Paint: Thought it was a 3, but probably a 5

L

Lime

New member
Joined
Feb 21, 2014
Messages
25
Reaction score
0
Hi Mike, I have a 10 year old Mustang whose only exterior upkeep has been Mike's Car wash (drive through). I live where we haven't seen temperatures above freezing in 68 days, so unless I want to fill buckets from the sink (no hose in winter) and freeze my fingers off, that's pretty much the only option in winter. She has been garaged her whole life, but I am having some body work (re)done and the paint guy thought she looked a little - I forget the word he used, but bleached out is what he meant. She also has some orange peel from that previous bad body work in a narrow ledge on the passenger side just below the window.

I thought my paint was pretty good until I saw that Black Tahoe you did in 4 hours on another thread (the one where the owners thought their paint was pretty good, too, LOL!) I don't want to spend a fortune on this because there are also little chips in the paint, but I'd like to spruce her up some and would be thrilled with an outcome similar to the black Tahoe.

My first questions are: How bad is this? What number do I use? Or alternately which side of this flow chart should I use? Do I really need a compound, and should a beginner even tackle using a compound? Do I need Iron X and where does Iron X fall in this flow chart?

I want to buy a Porter Cable (or cheaper) RO polisher, but I don't know what pads and cream to buy. How many pads? There are too many choices in the shop, even if I limit it to kits! This will be my first time doing this, and I'm scared I'll mess it up if I go with a compound or medium polish and a super cutting pad.

I also wonder how this can all be done in one day! If it takes me 1/2 week, doesn't the car get dirty, or at least dusty, in between sessions? What do normal people do?

She only has 60,000 miles, and the engine has been kept up, but not cleaned LOL!, and I want to keep her for another 5 years, or longer.

The wheels and convertible top will each be in a different thread. I'm thinking $400.00 total for the project, including the buffer.

Thanks!
 
Lime said:
My first questions are: How bad is this? What number do I use? Or alternately which side of this flow chart should I use? Do I really need a compound, and should a beginner even tackle using a compound? Do I need Iron X and where does Iron X fall in this flow chart?

I want to buy a Porter Cable (or cheaper) RO polisher, but I don't know what pads and cream to buy. How many pads? There are too many choices in the shop, even if I limit it to kits! This will be my first time doing this, and I'm scared I'll mess it up if I go with a compound or medium polish and a super cutting pad.

I also wonder how this can all be done in one day! If it takes me 1/2 week, doesn't the car get dirty, or at least dusty, in between sessions? What do normal people do?

She only has 60,000 miles, and the engine has been kept up, but not cleaned LOL!, and I want to keep her for another 5 years, or longer.

The wheels and convertible top will each be in a different thread. I'm thinking $400.00 total for the project, including the buffer.

Thanks!
Click to expand...



Here's your picture inserted...

2004Mustang.jpg



The answer to your questions....

Get a Porter Cable or Griot's Garage dual action polisher. NO MATTER WHAT dual action polisher you purchase you will still HAVE TO BUY

5" Backing Plate
5.5" pads

No matter what.

  • The Porter Cable doesn't come with a backing plate.
  • The Griot's Garage comes with a 6" backing plate forcing you to use 6" and larger pads.
  • The Meguiar's G110v2 also comes with a 6" backing plate.
And I think all the other knock-offs of the Porter Cable in the world still leave you having to buy a 5" backing plate so you can use 5.5" pads and if you're going to use a Porter Cable or any of the knock-offs of the Porter Cable you WANT to use 5.5" pads for three reasons.

1. Smaller diameter means the pads will rotate well and pad rotation is a MUST to remove swirls.

2. Thin pads. Thick pads absorb all the energy that comes out of these tools and dissipates it. This means your pad won't rotate or it won't rotate as well as a thin pad. The Lake Country 5.5" foam pads are thin and work better.

3. Smaller diameter pads fit body panels better than larger pads. This is especially true for newer cars versus cool cars like 1967 Chevelles with massive flat panels.

Here's an article and ALL my articles have links to the store page to get the product I show pictures of and explain.


5 inch Backing Plates on Meguiar's, Griot's and Porter Cable DA Polishers




Besides that, click the link below and follow the step in order. Although the TITLE of the thread states it's for NEW CARS you would fallow all the same steps for an not-new-car. I wrote the title for Google. :D

How To Detail Your Brand New Car by Mike Phillips



As far as Iron X goes, you can use it or not. I like to decontaminate paint to key word, ensure there are no iron particles "in" the paint. But millions of cars have been buffed out without it since the time of the Model T as this type of product and procedure is a NEW thing in the car detailing world in the 100 year history of mankind's transition from riding a horse to driving cars.

Up to you. If you plan on keeping the car go for it. IF you're going to flip it or trade it in or sell it then doesn't matter that much.


As for polishes, get Wolfgang Uber Compound and Wolfgang Finishing Polish. The compound finishing out like a polish so that's a good thing and the polish scrapes every little bit of shine off the table, so to speak.

Hope that helps...

I have TONS of article in my article list on using dual action polishers.... I'd highly recommend reading through the list before buffing out a car.

Find the articles about,

  • Doing a test spot
  • Troubleshooting Guide for DA Polishers
  • Mark your Backing Plate
Those are good for anyone new to machine polishing. Here's the link to my article list...

Articles by Mike Phillips


Have to go... buffing out a 1967 Mustang GTA tonight. On this forum we walk the walk...






:)
 
Great on the 67 Mustang! My first one was a fastback '69, but my mom had the original '64 1/2.

Thanks for the reply. I found the Wolfgang uber compound, but I didn't see any Wolfgang Finishing polish in the store. There were other things that looked like they'd work, Wolfgang Finishing Glaze, for example, but not finishing polish.

What color pads should I get with this compound?

Thanks for the reply,
 
I should have asked a different question. What is the most aggressive pad I should use with the Wolfgangs Uber Compound for the type of damage you see on my car? I think I can figure out the lighter ones from there.

Thx
 
Orange pad(medium cut)and or LC HT tangerine(polish) in 5.5" would be my choice of pads
 
Lime said:
Great on the 67 Mustang! My first one was a fastback '69, but my mom had the original '64 1/2.

Thanks for the reply. I found the Wolfgang uber compound, but I didn't see any Wolfgang Finishing polish in the store. There were other things that looked like they'd work, Wolfgang Finishing Glaze, for example, but not finishing polish.

What color pads should I get with this compound?

Thanks for the reply,
Click to expand...
I think when mike ment finish polish he mean wolfgang finishing glaze
 
Lime said:
Great on the 67 Mustang! My first one was a fastback '69, but my mom had the original '64 1/2.

Thanks for the reply. I found the Wolfgang uber compound, but I didn't see any Wolfgang Finishing polish in the store.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I meant to type Wolfgang Finishing Glaze but just to note, it's not a glaze it'a s fine cut polish. Here's an article I have that has links to all the pertinent products.

The Wolfgang Four


Here are four products that will take care of about 99.9% of any exterior paint correction product you'll ever have in your garage.


The Wolfgang Four
The_Wolfgang_Four.jpg



Forum member RFulmer coined this term, (due credit where credit is due), and since there's been a lot of questions about what each product is, what they do, the order of aggressiveness and when you use one over the other, here's some info...



Uber Compound
  • Aggressive Compound - More aggressive than Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover and Wolfgang Finishing Glaze.
  • For use with any type of polisher/buffer and can be used by hand.
  • Body Shop Safe = Can be used in a fresh paint. environment (body shop) and can be used on fresh paint, (paint just sprayed and less than 30 days old).
  • Safe for Ceramiclear paints.
  • Cafe for all clear coat paints.
  • Safe for all single stage paints.
  • For some people on some cars it can be used as a compound/polish after which the paint can be sealed with a wax or synthetic paint sealant.


Total Swirl Remover
  • Medium Cut Polish - Less aggressive than Uber Compound and more aggressive than Wolfgang Finishing Glaze.
  • For use with any type of polisher/buffer and can be used by hand.
  • Body Shop Safe = Can be used in a fresh paint. environment (body shop) and can be used on fresh paint, (paint just sprayed and less than 30 days old).
  • Safe for Ceramiclear paints.
  • Cafe for all clear coat paints.
  • Safe for all single stage paints.
  • Should be tested before using Uber Compound to see if it will remove defects to our satisfaction in keeping with the practice of using the least aggressive product to get the job done.


Finishing Glaze
  • Fine Cut Polish - Much less aggressive than Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover and of course dramatically less aggressive than Wolfgang Uber Compound.
  • For use with any type of polisher/buffer and can be used by hand.
  • Body Shop Safe = Can be used in a fresh paint. environment (body shop) and can be used on fresh paint, (paint just sprayed and less than 30 days old).
  • Safe for Ceramiclear paints.
  • Cafe for all clear coat paints.
  • Safe for all single stage paints.
  • Should be tested before using Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover to see if it will remove defects to our satisfaction in keeping with the practice of using the least aggressive product to get the job done.
  • Great "Maintenance Polish" for use removing shallow swirls that show up over time from normal wear-n-tear on daily drivers and after a person has already performed a multi-step procedure to remove serious paint defects.


Deep Gloss Paint Sealant 3.0
  • German engineered synthetic paint sealant.
  • Non-cleaning, pure synthetic - Paint must be in excellent condition as in brand new or previously polished to like new condition before use.
  • Can be applied by hand or any type of dual action polisher wit foam pads.
  • This product "seals" the paint in the say way a car wax or paint coating will seal the paint. It is water insoluble and as such like all synthetic paint sealants, car waxes and paint coatings is not body shop safe.
  • Requires 30 to 45 minutes of drying time before removal.
  • Oxygen activated. After buffing off the excess sealant the remaining protection ingredients should be allowed to cure and fully set-up for an approximate 12 hour window of time before the vehicle is put back into service where it will be exposed to water.


Synergistic Chemical Compatibility
Each product is chemically compatible and chemically beneficial when used as a system approach to take a diamond in the rough and turn it into a glistening gemstone. Using the entire line in the correct order or just a few of the product in the correct order is an example of working forward in the paint polishing process.


All Inclusive System-Approach
This group of four products with just about any tool, any pad and even by hand will produce not only show car results but do it consistently across a VERY wide spectrum of paint systems including,
  • Hard paints, soft paints and everything in-between.
  • Factory OEM paints and aftermarket repaints at your local body shop or custom paint shop.
  • Single stage and basecoat clearcoat.
Which products do you need?
Which product you'll need depend upon the condition of the paint on the car. Click to my list of paint condition categories and read through the descriptions for the different categories. Then after washing and drying your car, inspect the paint both with your sense of touch, (The Baggie Test), and visually with your eyes in bright light for swirls and scratches.

Then determine which category your car's paint fall into. Here are some general guidelines but the best way to determine which exact product you'll need to remove the defects and restore the finish on your car to your expectations can only be determined by doing a Test Spot


How To Do a Test Spot


Test Spot results showing the before and after difference...

FlexVideo005.jpg







On Autogeek.net

Wolfgang Uber Compound 3.0

Total Swirl Remover

Finishing Glaze


Deep Gloss Paint Sealant 3.0


:xyxthumbs:





Lime said:
What color pads should I get with this compound?

Thanks for the reply,
Click to expand...

From the looks of the swirls in this picture the Lake Country Orange Flat Foam Cutting pad in 5.5" should decimate them using the Uber Compound.


Lime said:
I should have asked a different question. What is the most aggressive pad I should use with the Wolfgangs Uber Compound for the type of damage you see on my car? I think I can figure out the lighter ones from there.

Thx
Click to expand...


Same answer I gave above...


:)
 
Should also add, you really should try to live with a dirty car during you coldest months over going to an auto car wash, or all of this work is going to be undone.
 
Thanks for the reply on the finishing glaze, Dan. I thought it was odd that he'd recommend something not sold in the store, but then I have read so many things on here where a sealant is not a coating and a glaze is not a wax (or whatever) that I didn't want to assume anything.

I have come up with this combo - it only has 3 of the Wolfgang 4, only one of the crimson polishing pads and includes a nasty looking set of 2 blue pads that look like they'd take the paint clean off. Do I even use these? There is no Total Swirls Remover in this kit, but it has foam pads the right size. Porter Cable Wolfgang Ultimate Kit I don't know if I'd use the blue pads and I'd probably have to buy more of the less aggressive pads and the swirl remover. Or will I? I thought you could finesse the cut by going with an aggressive polish and a non-aggressive pad (or visa versa)

Or I can get the Swirls remover and the CSS Pads, but they are 6.5 on a 5 backplate" - and that isn't what Mike said to buy, but they are foam, so does that change anything about the size? . Detailer's Choice Swirls remover kit. On this kit, I'd have to buy the Uber compound and well, I'm getting myself confused. This isn't easy as there are many choices, not just these, and different colors of flex backplates (and I'm sure that means something, I just haven't figured it out. Flex is also the name of an expensive buffer, so it's wee bit :confused: confusing.)

Surely there is a ready made kit suitable for my car. It can't be that unusual to have a car wash-car come in here to be fixed! And how come none of these kits contain clay?

I have $400.00, 45.00 of it is for RaggTop, $300 is for all polishes and buffer and pads, leaving $55.00 for these wheels. I already have Meg's Med Cut Metal shine and a spray bottle of Meg's something purple for alloy wheels and a brush. What else do I need for these wheels? Maybe I won't need all $55.00 for the wheels and can buy more of what I do need in terms of pads and polishes?

2004Wheels_zps08c6b8be.jpg



Aim4Squirrels - Noooo! :cry: I simply do not understand how this can be true - to drive a dirty car for over 2 months (closer to 4 months because even though it's been 69 days below freezing here, there is another full month where it's just barely above freezing and I cannot see me out on the driveway washing my car!? Is that what people on here do? I don't believe you! The door handles alone get your hands or gloves dirty every time you open the door, much less the little door for getting gas. What about all the salt corroding my car? I thought I was doing a good thing by keeping it all off! There is a pressure wash booth about 5 miles away, but baby, it's cold outside! I don't even know if it's open when it's super-cold out (below zero)

I realize this is rambling, pick and choose which you want to answer. This not only to Mike, but BayTech and Dan and well, anybody who has 2¢ to add.

Thank you!


 
Lime, you're heading in the right direction, and Mike is the person you want advice from.

As for pads, I notice you said you were getting one. You'll want at least 3 for each correction step (compound, polish, finish, etc.) Also, learn how to clean your pad "on the fly", Mike has a great article on it.

Washing in colder months, I took mine to a self wash, washed it with the sprayer, then dried with my guzzler towels. Followed with a waterless wash. No harm done. I haven't touched it since (about 3 months), and its filthy but I'm trusting the paint coating I put on it.

Good luck and keep us posted on your progress!
 
Forgot to add, give Nick at AG a call, he will take good care of you when you're ready to order!
 
I completely understand and sympathize with you, but you simply can't use anything with a brush that the general public uses. No swirly brush auto car washers or the brush that hangs in the coin op self service wash bays.

You can use touchless auto washes, and you can use the pressure washers at the coin op bays. That will at least get the really bad stuff off.
 
Thanks, everybody! I took so long reading and trying to see what I'd need, item-by-item, that my coupon expired. I've decided to have it professionally detailed and going forward, just not go through the drive-thru car wash. I guess I'll look into shampoo and conditioner and pick up some microfiber that's on sale to wash it myself. I do have one more question to the detailers on here. Would you be insulted if a customer brought you some Wolfgang or DP Sealant to use on their car instead of the brand you usually use?
 
Lime said:
Thanks, everybody! I took so long reading and trying to see what I'd need, item-by-item, that my coupon expired. I've decided to have it professionally detailed and going forward, just not go through the drive-thru car wash. I guess I'll look into shampoo and conditioner and pick up some microfiber that's on sale to wash it myself. I do have one more question to the detailers on here. Would you be insulted if a customer brought you some Wolfgang or DP Sealant to use on their car instead of the brand you usually use?
Click to expand...

Call Nick! He will make sure you get a great price. I think you're better off purchasing equipment now, rather than pay someone. Plus, it's much more rewarding doing it yourself.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top