Rotary needed for oxidation?

[Lilskeezer]

I am fairly new to detailing and am working with a Flex XC 3401 VRG. It has worked great on swirl marks but I am having trouble removing heavier oxodized area, especially on the hood. I have used Pinnacle Advanced Siwlrl Mark Remover, and Meguiars 105/205 with no luck. I would be up for learning to work with a rotary, but I've heard too many horror stories of burning the paint or just causing serious damage (that I can't afford). What's your opinion? Is a rotary that difficult to learn how to use? I feel I am capable and coordinated enough, but I am hoping for any of your rotary pros' opinions. Thanks!

 

[ASPHALT ROCKET]

I am fairly new to detailing and am working with a Flex XC 3401 VRG. It has worked great on swirl marks but I am having trouble removing heavier oxodized area, especially on the hood. I have used Pinnacle Advanced Siwlrl Mark Remover, and Meguiars 105/205 with no luck. I would be up for learning to work with a rotary, but I've heard too many horror stories of burning the paint or just causing serious damage (that I can't afford). What's your opinion? Is a rotary that difficult to learn how to use? I feel I am capable and coordinated enough, but I am hoping for any of your rotary pros' opinions. Thanks!

Honestly a rotary isn't that hard to use. It is all about common sense and paying attention. For some reason people have to post making using a rotary so difficult and causing damage. Like I said above common sense and paying attention will go along way in using any tool. A rotary will reduce your correction time, actually make the finish look nicer and you can use a wool pad. Hope this helps, if you have any other questions ask away.

 

[Harleyguy]

I am fairly new to detailing and am working with a Flex XC 3401 VRG. It has worked great on swirl marks but I am having trouble removing heavier oxodized area, especially on the hood. I have used Pinnacle Advanced Siwlrl Mark Remover, and Meguiars 105/205 with no luck. I would be up for learning to work with a rotary, but I've heard too many horror stories of burning the paint or just causing serious damage (that I can't afford). What's your opinion? Is a rotary that difficult to learn how to use? I feel I am capable and coordinated enough, but I am hoping for any of your rotary pros' opinions. Thanks!

If you have a single stage paint you can get pretty aggresive with a rotary don't get me wrong you still have to watch what you are doing as far as edges and mouldings.Single stage paint cars in my opinion are great to learn on with a rotary .Take a look at Mike P's extreme MGB makover that was a single stage paint that was really bad.We used rotary's on it was a great car to learn on.ASHAULT ROCKET is also a rotary master .:xyxthumbs:

 

[SpotlessDetail]

I just stared using one about a year ago and still cant figure out why everyone is so scared of them. Like everyone said common sense and pay attention. Wheel up to hard lines not on them is gona be your biggest concern. I bought one and right away used a red pad and 3M Perfect It Ultra Fine Machine Polish on my truck. A very very very light combo that couldnt harm the paint if I tried. From there I was confident. No problems yet.

 

[sullysdetailing]

I just stared using one about a year ago and still cant figure out why everyone is so scared of them. Like everyone said common sense and pay attention. Wheel up to hard lines not on them is gona be your biggest concern. I bought one and right away used a red pad and 3M Perfect It Ultra Fine Machine Polish on my truck. A very very very light combo that couldnt harm the paint if I tried. From there I was confident. No problems yet.

X2 After I took the 102 class all my fears went away.

 

[14automobiles]

I just stared using one about a year ago and still cant figure out why everyone is so scared of them. Like everyone said common sense and pay attention. Wheel up to hard lines not on them is gona be your biggest concern. I bought one and right away used a red pad and 3M Perfect It Ultra Fine Machine Polish on my truck. A very very very light combo that couldnt harm the paint if I tried. From there I was confident. No problems yet.

What does "wheel up to hard lines not on them" mean. I have not heard that expression before.

 

[ASPHALT ROCKET]

What does "wheel up to hard lines not on them" mean. I have not heard that expression before.

I guess he is using slang to say when you are moving the buffer close to the edge. People will say wheel the buffer from time to time.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I am fairly new to detailing and am working with a Flex XC 3401 VRG. It has worked great on swirl marks but I am having trouble removing heavier oxodized area, especially on the hood.

Are you sure it's oxidized and not clear coat failure?

Unless it's an older car it's probably got a clear coat finish and clear coats don't really oxidize as much as they become all swirled out. It's common for people to mistake clear coat failure for oxidation but they are completely different problems.

That's why we have this,

The Clearcoat Failure Photo Gallery Archive


Click on the link and look at some of the pictures and see if any of the pictures resemble what you're working on.

Note that when clear coat failure is just starting, the clear layer won't be flaking off but instead turning whitish like oxidation but it's not a topical problem, it's a change taking place throughout the entire layer of the clear paint.


Also, when buffing the sides, are you pulling color? As in, is the color of the car coming off and onto your buffing pad? If not, that's a pretty strong indicator that you're working on a clear coat.

 

[Lilskeezer]

Are you sure it's oxidized and not clear coat failure?

Unless it's an older car it's probably got a clear coat finish and clear coats don't really oxidize as much as they become all swirled out. It's common for people to mistake clear coat failure for oxidation but they are completely different problems.

That's why we have this,

The Clearcoat Failure Photo Gallery Archive


Click on the link and look at some of the pictures and see if any of the pictures resemble what you're working on.

Note that when clear coat failure is just starting, the clear layer won't be flaking off but instead turning whitish like oxidation but it's not a topical problem, it's a change taking place throughout the entire layer of the clear paint.


Also, when buffing the sides, are you pulling color? As in, is the color of the car coming off and onto your buffing pad? If not, that's a pretty strong indicator that you're working on a clear coat.

Thanks Mike, great info as always! I am still a bit of a newb to professional detailing, so I believe I may have used the incorrect terminology. What problem I saw with the paint (that wasn't corrected after I was finished) was that there were many water marks still seen in the hood when the paint was viewed at specific angles. The paint was in nowhere near as bad of shape as the pics in the gallery. I did encounter a few spots where I picked up paint onto my pad, but I only noticed it after I reached a particular point of the car (I believe it was on the doors, above the window). I used a Flex DA w/ Meguiars 105 & 205 which removed almost all of the swirl marks, so I was surprised to see so many water marks still imbedded in the finish. Any suggestions on this? I assumed that I needed to get more aggressive with the correction ie. using a rotary buffer, but I am definitely open to suggestions. Thanks Mike and everyone else!!

 

[Bimmerfan]

I have same problem with the water spots on my black hood and trunk.I am also new to this. I used porter cable XP with xmt #3 polish but no way. than after reading this forum and I want on menzerna power gloss on DA. I worked on my trunk 2 hour but 70% of spots still there. I think DA is not capable to remove that kind of marks. you need more heat to cut the paint little bit farther. I had my car to bring to professional detailer and he sad that it is not possible to remove even on rotary but I think he was wrong becouse he was afraid to burn the paint. I decided to wait till spring and get rotary and see if it works if not I have to live with it till I 'll get another car

 

[The Apprentice]

Honestly a rotary isn't that hard to use. It is all about common sense and paying attention. For some reason people have to post making using a rotary so difficult and causing damage. Like I said above common sense and paying attention will go along way in using any tool. A rotary will reduce your correction time, actually make the finish look nicer and you can use a wool pad. Hope this helps, if you have any other questions ask away.

I couldn't agree with you more.

The rotary has a bad image because it was mainly used with the wool pad, which could get really hot and induce serious swirls. With the invention of cutting pads and fine compounds, the rotary is able to [almost] duplicate results achieved only with the wool pads without causing too much hazes and swirls.

With an orange cutting pad, the rotary literally has to be at the same spot for [roughly] over 10 seconds to start burning the clear coat. You wouldn't even do that with a PC at speed 5 anyway. Anybody with common sense would never do that.

 

[Bradshaw]

Could be acid rain, hard to say, you can throw the kitchen sink at acid rain and it will just smile at you. On some hoods I've spent 1-2 hours alone just getting it to my standards, even with the right tools it can take alot of time, so keep that in mind. Like Rocket said, rotary is not to be feared but respected.