Remove water spots without stripping sealant?

[GSKR]

IM not a picture post guy,I like to pull up get key do detail and get check and move on ,I've worked on stuff you can't imagine Michael Jordan jet ,citi furniture jet,magic jack jet.I can't stand there and take pics I have a schedule to keep,some guys have a car for a week and can take a photo of everything,I'm by myself I gotta keep moving.

 

[MrOneEyedBoh]

To the OP.... I've had water spots similar to those and Carpro water spot remover took care of it.

Does that stuff compromise the lsp?

 

[StangFan25]

Does that stuff compromise the lsp?

I don't believe so. It's suppose to be safe for use on CQuartz so I'd assume it's LSP safe.

 

[builthatch]

Lolz. The durability of the product has nothing to do with how susceptible it is to water spotting. Some of the most durable (LIFETIME) coatings are the most prone to water spots.

Water spots are a function of the environment. Not a specific product on the paint.

The rain is bad where the OP lives. Water spots will need to be polished off.

i disagree. spots that would etch paint and breach all OTC waxes and sealants might appear on coatings (they aren't forcefields), but they don't breach the coating and are less likely to actually etch, depending on the product. obviously not all coatings are the same so maybe some do get affected in this manner, but the coatings i use don't. often you can use a mild water spot dissolving product on spots on a coating and they will disappear, or, a very mild chemical cleaning from Poli-Seal will do the trick if the coating is not cured all the way or if it's not a professional level product.

i live in an area with very acidic and very common sea gull poo. the coating i have, Opti-Coat, is unaffected by this. thus, water spots are also not going to affect it. the doo "damage" might appear to have affected the coating when wiped off, i mean, it will really appear to have etched, but the residual is indeed topical and often will disappear on its own over time. if you don't have the patience for that, then again a mild chemical cleaning with Poli-Seal will make it disappear without breaching the coating.

Does that stuff compromise the lsp?

depends on what your LSP actually is. it most likely will affect sealants and waxes, but, they are easy to replace and probably sacrificed themselves anyway to help keep the clear from being as affected as it otherwise would.

it shouldn't affect coatings because, as mentioned, it is compatible with CarPro paint coatings.

 

[Rsurfer]

i live in an area with very acidic and very common sea gull poo. the coating i have, Opti-Coat, is unaffected by this. thus, water spots are also not going to affect it. the doo "damage" might appear to have affected the coating when wiped off, i mean, it will really appear to have etched, but the residual is indeed topical and often will disappear on its own over time. if you don't have the patience for that, then again a mild chemical cleaning with Poli-Seal will make it disappear without breaching the coating.



Opti-coat 2, Opti Gloss Coat and Opti Pro will not stop water spots in all areas of the US period.

 

[builthatch]

Opti-coat 2, Opti Gloss Coat and Opti Pro will not stop water spots in all areas of the US period.

i feel like i'm repeating myself.

they don't prevent water spots, if that is what you mean by "stop" water spots. coatings aren't an active forcefield. but they help "stop" water spots from damaging the finish, which, ultimately, is the purpose of a coating - protection of the investment. as i mentioned, when on a cured coated surface, the spots end up being topical, not intrusive. and thus, are often removed with a chemical spot remover without damaging the LSP.

whereas with a lesser LSP, they will be intrusive and breach the LSP. and a common water spot remover would remove the LSP altogether anyway.

 

[BryanH]

What's interesting to me is I've had various cars live outside in the past 15 years, with all kinds of different waxes (or lack thereof) and I can't recall rainwater having this effect on any of them before. Sprinkler water is another story. But I haven't learned to be paranoid of the rain like I have sprinklers. You'd think if this was a normal occurrence I'd have developed a bit of a hatred for rain by now.

Simple answer ,throw powerlock in garbage detail again using iron x and use a more durable product for the lsp or maybe a coating so this won't happen again.

I always use IronX when doing a full detail. Interestingly, PowerLock didn't protect my freshly-polished plastic headlight lenses for even a month before they yellowed/clouded up again. I always thought it was a highly regarded sealant. My own experience has been that it doesn't last. Sure is nice to apply and buff off though!

To the OP.... I've had water spots similar to those and Carpro water spot remover took care of it.

Thanks. It's on my Wish List here at AG. I think for now I am going to try a test spot of Ultimate Polish since I have some lying around and it's got a bit of filler in it. I have some light streaks in the paint from the one time I dried it with a waffle weave towel after a wash. Did I mention the soft paint? (I got a DP Turbo Dryer after that!)

 

[builthatch]

I can't recall rainwater having this effect on any of them before. Sprinkler water is another story.

i agree. in fact, i will often rinse my car off in the rain and let the rain act as a spot less rinse, since it very rarely spots around here.

 

[explorerlyon]

I had 2 coats BFWD and 2 coats of Blackfire Midnight Sun Wax recently applied. Sprinklers hit the hood of my car. Had to polish the hood to get them out. Seems nothing stops hard water.

 

[MrOneEyedBoh]

Yeah I had water spots cut thru WDGPS within a week.. I just live with them and polish off fall time. I moved to a new area and the rain water sucks here. I used to polish in spring. I guess it's spring and fall now... At least a very fine polish seems to work well and thus not removing much clear coat

 

[Rsurfer]

Yeah I had water spots cut thru WDGPS within a week.. I just live with them and polish off fall time. I moved to a new area and the rain water sucks here. I used to polish in spring. I guess it's spring and fall now... At least a very fine polish seems to work well and thus not removing much clear coat

I had 2 coats BFWD and 2 coats of Blackfire Midnight Sun Wax recently applied. Sprinklers hit the hood of my car. Had to polish the hood to get them out. Seems nothing stops hard water.

You guys should use Opti coat like Buildhatch recommends..cause it will not let water spots etch your clear coat. Which by the way I do not agree with. IMO it will not stop hard water from etching your clear coat.

 

[builthatch]

You guys should use Opti coat like Buildhatch recommends..cause it will not let water spots etch your clear coat. Which by the way I do not agree with. IMO it will not stop hard water from etching your clear coat.

a coating is certainly your best option.

some food for thought...

water spot removers were mentioned.

both CarPro and Optimum offer these water spot removing chemicals to remove water spots without polishing. they are acidic and break down the spotting, but don't harm the coating.

the reason they offer this is because hard water spots are prone to baking onto the coatings, as opposed to INTO the coatings or even worse, through the coatings. so, a properly designed acid solution will remove the spots, leaving your coating spot free.

ultimately, my point is the best option to add an appreciable protective barrier to the paint that is actually harder than your clear coat?

a coating.

a wax or sealant have no chance vs. most or maybe even all of the hard water that's out there. resin-like paint coatings are specifically designed to stand a very good chance against all of it. i mean, sheesh, Opti-Coat removal risks are listed as paint stripper, heavy inorganic acids or abrasion. even if coatings were susceptible to eventual damage to 15-20% of the hard water out there, wax or sealant is susceptible to probably 95% of it.

 

[MrOneEyedBoh]

I want to use gloss coat, but I'm afraid I'll streak etc on my dark blue paint...

 

[BryanH]

Coatings are definitely something I want to look into (so many choices, as always in the detailing world!) for the future. Because I like shiny cars more than I like the process of achieving or maintaining a great finish. I still wish I knew what was used on one of my cars more than 10 years ago (I've only had it 9 years), because it's still working and that seems impossible. I should make a separate thread about that because I simply can't believe it and I'm dying to know what on earth is so effective!

Edit - here's another interesting thing about all this. I went to my parents' house and washed my mom's car this evening. I detailed it a couple years ago and its protection is pretty much nil by now. But it was outside in the same rain my water-spotted car was, and guess what - her car didn't have any water spots like that. My guess is the water sheeted off instead of beading up and evaporating the minerals onto the paint.

 

[BryanH]

Hmm. The beatings will continue until morale improves?

The water spots sure are stubborn. Here's everything that I have that I thought might work, and all of them have failed to remove the water spots:

From what I understand vinegar is supposed to be a mineral deposit remover, although it's not designed for automotive paint (lack of lubricity etc). Is it safe to say if vinegar doesn't help, then something like CarPro or Optimum water spot remover probably wouldn't work either?

As I found before when I detailed this car the first time 3 months ago, only one product seems to help the paint at all - Pinnacle Advanced Swirl Remover. I don't know if this paint is finicky, or if this product is just that much better, but it's a standout for me on this car. It has a nice long working time too.

But even it can only reduce the appearance of the water spots by about 2/3rds. The first application does the work. A second one doesn't seem to help any further.

This was all done with a Meguiar's G110v2 on Speed 4 with Meguiars yellow polishing pads. Except for the vinegar and Klasse - those were done by hand.

And just for kicks I did a 50/50 with Meguiar's #7 Glaze (by hand with a foam applicator) on an area that I'd just clarified with Pinnacle ASR. I can't tell a lick of difference at all. People rave about this stuff, but I'm obviously doing something wrong!

Signed,
Confused and slightly discouraged.

 

[sunday joe]

I agree but they already have the straight jacket hanging by the garage door. If they see me out there blow drying I am sure the patty wagon would come down the street :laughing:. I will try that next time tho.

Dave

Doesn't Auto Geek provide a Certificate of Sanity with your order ?

 

[davidc]

Those stubborn spots are what I was referring to that gave me this paranoid affliction. Now my incident was probably about 30 years ago on single stage enamel and it took 3M Super Duty and a wool pad to take care of the problem. There was not the vast selection of compounds like there is today but I think your going to have to get more aggressive with your compound. As for the Sanity part I believe they release all responsibility after the sale. It is in the very small writing on the invoice.

Dave

 

[BryanH]

Update: success! :buffing:Im the MAN

I did have to start over, basically, and although I was trying to avoid that when I started this thread, ultimately I wanted the spots gone.

In one last ditch effort I decided to get very aggressive. I picked up some M105 at Autozone (overpriced, I know, but patience was not on my side today!) and paired it with a microfiber cutting disc, high pad rotating speed and firm pressure. M105 has not been my favorite in the past because of the dusting and how it can be tricky to use, which is why I never replaced it when I ran out of my first bottle. But when you have to break out the big guns, you gotta do what you gotta do.

I made sure to keep my working time short and my sections small, and used a bit of clay lube here and there. I was pleasantly surprised by the finish I was getting with M105. It wasn't half bad!

What water spots?

I dig this color. Copper Red, Mazda calls it. The gold flake adds so much when the paint is clarified enough that you can see it.

After this I put a couple of polishes up against each other to decide what to use on the rest of the car. I had my trusty inexpensive Meguiars Ultimate Polish around, which I knew would give solid results. The challenger was Pinnacle Advanced Finishing Polish. I was so impressed by my friend's Pinnacle's Advanced Swirl Remover the first time I detailed this car, I had to buy some of my own and I added their polish to my cart, because why not [raise your hand if you suffer the same affliction!].

On the left we have Pinnacle AFP. The middle is the tape line which shows how M105 finished on its own. The right is Meguiars UP. This shows that even if M105 looks good in isolation, there's definitely more clarity on offer with a finishing polish.

[ Edit: Pinnacle AFP was applied with a black foam finishing pad, and Meguiars UP was applied with a yellow polishing pad. ]

I can't tell any difference between the polishes, even with the naked eye (which is far better than my photography skills ). I was a little surprised at this given one has some fillers and one does not.

I'll be using the Meguiars UP on the rest of the car when I get back to it tomorrow. I'll keep Pinnacle AFP around for other opportunities. Given the price difference, unless I see AFP stand out on other cars I test with, I'll be sticking with Meguiars UP and M205 to satisfy my cheapskate side.

Thanks again for all the help folks!

 

[Bunky]

Duragloss Water Spot Remover works in some cases and does not remove the LSP.

 

[GSKR]

That pinnacle line is good stuff