car also, but unhealthy to pour it in your lap)

As for boats and fiberglass ... dont know enough about them. So I would clearly stick to your assertion that it could yellow fiberglass, or what I presume is actually gel coat ??

 

[GearHead_1]

Killr, I value your opinion and I'm not trying to start or get in the middle of an argument here but my understanding is also not waxing a newly repainted car for a period of time (varies by manufacturer). PPG's recommendation is not waxing or polishing within the first 90 days. I won't post the link but I just reread their recommendation (PPG's site) and that's what they state. Obviously there may be some products that are not a problem to new paints and some that are. That being the case their recommendation may be geared towards the safe side. They were specifically talking about wax, no mention of sealants.

Quoting PPG - In the first 90 days
It is recommended that you not wax or polish the vehicle. This will allow the finish to completely dry and cure. (When you are ready to wax, do not use silicone containing or super polymer containing waxes or polishes) Today's finishes do not need such extreme protection and if your vehicle were involved in an accident, the removal of such waxes would be time consuming and expensive.

 

[ScottB]

It is not beneficial to rehash the subject, it is just easier to disagree versus agree. But I would like you to think about this ....

wax --- partially natural in design (carnauba), studying how the carnauba protects the Copernicia cerifera tree by secreting carnauba to cover its leaves. Now we also know that leaves bring oxygen into a plant correct while releasing dioxide if memory serves well, and water thru its root system. So in studying the effects of a carnauba we can obtain that it is breathable, that it provides a barrier from UV (otherwise the leaves would quickly disenigrate in heat)thru refraction, and when rain or water is added it becomes a barrier locking the water out.

Sealant ---a paint sealant is truly a man made, synthetic design. As the title suggests, it was designed to provide a barrier by locking out contaminents, UV, and water. It does so by polymers essentially locking (curing) together to bond into place. Can a polymer truly breathe ?? I dont pretend to know, but I can tell you in design a sealant will likely have less ability for paint to outgas. Now I am not saying a sealant isnt more durable, but isnt that due to the inpenetratable barrier also ?? It was/is designed to not be breached.

So in general we know that more than likely a carnauba product can allow paint to breathe. Were not certain, but it seems less likely from a paint sealant. So why would manufacturers warn not to use these products or wax (which is a common term for all products) ?? Simply because of the other products added within these. Most solvents within a carnauba flash cure rather quickly into the environment (hence the bigger VOC issue) while sealants need time to cure (bond). Also both these products can contain abrasives, chemical cleaners, and surfacants that could interfere with the paint curing. So over the years while paint has changed, waxes have changed, and detailing has changed it has become a staple that we should NOT wax new paint.

This is why they warn to give 30-90 days. That said, in a high heat and UV environment like Florida, would you at least give credit to protecting your paint as soon as possible. So if you have the ability to use a pure wax or a pure sealant with no ill effects, would you move quicker ?? I choose to based upon my study, my discussing the issues with a body shop specifically, and my own personal use. But treading lightly is always a safe path also ...

 

[Larry A]

Modern paints are catalyst cured, some are cured in 4 days , some in 30 days, it depends on the catalyst used . If you did wax to soon the worst that would happened is that you would lose some gloss, which would come back as soon as you buffed it out again.

 

[cdavid]

thank you all for your responses. i am learning alot and am close to a decision. your forum is full of some very nice car finishes and information on the how-to make and keep it that way. i hope to get the wow factor at our zfest in orlando on oct 7-8. i will offer results and feedback from my chosen course of action and you might find a few new members to your site the following week...

cdave