Something a little different

nrengle

nrengle

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Something a little different



Ok so something a little different from paint protection on a vehicle. I need to find something that works good for a vinyl wrap. And this is gonna be kinda specific.

I've used some of the products here in the past with great success in the music world of protecting finishes on drums and guitars (especially for the sweaty guy that their sweat will cause strings to rust overnight).

Now I'm looking for something for a vinyl drum kit wrap. What I'm having most issues with is the marring is starting to build up from daily cleaning. It has be cleaned daily due to pyro that we use. It's a combination of black powder, magnesium, charcoal, and Isopar (isoparaffin).

So it needs to be robust, and easy cleaning as this stuff is gnarly. For perspective on how gnarly it is to metal, I usually use a citric acid cleaner that you spray on, wait 10 seconds, and wipe off with a wet cloth, and then a dry one for the cymbals.

This case I have to use Brass-o as the only thing I can use by hand to get the reside and such off the cymbals.

I'm thinking maybe Opti-coat cause I have it here, but don't want to ruin a custom one of a kind finish (though my printer and artist love me and will just get a new wrap if we really have to, just a pain in the butt to install).

Here's the specifics from my printer:

It's a hybrid PVC/Photostock media I get from Epson. The outer coating is a special UV Overlaminate I get out of Oregon from some hippy commune, LOL. Sorta kidding, but not really. It's an equivalent to a 5mil Glossy Heat Lam.

Here's an example of what it looks like:


View attachment 69350

View attachment 69351

View attachment 69352

View attachment 69353

It's hard to tell in the blue photo's but that's how it looks under an intense wash (lighting term). You can see in the next two photo's how it reflects as a print, and not paint.

So, thoughts guys? Obviously I've got time since my industry will be last to open up in this whole craziness.




:)
 
Very cool 'project'. I would coat them. It should not harm the wrap. (I'd do a test spot first to see)

Opticoat would work on the drums/wrap, and perhaps a dedicated metal coating for the cymbals once they are polished up.


Very interesting and will be subscribed to see updates on this!

(And I like the band's music as well!)
 
Talking to my wrap guy, he does a lot for Tama and other artists too (He's done the last couple Anthrax kits, the Starbucks inspired, and the purple pentagram kit). Tama clear coats over those after a they install. So with that being said, what product do you think would work to hold up to a daily cleaning and no hazing. One thing to keep in mind some kits are very sensitive to stuff on the shells with regards to resonance. The wrap already clamps down the kit a touch, much like I'm actually holding the shell while someone plays it.

And sizzle, if you've seen them since 2008 I've been there. I've been Mikey's guy for that long now (and years ago hooked up a couple dudes from AG when we played the area).
 
I don't think a coating would change the resonance at all.

And I think that any well respective coating should hold up...at least better than not having anything on their at all.

You may also need to change your cleaning product to something a little less 'aggressive'. And if coated, it may not need anything more than a good waterless wash...even though the contaminants sound like they are some serious stuff!!!


That's super cool! Really neat to be on the 'inside track' with some stars/famous people!
 
Cool. I'll see if I can get him to send a printed sample over, and then i'll put it through the ringer for dirt and such after a coat of Opti-coat. Just wipe on and walk away right? I actually have some Isopar here as it's a great solvent but I wouldn't use it on paint. Did it once cause I had too, dumped two bottles of water on it immediately after, was a bit dull afterwards....
 
Here's my article on the Polymer Net Shield or PNS

SONAX Polymer Net Shield - Closest thing to a coating without being a coating



And I recently reviewed the 3D paint coating,

Review: 3D Paint Coating and 3D One Cutting Compound and Finishing Polish

In post #4 - there's a Frequently Ask Questions section about the product PROVIDED by Tunch, the chemist.

in Question 4 the answer says it can be applied to alloy, which I usually take to mean aluminum. Could include brass too....

Maybe a metal expert can chime in?



Also - Gtechniq C5 Wheel Armor might be something to take a look at.



:)
 
Mike thank you.

The PNS looks interesting and easy enough to apply that my colleagues could use it without much though.

That being said what would you recommend for cleaning after application?

Some of the cleaners and such in our industry are snake oil, and many are harsh. A lot of them I find (20 years of trying a lot of them) leave a residue behind that seems to attract haze/fog fluid (think vape fluid, it's the same base ingredients) and everything else in the air, (pyro, confetti, glitter, white powders).

I was thinking a waterless wash afterwards as a top up cleaner.


:)
 
nrengle said:
.

I was thinking a waterless wash afterwards as a top up cleaner.
Click to expand...


I'd suggest testing out a bottle of SONAX Glass Cleaner. I use this for all kinds of things.

If it will leave STREAK-FREE glass doesn't that imply it's not leaving something behind?

Streaks = something


Good enough for me and the cars I work on....


SONAX Glass Cleaner as a Prep Wash

Glass_Cleaner_Prep_Wash_09.JPG



:)
 
Funny you mention glass cleaner, a lot of my colleagues and myself, from time to time, use ammonia free Windex to clean some of the shells. It works well on hardware, but this wrap, not so much. I grabbed a 3D waterless wash to try since the price was right (and also so I can try on my SUV at same time hahahah).

I received my sample print material today, so when the AG order comes in Saturday I'll start my test
 
Mike Phillips said:
in Question 4 the answer says it can be applied to alloy, which I usually take to mean aluminum. Could include brass too....

Maybe a metal expert can chime in?

:)
Click to expand...


I thought I heard my phone ringing. :laughing:

Yes, brass is an alloy and it mainly consists of copper and zinc. The % of zinc added can be varied in order to control/influence the material properties of the alloy.

But since we are talking about brass in the context of cymbals, I'm pretty sure that most (but not all) cymbals nowadays are actually bronze, which is an alloy of copper and tin. The "sound" of the cymbal can be partly influenced by the % of tin used in the alloy (manufacturing methods - hammering, annealing or tempering, etc. will also affect the material properties and thus the "sound" as well).
 
57Rambler said:
I thought I heard my phone ringing. :laughing:

Yes, brass is an alloy and it mainly consists of copper and zinc. The % of zinc added can be varied in order to control/influence the material properties of the alloy.

But since we are talking about brass in the context of cymbals, I'm pretty sure that most (but not all) cymbals nowadays are actually bronze, which is an alloy of copper and tin. The "sound" of the cymbal can be partly influenced by the % of tin used in the alloy (manufacturing methods - hammering, annealing or tempering, etc. will also affect the material properties and thus the "sound" as well).
Click to expand...

Ok that makes me feel better. I know what a lot of these are made of, and just wanted to run it by some people that might have experience with the product. If you want to come over and check them out after this weekend I'm over in the Grovetucky Area by Central Crossing.
 
Just curious, did your wrap guy say anything about applying heat. I know in the car wrap industry they apply heat to clean up marring after installation. I don't know if it works on chemical marring too.
 
This stuff would burn if exposed to high heat from a heat gun. Ask me how I know lol!
 
That doesn't sound right. But, I'm not an expert in the field.

Most vinyls are designed to conform. A lot of time that involves adding heat. Heat guns are typical. Though for larger areas sometimes a radiant heater.

The only way it should burn is if you worked too close, had the heat set too high or held the heat on one location for too long.

What brand of heat gun did you use? Steinel is a popular professional gun with adjustable heat that a lot of vinyl wrap guys use.
 
It's not really vinyl is the thing. Think heavy card stock photo paper. And it's just a Wagner gun from Lowe's.
 
Ok, so got my package late last night, got to work on my project today, and figured I'd update here.

To catch everyone up, looking for a product that works well on wraps that go on drum shells (think a heavy card stock/photo paper type material you print on a plotter or large scale printer). For the most part they always look good, but get some marring in them due to the stresses of the road (constant cleaning, setup, tear down, cases getting slammed in trucks, etc). Well what better time than now that the industry is closed for a bit to test.

Here's what I got, two samples from my wrap printer (more on the way from a few drum companies I'm very involved with), in different colors to see if there's any kinda of color change. Test is as follows, split both samples in half, one will of each coated with Sonax PNS, one untreated (since most techs don't take the extra effort). Both we're cleaned with 91% alcohol as it's what I had on hand and allowed to flash off. The PNS will cure overnight, and then I will spray both with a light mist of Isopar (a type of pyro fluid we use, I'll see if I can get a video). Allowed to dry, and then I'll clean half of each one a few hours later with my typical drum cleaner (stuff called Shell Shine), and then 3D waterless wash on the other half. I'm trying to keep it looking best as long as possible, and as clean as possible, not cleaning daily is not an option unfortunately.

The last four pictures are this. First two are with no PSN, just a alcohol wipe, second two are with the PSN on it. Those two already feel noticeably slicker, and not as grabby as just the plain wrap. Updates to come.

View attachment 69454View attachment 69455View attachment 69456View attachment 69457View attachment 69458View attachment 69459
 
Just a quick update, no pictures. Applied PNS on sunday, let it sit for 24 hours, sprayed some Isopar on it from a old clean spray bottle (I tested that it's still potent, if you aerosolize this stuff and spray across flame you get a nice fireball!). I let it dry for a couple hours to simulate pyro test for fire marshalls to show time. It wiped right up with both the Shell Shine (drum cleaner I usually use), and 3D waterless wash. The treated pieces are noticeably slicker than the untreated. The untreated is grabby in comparison. The treated pieces, the 3D is my personal favorite as it's incredibly slick now.

I sprayed Isopar on again, and it beaded up quite nicely on the treated pieces, and kinda pooled on the untreated. I'm leaving it for 24 hours to simulate from a show day to a day off, to a load in (that's a little more than 24 hours, but it will be enough time for me). Ill update with photo's later during todays session.
 
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