Record you polishing

I also want to correct the earlier calculation the a 6" pad only has to travel 30" to cover a 6"x36" section

This calculation would only be correct for a square pad...i have not seen one of those recently

A round pad would actually have to travel the full 36" to polish the corners of the 6"x36" section

Original Math was correct...that's what I get for over thinking it!
 
Not to say there is a right or wrong answer for the OP, but as one poster said... whatever works for you sounds like the right answer.

The arm speed shown in the video is WAY faster than I usually do it, and I believe im much faster than 1"/second. I usually do slow arm speed when I have extra pressure during the first 2-3 passes, and then less pressure and faster speed on the remaining passes. Im usually just trying to get out swirls and some shallow scratches, while leaving most of the bad RIDS.... I've only done work on street parked daily drivers.
 
allenk4 said:
Yes, sticking w 6" pad for easier math



At 1" per second you would actually move the pad over a 6" x 36" section in 30 seconds.. Remember, the 6" pad only travels 30" to polish a section 6"x36"



But that does not account for the fact that the door is 48" long



With NO overlap it would be 30 seconds x 8 = 4 minutes



I get the 8 by dividing the length of the door (48") by the diameter of the pad (6")



Depends on what you call a pass...if it is up/down & left/right = one pass...then double it...so 8 minutes per pass



4 passes = 32 minutes
Click to expand...


Maybe I missing something but a 12" square section with a 6 inch pad overlapping 50% an moving 1 inch a second will only make 3 horizontal or vertical passes at 12 seconds each totaling 36 seconds ( a section pass is horizontal or vertical) so to do 1 pass horizontal an 1 vertical that would be 1 min 12 seconds for 2 passes


Sent from my Alien ship
 
HD.Detailing said:
Maybe I missing something but a 12" square section with a 6 inch pad overlapping 50% an moving 1 inch a second will only make 3 horizontal or vertical passes at 12 seconds each totaling 36 seconds ( a section pass is horizontal or vertical) so to do 1 pass horizontal an 1 vertical that would be 1 min 12 seconds for 2 passes


Sent from my Alien ship
Click to expand...

My calculations are for the door of my truck which is 36"x48", which is 12 square feet

If a section pass is once over the paint in either direction...


With 0% over lap between each of the 12"x12" sections that comprise the 12sqft door

Time to polish a 12"x12" section with one pass (up/down) = 1 minute and 12 seconds

Door is 12 square feet

12 x 1 minute and 12 seconds = 14 minutes 24 seconds

x 6 passes = 43 minutes to make 6 passes on the entire door


I really don't think there are many people out there who are honestly compounding at 1" per second during an entire compounding session

I wonder how much cutting a DAT Compound is doing on the 6th pass?
 
allenk4 said:
My calculations are for the door of my truck which is 36"x48", which is 12 square feet



If a section pass is once over the paint in either direction...





With 0% over lap



Time to polish a 12"x12" section with one pass = 1 minute and 12 seconds



Door is 12 square feet



12 x 1 minute and 12 seconds = 14 minutes 24 seconds



x 6 passes = 86 minutes 44 seconds to make 6 passes on the entire door



x5 doors on the truck, including tailgate = 7 hours 14 minutes to do the doors





I really don't think there are many people out there who are honestly compounding at 1" per second during an entire compounding session
Click to expand...


I got ya now! Yeah on the rupes 21 it can correct faster than 1 inch a second


Sent from my Alien ship
 
I edited the math, to account for a section pass as up/down...not up/down and left/right
 
I wonder what the abrasives in a DAT polish like FG400 look like at the end of compounding a 2'x2' section at 1" per second?

I would think they are broken down completely and the area you started in receives a lot more cutting than the area you finished in

Makes me wonder if the DAT and SMAT logically require different arm speed to get uniform cut on the entire section?
 
If ultra-slow arm speed is more effective, is it possible that fewer passes would be required to accomplish the same result?
 
Kappy - Definitely:

For example (im using completely random numbers in this calculation):

For DA, you have oscillation and rotation:
Oscillation: 1000 Oscillations/minute or 16.67oscillations/second
Rotation: 600 Oscillations/minute or 10 rotations per second.

So if you have a 12" section that you're doing in 12 seconds (1" per second). You will end up with 200 Oscillations of the pad, and 120 rotations of the pad in that area.

If you do 2"/second, you end up with HALF the oscillations and rotations abrading/correcting the paint.

Basically slower pass = more time on paint = more oscillations/rotations = more correction.

Sorry for the long explanation
 
beamerstrumpet said:
you guys really need to watch and listen to this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsOFu-AzeUM

When you say no 50% overlap , are you overlapping at all? I probably go about 15 to 25% overlap. But I do try to go slow. even more aware of it now after watching that vid.
Click to expand...

This looks ULTRA slow, much slower than 1s/inch. I question whether more product would be needed to cover a section using this slow an arm speed. I would imagine the pad, the product, and the surface would all get a lot hotter using his speed rather than the recommended 1s/inch. Since he is going so slow more friction is being created which would certainly create deeper cut; however, it would burn up the product quick.
 
When calculating how long a section would take you do not have to factor in the fact that the pad is a circle. Yes the area of a circle is different that that of a same LxW square. However, you are moving the circle horizontally and vertically, so you are only concerned with the length and height of the pad. If you have a 24"x24" section using a 6" pad at 1"/s that would take 24 seconds to do one cross section. You would need to do a total of 4 cross sections to complete 1 section pass. This would bring you 96s for one section pass. In order to factor in the 50% overlap you simply multiply 96s by 1.5 which gives you 144s. So with a 24"x24" section using a 6" pad while moving at 1"/s with 50% overlap it would take 2:24. To take it further, it is suggested that 6 section passes be taken when doing compounding or polishing. So 6x144s=864s which is 8:24 for one section. Now, given that we are all human we can simply say that a 24"x24" section with a 6" pad should take between 8-9minutes.
 
Relentless58

Three things:

It takes 7 passes to cover a 24"x24" section with 50% overlap, not 6. I had to draw it on a piece of graph paper to get my brain around it

Moving the pad 24", leaves the corners unpolished, because the pad is round. To fully polish all of a 24x24...the pad would have to travel 30" in both directions. I choose to leave this out of my calculation.


1 pass = 24 seconds

7 passes required x 24 seconds each = 168 seconds

Making 6 section passes = 16 minutes 48 seconds



How would the 21mm stroke of a Rupes affect these calculations
 
allenk4 said:
Relentless58

Three things:

It takes 7 passes to cover a 24"x24" section with 50% overlap, not 6. I had to draw it on a piece of graph paper to get my brain around it

Moving the pad 24", leaves the corners unpolished, because the pad is round. To fully polish all of a 24x24...the pad would have to travel 30" in both directions. I choose to leave this out of my calculation.


1 pass = 24 seconds

7 passes required x 24 seconds each = 168 seconds

Making 6 section passes = 16 minutes 48 seconds



How would the 21mm stroke of a Rupes affect these calculations
Click to expand...


Do you remember the Hernandez section passes Kyle? :laughing:
 
allenk4 said:
Relentless58

Three things:

It takes 7 passes to cover a 24"x24" section with 50% overlap, not 6. I had to draw it on a piece of graph paper to get my brain around it

Moving the pad 24", leaves the corners unpolished, because the pad is round. To fully polish all of a 24x24...the pad would have to travel 30" in both directions. I choose to leave this out of my calculation.


1 pass = 24 seconds

7 passes required x 24 seconds each = 168 seconds

Making 6 section passes = 16 minutes 48 seconds



How would the 21mm stroke of a Rupes affect these calculations
Click to expand...

I just drew it out as well...7 passes it is! Man, 17 minutes to do 1 section is horrible! No wonder everybody moves faster. Maybe the 1"/s we are all referring to was never actually a scientifically found best practice and was perhaps an estimate of speed. Honestly, imagine how much more product we would all use if we spend 17 minutes per section, that stuff would burn up so fast from the heat.

Per your question about the 21mm stroke...I am not really sure.
To make math easier (given that I was wrong about the # of passes, I really do need easy math) i converted the 21mm to .8". Now what i don't know is what to do next, and here is why. Since DA polishers are random, we really don't know how long it takes for it to take that extra .8" into a complete circle. I would assume that it only takes a few seconds, but thats purely a guess. Moving on and taking a few assumptions with me, I have to think about how this 21mm reach is measured. It makes sense to me that it is measured as the amount of reach or extension the arm moves laterals in terms of radius. Therefore, if it says it has a 21mm(.8") reach then it actually means it extends .4" laterally one way and .4" laterally the opposite way. What this really means is that instead of having a 6" pad you now have a 6.8" pad. Knowing this the calculations just follow as they did before. Honestly though, its still gonna be a long time. Knowing that we are starting at 17 minutes... I'm completely content with learning to move slower than I do; however, I am not going to spend that amount of time on a section so the answer has no value to me.
 
I have always been drawn to the scientific side of detailing. I enjoy some of the more learned members attempt to quantify, via math, chemistry, etc. in explaining what may or may not be happening. In this case i have come to apply what i can only describe as "feeling" the affects of the buffing pass. I would categorize my arm speed as slow but it is also associated with good and proper lighting and visually and carefully inspecting the paint while i am working that pad/product/machine speeds/arm speed.

My test spot yielded exactly what i want for that paint and for THAT step (compunding, middle polish, final polish etc.). I have found an arm speed that works best for each application but will admit it is closer to 1"/second than anything faster. Again, it's a "feel" i've developed over some years and seeing its affect on that paint.

I am not dismissing the science offered here...just saying i have found what i like in terms of results with various speeds by feeling whats happening from initial application through breakdown and finish. However, i will admit to being absolutely stumped on some online videos i have seen where the operator is buzzing along with his finish step at unbelievable arm speeds!
 
Last edited:
I have watched a lot of "polishing porn" by, Mike Stoops, Kevin Brown, Larry Kosilla and others. I have watched Mike Stoops in person.

None of these guys are compounding, much less polishing at 1" per second


As I get more hours on the polisher, I find it less like the regimented "mowing the lawn" style, where everything gets the same treatment. I now find myself identifying the deeper defects in a section and giving them more attention with edging technique and additional passes.

I have also started doing 4 compounding passes, then identifying any remaining trouble spots (RIDS) and attacking them with a 3" DAMF on my PC. I have found this produces better results and can be a big time saver
 
Trying to remember what I do, I think I start out a little on the faster side until the product starts to thin out and I can begin working it. Then it's down to a much slower speed.
And like allenk4- I go very slow over the "trouble" areas that need the most attention.
 
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