Polishing Fail, I feel like giving up before it even started.
- Thread starter itzJoker
- Start date
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
- 51,004
- 7
Any wax or paint sealant, or any polish or glaze that leaves itself behind on the surface by definition is "filling".
If a product is coating over and staying behind then it is filling in low spots and thus masking fine or shallow defects.
Some products are better at filling or leaving themselves behind than others...
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
- 51,004
- 7
Polishing paint is an art form, it requires the right products, pads and techniques plus the human elements of care and passion.
Polishing paint is not simply a grinding process.
On most discussion forums, in the proper context, micro-marring, also called hazing or tick-marks is directly related to DA Polishers. It's the oscillating action physically marring the paint by either the material of the pad or the abrasives being used and sometimes both.
You can often times take the same pad and product and apply them to the paint using a rotary buffer and remove the micro-marring. Of course then you possibly might have rotary buffer swirls.
How a paint reacts to any product, pad or process is highly affected by the paint itself. That's why I wish paint manufactures would purposefully make paints that were User Friendly.
That is make a paint system that meets the criteria of auto manufacturers but also make it so the average person with average skills could remove defects out of the paint and then polish the paint to a defect-free, show car shine.
Instead... we have a mish-mash of different paint systems with new paint systems continually being introduced and as far as I can tell in my entire life in the paint polishing world, there is never any thought given to creating a paint that fits all kinds of other criteria PLUS is purposefully formulated and designed to be "polishable".
Pristine Image
New member
- Oct 13, 2008
- 183
- 0
Mike, if hazing is another name for micro-marring, then what is term for a foggy film that's created on the clearcoat's surface after polishing? This past weekend I detailed my truck and while I felt I successfully removed the swirls I could not for the life of me remove this foggy, haze on the paint. If I tried to remove it with my microfiber towels it appeared to just smear. I got some QD out and tried that but even that only helped a little bit. Due to a time constraint I just gave up... (then it rained two hours later to add insult to injury on a bright and sunny day)
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
- 51,004
- 7
What tool were you working with?
What products were you finishing with?
What pad were you finishing with?
Pristine Image
New member
- Oct 13, 2008
- 183
- 0
I began by giving the car a bath in Gold Class wash followed by claying. Afterwards, I started working with my FLEX 3401 on a white Lake Country CCS pad and Meg's #80. Some panels needed two passes, others just one. Upon finishing with polishing I proceeded to waxing with Meg's #16.
After doing some investigative work I wonder if I may have oversaturated the pad and that had something to do with it. Or, perhaps I should have followed up using Meg's #82 on a black CCS pad as maybe that would have cleared up the hazy film.
I was working in my non-air conditioned garage in Houston. It was hot and humid...
5.4 Shelby
New member
- Feb 23, 2010
- 970
- 0
Val,
Did you try an IPA wipedown after polish and before wax?
Did you try an IPA wipedown after polish and before wax?
Pristine Image
New member
- Oct 13, 2008
- 183
- 0
No, I can't say that I did. In fact, although I've seen IPA mentioned times before it wasn't until just a few minutes ago that I read that all it is a 90% isopropyl alcohol and water in a 50/50 mix in a spray bottle. I was under the impression that was just to take out any fillers to see if you got out all the swirls and not just filled them in....
- Thread starter
- #69
It's used for that and for cleaning the surface.
Is the "haze" that you're talking about like the micromarring in my pictures?
Pristine Image
New member
- Oct 13, 2008
- 183
- 0
The only picture that looks somewhat like what I've got going on is the third picture from the top. It looks like you've got those hazy lines going from the front of the hood to the back. As far as I could tell under the halogens I didn't have any tick marks in the paint after I got rid of the swirls.
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
- 51,004
- 7
This is just a guess... the Flex 3401 has a long orbit or through, you can see this yourself by simply grabbing the the face of the pad and rotating and feel the length of out-of-round orbit as it rotates/oscillates.
This makes the tool more aggressive as it relates to abrading the paint when using the right pads and products.
My guess is the M80 diminishing abrasives together with this long orbit are causing micro-marring and that's the haze or fog you're seeing over the paint. I've probably uses as much if not more M80 as anyone still living and while I'm very fond of it for restoring antique, oxidized single stage paints, like this...
Photos courtesy of MeguiarsOnline
Before
After
I don't ever use it on clear coat paints.
The above Mercedes-Benz is a car I led a team of people to detail for an "Extreme Makeover" and is currently the car you see on the Ultimate Compound label.
M16 doesn't really add anything to paint visually except gloss, some paints will clarify paint and this will show up as a darkening effect, M16 can do this a little but it mostly adds protection and gloss. I've used a ton of this stuff in my life, probably as much or more than anyone still living.
Get yourself some Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover and Finishing Glaze and this should remove the haze and restore a clear surface. You could probably get away with one or the other as they both are very good at leave a haze-free finish when used with DA Polishers.
Pristine Image
New member
- Oct 13, 2008
- 183
- 0
Thank you Mike, I'll give some new products a try! And that's some great work on that Benz 
rops:
rops:
5.4 Shelby
New member
- Feb 23, 2010
- 970
- 0
The reason I asked about IPA is maybe it is residual polish residue. It sounded like you could smear it around.
Pristine Image
New member
- Oct 13, 2008
- 183
- 0
I could. That's what was so weird. A little would be picked up by the microfiber but the rest would just smear to the edges of where I just wiped. Perhaps my MFs were a little damp from sweaty hands. During this detail I was guilty of not swapping out MFs as often as I should have because I didn't have very many clean ones available and I was sweating in my garage like no other. I didn't have a fan and it must have been in the 90's in that garage. The extra heat from the halogens didn't help either. I was drinking water by the gallons.
If it wasn't for the fact that I spent at least two hours trying to get all the Meg's #16 off because I put it on too thick (BIG mistake) I'd go do a IPA wipedown to see if it'd clear it up and reapply the wax. Meg's #16 sure does bead pretty though!
5.4 Shelby
New member
- Feb 23, 2010
- 970
- 0
just try a small area to see if it works. Then wax back over it.