DetailKitty
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- Jul 17, 2013
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Yup, my company is auto-related. We go every year to SEMA to check out the latest and greatest. The latest and greatest we then sell the following year :xyxthumbs:
Really???
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Yup, my company is auto-related. We go every year to SEMA to check out the latest and greatest. The latest and greatest we then sell the following year :xyxthumbs:
Shane731
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I work with one of those know-it-all types too. He knows everything about everything (or at least thinks he does), and has to one-up everybody. You can't tell him anything without yourself being accused of being a know-it-all. He's the type where if you said you beat off 3 gang bangers with a broom handle, he'd say he beat up 10 ninjas with a banana. He has what I like to call "a big mouth and a small mind." Best just to leave them to their own devices.
DetailKitty
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Apparently you work with this guy as well :laughing:
Yeah, better to let them tire themselves out then argue and tire yourself out.
I knew a gal like that. The worst part about it, was where she worked and what she did. She was a cashier at a hardware store I worked at in high school. Loved that job, independently owned and operated by the 4th generation of the family that opened it in the early 1900's.
She drove an older Malibu, worked there for minimum wage, and was about 40 or so. No shame in any of that. However, it was who she THOUGHT she was that was the problem. You'd see her rusted old Malibu out there but she'd talk about how her and her husband are thinking about buying a BMW or a Porsche for her because she wanted the air-conditioned seats. She had a collection of Coach purses, but of course, she left those at home, because us poor rats would probably just steal it. We aren't 'high society' like her. Her sunglasses cost $300 (and looked suspiciously like the $10 ones we sold right there at the counter), and her and her husband ONLY ate at the best restaraunts and would NEVER go to a cheap place (even though I bumped into them all the time at my favorite little chinese take out place!). And of course, anything you did, she did better! When a co worker bought a new car, she spent 10 minutes talking about how she WOULD buy a new car, but hers is better than all of the new cars out there, and she'll have a new car as soon as they decide on the BMW or the Porsche (or Mercedes, occasionally). Had a compliment from a customer? "Oh yeah, they compliment me all the time". Stub your toe? She stubbed three.
Her husband was the polar opposite. Middle-management 9-5 type, nice guy. Very humble, would do anything for anyone; and absolutely did not brag about anything. He probably made good money, but I don't know if he made coach-purse, Porsche, Emeril-packed-my-lunch-for-me good. Does it matter? No, of course not. I don't begrudge people for having money, and I don't look down on those who are struggling. But the fact of the matter is, SHE was making minimum wage. So either A) She was working because he wanted her to do something herself instead of sit around and spend his money (supposedly he told someone this; but you know how that is). or B) They needed a little supplemental income; in which case, you probably shouldn't think about a new Porsche (Unless her income was going purely to that! You could probably make the payment and handle most of the upkeep on minimum wage if you had ZERO other expenses). EITHER WAY, she really wasn't in the position to be snubbing her nose at us poor high schoolers she worked with making minimum wage.
Though I think it was really, C). She went to work for more spending money because she had a lifestyle expectation that wasn't being met, and she needed more money to get there. More than anything, she wanted a status seat above everyone else.
What can ya do?
Klasse Act
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- Feb 21, 2012
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This thread has made me reflect a little bit and made me think about another thread I was involved in, the "tire thread" by Bill. He needed tires and was trying to save money and have some ancient tires saved or whatever, they were dry rotted to hell. He talked about some off brand IIRC and then it turned into Michelin's. I, as well as others, tried to tell him about Conti DWS', a tire I have a lot of experience with! I got friends running them and they can't say enough good things about them (other than the MS3 guys who can only get 20-25k out of em) the reason given for the Michelins.....wait for it, they're Merican made, LOL! These tires were the replacement tires for the old ones on his car AND they were Merican! Funny thing is, Michelin is a French owned company, atleast someone said as much in the thread.
I find myself being pushy about tires but only because I want the very best for people that I know...and don't know, you never know whom you'll help out with your advice with such things!
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I find myself being pushy about tires but only because I want the very best for people that I know...and don't know, you never know whom you'll help out with your advice with such things!
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Having an idea about something is one thing. Getting emotionally involved in it, insulting people, or acting like you're the only one with knowledge? That's another.
The American made one is one I understand. Chrysler and Ford both had big plants out here, now closed. So I can understand the idea behind supporting American companies. The debate though is over foreign-owned, American made; and American-owned, Foreign-made. Many asian imports are built here in the states. Whereas many domestic products are built in Mexico and Canada. Even U.S. assembled domestic cars have parts sourced all over the world. (On a side note; and this is purely opinion, but why should I be loyal to American manufacturers if they aren't loyal to American workers?)
On a motorcycle forum I'm on, specializing in Kawasaki Vulcans, there's a few people looking for American made. Always seems a little odd for owners of Japanese bikes made in Japan from a Japanese company! Though, there really isn't much choice in American motorcycles. Three companies (Harley-Davidson, Indian, Victory) all producing air-cooled V-twins with 50 year old technologies. If you want anything else, at all, (like liquid cooling to keep your legs from being char-broiled), you've gotta go import.
Personally, if I find two products I feel are identical for a similar price, I'll choose the American product. But I generally won't go for an inferior American product over a superior imported product. Doing so is why the American auto manufacturers had to play 'catch up', because they were sitting on their thumbs while Americans bought American cars because it was the 'right thing to do', while the Japanese and German engineers busted their butts to make a car so great it would pull the American market out of their Ford's, Chevy's and Dodge's. Now that the American market is less and less domestic-loyal, they actually have to compete!
GenesisCoupe
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I also work with a similar individual. If you say you have a friend who owns a charter company, he will tell you that his friend owns a charter company, and that he is always going for free and is bringing back 30 fish every time and it's just him and his friend. Funny enough, i am well aware of Chicago Lake Michigan fishing rules, which are up to 5 fish per individual maximum..
Just gotta ignore those idiots.
Just gotta ignore those idiots.
Klasse Act
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Well said Romans and I would love to support American products all the way but you've gotta think with your wallet and not your heart, let me explain. Say you only had $5k to spend on a car, needed good mileage, low cost of ownership and great reliability. Your choices are an older Civic w/ above average mileage in great running condition or a newer Cavalier w/ below average mileage in the same good running condition. This car has to last you a good 5-7 yrs because life has thrown you a curve ball.....WHAT WOULD YOU BUY?
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Well actually that's a tough one because those Cavaliers were pretty rock solid cars! My wifes parents bought a Cavalier new for each of her 6 siblings growing up (except for her; she got a Dodge Neon. Go figure!
). Basically, they wanted them to have a nice reliable car with a warranty, and the Cavaliers were about as cheap as they come. A couple of them have been traded in, one wrecked, but the others are still in service. Her brother, who got the first one, has almost 300k on his. He has a big Diesel truck and an SUV, and commuted to work in that old Cavalier his parents got him when he was 16 (He's in his 30's now). Then her older sister held on to hers for a long time, it has 230k on it and she just gave it BACK to my wifes parents so her dad could have a cheap commuter car (they have an SUV and a mini-van), and my wifes little sister is still driving her Cavalier with 180k on it. The neon, unfortunately, is long gone. Which is a shame; I loved that car! Her parents bought that one used; which my wife didn't mind at all (Heck, her boyfriend at the time- that's me- was driving a 20 year old rusted out Mercury he bought for $200 and fixed up
). In college they decided she needed a 'new' car since all of the siblings did and bought her the Cavaliers ugly step-sister with a couple missing chromosomes; the Cobalt. NOT reliable, cheap in every sense of the word; pure junk (and they severely overpayed for it). It was so ugly, that some teenager couldn't even stand to look at it so she had to look at her text messages instead, and plowed into it while it was sitting waiting to make a turn and totaled it. LOL.
DetailKitty
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I dont think any one car company has the lockdown on reliability. There are always flukes, lemons, etc.
This is why I hate when people get all "my car is awesome and everything else is crap".
I drive a MINI... it's expensive to maintain and I don't think they have the best reputation for longevity. But I don't care because I like driving it, period. I've driven everything from an F350 to the MINI. It all depends on my needs and what I want to drive.
My husband will tell you the best car he ever had was a Hyundai. He traded it for a Mercedes. The Mercedes ended up in the shop for 90 days straight at one point and my husband made them pay 3 of his car payments because of it. He unloaded that thing asap and kicks himself for trading the Hyundai for that car.
His second favorite, which he still owns, is his 2003 Jeep Rubicon. He competes with it off-road and it's been rolled. That thing has never failed to start up and run. Even after it was upside down and lost 3 quarts of oil.
This is why I hate when people get all "my car is awesome and everything else is crap".
I drive a MINI... it's expensive to maintain and I don't think they have the best reputation for longevity. But I don't care because I like driving it, period. I've driven everything from an F350 to the MINI. It all depends on my needs and what I want to drive.
My husband will tell you the best car he ever had was a Hyundai. He traded it for a Mercedes. The Mercedes ended up in the shop for 90 days straight at one point and my husband made them pay 3 of his car payments because of it. He unloaded that thing asap and kicks himself for trading the Hyundai for that car.
His second favorite, which he still owns, is his 2003 Jeep Rubicon. He competes with it off-road and it's been rolled. That thing has never failed to start up and run. Even after it was upside down and lost 3 quarts of oil.
Absolutely. And it's not always just cost or even build quality. High end exotic sports cars have tremendous build quality, but won't last very long (if anyone actually drove them any distance anyway). More power = more heat = less reliability. Even some of these German luxury cars are jumping on the bandwagon of needing more power, with less displacement (to reduce weight) and as fuel efficient as possible, and are often finding themselves with less reliable vehicles! Look at the Top 10 least reliable car list. Every year! This years least-reliable includes the Hyundai Genesis, Mini Cooper, and even a Cadillac XTS. Notable, it also includes the new Ford Taurus SHO. A nearly $50,000 Ford. Whereas the Fusion, the Taurus's cheap little brother, is among the MOST reliable cars on the market right now! Often times companies like Jaguar, Mercedes, and even BMW have cars on the 'least reliable' list. (And more often when it's categorized not by number of repairs but cost of repairs. You may repair your domestic 3 times and your german luxury once, but that one repair cost more than the 3 domestic repairs combined!)
Not always, of course. Just saying, there is no 'general rule' when it comes to reliability. There was a time when if it wasn't American made, it was going to fall apart before you got home. Then there was a time that if it WAS American made, you better have two since chances are one of them isn't gonna start for you in the morning. Now, it's kind of a mix. One year, the most reliable list has no domestic cars, other years, they dominant the field. Just gotta watch! Brands too! Chevy was on top, now Ford is kind of taking the lead (in reliability), and companies like Nissan, Hyundai, Volvo, etc., are all OVER the place!
Klasse Act
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Good to hear those Cavs lasted that long but I'm talking about a used one, not new, they were obviously well maintained from day 1. You go to Auto Trader and have $5k and have to buy 1, which do you buy, sure Honda has had lemons but you don't hear about that much and I can tell you that Honda and Toyota's hold their values much better, even with mileage on them, money talks and BS walks (thank you Brian Johnson, LOL)
Someone I know is a service advisor at a Dodge/Jeep dealership and OMG the horror stories! My buddy Derek, who's an AG member, bought a brand new Journey and w/ 263 miles on it developed an oil leak, took it in and it was said to need a rear main seal and then it turned into repl?acing the engine, they came out of a Saab 9-5 wagon....263 miles and it needed a new engine!
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Someone I know is a service advisor at a Dodge/Jeep dealership and OMG the horror stories! My buddy Derek, who's an AG member, bought a brand new Journey and w/ 263 miles on it developed an oil leak, took it in and it was said to need a rear main seal and then it turned into repl?acing the engine, they came out of a Saab 9-5 wagon....263 miles and it needed a new engine!
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What's the difference?
Take my brother-in-laws with almost 300k on it. If I had bought it with 100k on it, and maintained it well, it'd have gotten another 200k! (At least, it's still going, he still drives it every day except when he has his kids with him!)
Now if it were neglected or not maintained, that's another thing. These guys are all good about engine maintenance. Exterior maintenance? No way. Every single one of them has clearcoat failure, most very severe. But we're talking about being between a rock and a hard place and needing something reliable.
In your example, it was an older, higher mileage civic vs a newer, lower mileage Cavalier. I think either would be a good choice. But that's just me!
DetailKitty
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I think maintaining a car is key. Regular oil changes, fluids, belts, filters. If you maintain a car properly, there's no reason you shouldn't get 200K out of it, no matter what it is.
Klasse Act
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Maintence is key, I used to work for a tool coating company back in the metro Detroit area and we bought a brand new 97' Safari and ran it for 8.5 yrs before the delivery service was outsourced, the mileage on that van when we got rid of it, 656k, original engine and trans, only the oil pump replaced at 80k was the only internal part replaced, trans serviced every 30k religiously, it was about of my job duties in addition to delivery.
I guess my original qustion is this, the general masses and what car would they pick, my opinion is the Civic because of reputation.
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I guess my original qustion is this, the general masses and what car would they pick, my opinion is the Civic because of reputation.
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Absolutely.
Although I think cars last even longer than people let them. Maintenance is one thing, but repairs is another. We're a throw away society. If it breaks, throw it away. Now, I understand wanting a new car now and then. I also understand wanting a new car, and your car needing repairs, and deciding that you'd rather buy a new car than repairing your old one. However, I think it's downright silly when people say they are buying a brand new car because their old one is going to cost 'more to fix it than it's worth'. The new car is a HECK of a lot more than that!
Cars would last a REALLY long time if people would hang on to them and fix when needed. Even a new engine and transmission isn't the end of the world.
Now, that aside; if you want a new one- more power to ya. There's something to be said for a warranty and piece of mind, too. But just be honest with yourself; you want a new car. There's are very few scenarios where it costs you less to buy a new car than it does to repair your old car, even if it will require more repairs in the future.
DetailKitty
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I can't really answer this question- my car decisions have always been based on how fun is it to drive? And I think they always will be.
Ok, the F350 wasn't necessarily fun to drive, but I had a horse at the time and I towed a horse trailer. So I guess even then it was all about horsepower
bootstrap
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I love adams products, and use them for almost everything, but their product line has holes in it, good sealant, wheel sealant, misc tools that I fill with AG supplies. I'll admit many adams users may be fan boys that refuse to believe anything else exists.
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Fair enough! You're right, some may choose the civic.
But there are variables. Just to play the devils advocate, what if it was owned by some teenager who thought it was just 2 or 3 bolt ons away from a Lamborghini? Ran it to redline EVERYWHERE he went and didn't change the oil because he was saving for a cold air intake. Versus the Cavalier owned by some old guy with a GM discount. (Or vice versa, of course, pretty much any inexpensive 4-banger is a potential rice-rocket target).
Of course that's all dependent on market too. Out here? In Rural 'Merica? It'd be the Cavalier. Hands down. 220,000 miles, engine smoking, 4 bald tires vs an immaculate Civic? No, it's the Cavalier. It's 'Merican made (in Mexico)! Back to the 4-banger = corvette killer crowd, the Civic would probably be a LOT more popular, regardless of reliability!
But, a typical adult with no loyalties, yeah, they may lean towards the Civic for it's reputation for reliability. But, at least out here, the Cav has quite a record for reliability too. You've gotta weed out the ones bought used and neglected.
But there are variables. Just to play the devils advocate, what if it was owned by some teenager who thought it was just 2 or 3 bolt ons away from a Lamborghini? Ran it to redline EVERYWHERE he went and didn't change the oil because he was saving for a cold air intake. Versus the Cavalier owned by some old guy with a GM discount. (Or vice versa, of course, pretty much any inexpensive 4-banger is a potential rice-rocket target).
Of course that's all dependent on market too. Out here? In Rural 'Merica? It'd be the Cavalier. Hands down. 220,000 miles, engine smoking, 4 bald tires vs an immaculate Civic? No, it's the Cavalier. It's 'Merican made (in Mexico)! Back to the 4-banger = corvette killer crowd, the Civic would probably be a LOT more popular, regardless of reliability!
But, a typical adult with no loyalties, yeah, they may lean towards the Civic for it's reputation for reliability. But, at least out here, the Cav has quite a record for reliability too. You've gotta weed out the ones bought used and neglected.
Klasse Act
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You've made solid points but the "rural Merica" is not exactly correct, let me explain. I go down to the Tail of the Dragon every year, since 2003 and you wouldn't believe the number of Toyota pick up trucks, older ones from the 80's and into the 90's, Nissan p/u's are next and older B2000's (Mazda versions) I was shocked at first because I thought the "good ol' boys" would have Chevy and Fords but no, Toyota's DOMINATE! I think its because of reliability to be honest, plus their smaller and better on gas.
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