The FLEX BEAST, Supa BEAST & CBEAST - 8mm Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers

[JustJesus]

Thanks for the "edging" tip, Doc!

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[Craig Encinitas]

The FLEX BEAST, Supa BEAST & CBEAST - 8mm Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers

Anyone watch?

Comments?

Good, Bad? Ugly?

Very informative.
Your assistant’s interruptions disrupts the flow of your demonstration.
My honest feedback.


I ordered one yesterday, but it turns out I bought the FLEX 15mm battery operated polisher. It’s already been shipped.

Oops.

That’s what I get for placing an order at five in the morning.

 

[JustJesus]

Oops

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[Craig Encinitas]

The FLEX BEAST, Supa BEAST & CBEAST - 8mm Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers

Yeah. seriously. Might keep it, though.
I could practice on some fleet vehicles out in the parking lot at work. Or actually do some mobile detail jobs.

Got it for 25% off at least.
I read the fine print, I don’t think AG covers return shipping on items bought in error.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Re: The FLEX BEAST, Supa BEAST & CBEAST - 8mm Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers

Cool video! I enjoy watching these with a bowl of popcorn!

I myself love the Beast and the CBeast. I couldn’t be without a forced rotation DA machine.

Once you start doing paint correction with a gear-driven orbital - it's hard to go back to free spinning tools simply due the wasted time from pad stalling.

Soon will be adding the Supa Beast to my Flex family.

My first tool of choice.

Try it with the new RUPES CP foam pads - true synchronicity.

I’m glad you mentioned the backing plate is a wear item. A good way to tell is when edging, if the pad starts walking off the center of the backing plate. Then it’s time.

Correct.

And It's VITAL to have the best possible hook and loop attachment when edging with any orbital because it's possible for the pad to go flying off and if you're not AWAKE the backing plate (now with out a pad), can grind into the paint.

Ouch.

For those that don't do edging with either the BEAST or the Supa BEAST - if you're pad does start to walk-off or move-off center besides noticing the "feel" of the orbit stroke getting LARGER - if you pay attention you will also here this sound,

WOMP WOMP WOMP...

That's the sound of the pad moving around on the backing plate - basically creeping off the backing plate and if you don't catch it - it will fly off.


Edging is not for the newbie or faint of heart. If you're not sure what edging is, there's multiple techniques called edging, but in the context of what Jim and I are talking about - it's this version of edging.


From post #2 here,

If you spend enough time behind any tool you can make it dance on paint -Mike Phillips





Edging with the FLEX 3401 at one of our detailing classes


How to use the Flex 3401 to remove swirls & water spots

Buffing a tight area UP ON EDGE using a RUPES BigFoot 21

Custom Paint Job - 1980 Corvette - RUPES & Gyeon - Extreme Show Car Makeover at Autogeek


Buffing on edge with the RUPES BigFoot 21 Mark II

I cover this technique on page 64 of my RUPES how-to book.

You would also be surprised at the adhesion strength from a worn backing plate compared to a new one.

For anyone using these machines heavily, I highly suggest keeping a spare backing plate in stock.

Wise recommendation. And here's the link to get your spare.


Spare Backing Plate for the FLEX BEAST


And here's the link to get a spare backing plate for the Supa BEAST - NOTE: These are VERY DIFFERENT backing plates and are not interchangeable from BEAST to Supa BEAST


Supa BEAST 6" Backing Plate


Also note - The Autogeek store pages lists the replacement backing plate for the Supa BEAST as a replacement backing plate for the FLEX XFE 7-15 aka The FINISHER. While this is correct, it's ALSO the replacement backing plate for the FLEX XCE 10-8 125 Corded Polisher aka The Supa BEAST.

Apologies for the nomenclature confusion. :dunno:




:buffing:

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Anyone watch?

Comments?

Good, Bad? Ugly?

Very informative.

Thank you. That's what we aim for.

Your assistant’s interruptions disrupts the flow of your demonstration.
My honest feedback.

Thank you for your feedback - duly noted.

I ordered one yesterday, but it turns out I bought the FLEX 15mm battery operated polisher. It’s already been shipped.

Oops.

That’s what I get for placing an order at five in the morning.

How's that saying go?

Nothing good happens after midnight?

I could be, nothing good happens after 10:00pm? I forget. But yeah, shopping online at O 'Dark Thirty :laughing: :bolt:

Yeah. seriously. Might keep it, though.

I could practice on some fleet vehicles out in the parking lot at work. Or actually do some mobile detail jobs.

Got it for 25% off at least.
I read the fine print, I don’t think AG covers return shipping on items bought in error.

I don't know much about the sales/shipping/returns aspect - I can hardly keep up with the how-to aspect of my job. Customer Could answer your question though.


As far as the FLEX Finisher goes - it's exactly what it's name states - it's for FINISHING work. It's not the heavy duty, severely neglected major paint correction buffer - that's the BEAST.


In my classes, I notice different types of people gravitate towards different types of tools. Here's a very good example.

This is Rick, he took my Texas Roadshow Class the summer of 2019

After taking this 2-day very intesne class (the class detailed 10 cars in 2 days in seering heat - I was physically wounded from this class), and thus after using all the tools I teach, which are also 98% of the tools talked about online, Rich chose the FLEX Cordless Finisher.

Then after the class proceeded to buff out his own old 2-door Pontiac.

Using the techniques taught by Mike in our class, I have detailed my 1967 GTO.

Now that I have experience with a wide range of products, I can purchase with confidence. The result was terrific. Many thanks to Mike for this class.


As Mike can attest, my GTO was covered with swirls and holograms. Mike said it was typical of what a body shop turns out.

I purchased the Flex XFE15 150 Cordless Orbital polisher (The Finisher)and used this process:

1. Washed using Optimum No Rinse Wash & Shine
2. Clayed
3. Compounded with Sonax CutMax using Uro_Tech 7" Maroon Pads
4. Polished with Sonax Perfect Finish using Lake Country 6.5" White Pads
5. Surface cleaned with Black Fire Paint Prep.
6. Applied Pinnacle Souveran Past Wax

I thought the GTO looked great before, now it absolutely awesome! The results are impressive! (at least to me)

-Rick

Then incredibly, shared this old 2-door Chevy he detailed using the FLEX Finisher

My First Detail Job Other than my own cars! ( Long Post)



So... short story.

I was attending a local monthly Show and Shine event and saw a really pretty 1967 Vette. As I got closer (nice sunny day BTW) I was stunned by the MAJOR holograms. As I walked around the Vette and looked at the hood... WOW Serious wool swirls! The swirls we so bad they actually obscured the paint.

I asked the owner to stand by me so he could see the swirls. He was amazed and had not see the car like that in the sun. I told him that was what you get from a typical paint shop. The owner said the car was painted a month ago.

It could be such a beautiful car... I told him I could buff all that away if he was interested. After some discussion, we agreed on a price.


So he brought to Vette over this morning and using the techniques I learned in Mike's 2 day detailing class,

I decontaminated, foam washed, compounded and polished the Vette. The entire process took about 8 hours.

The result was stunning... it was like a different car.

The owner was beyond pleased with the result. I do this as a hobby, but I couldn't stand to see that Vette left in this condition. I was so very proud of the result, the "Reveal in the Sunshine" made all the work worthwhile. You can actually see the clouds perfectly in the hood.

The Vette is getting paint protection film next week and will be back for ceramic coating to complete the job.

1. Sonax compound and polish
2. Flex Finisher (Battery Powered)
3. Combination of Maroon Uro-Tech (Compound) and
4. White Lake Country pads (Polish)

This was really fun :xyxthumbs:
Rick
Austin, TX

I would say the primary difference between Rick's style of detailing and my style of detailing is I want to use a Freight Train to PLOW through a detail job and Rick is not in as much of a hurry.


The key to great results with the FLEX Finisher is to first understand it's abilities and also its limitations. Besides that the normal stuff,

1. Use the right pad for the job.
2. Use great abrasive technology
3. Mark the side of the backing plate and the padS to make it easy for your eyes to monitor pad rotation
4. Put your phone away and get to buffing

 

[JT Moto]

This thread touches on a lot that I am experiencing right now.

My BEAST backing plate arrives today, the old one was starting to lose its hold on the pads.

My Supa BEAST and pixie are in that package along with other goodies now that the dealer has finalized our in house detailing agreement. I’m getting murdered in the labor but hopefully we can change that when they start seeing the finished products and see the profitability it will bring.


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[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I’m getting murdered in the labor but hopefully we can change that when they start seeing the finished products and see the profitability it will bring.

I'm hoping you'll see and your managers will see the decrease in time spent machine polishing (due to zero pad stalling) with super high quality results.

What are you using for the paint correction step with these polishers?

Also - what pads?



Keep us updated please.

:cheers:

 

[JT Moto]

I'm hoping you'll see and your managers will see the decrease in time spent machine polishing (due to zero pad stalling) with super high quality results.

What are you using for the paint correction step with these polishers?

Also - what pads?



Keep us updated please.

:cheers:

They don’t understand paint correction at all. Our current Detailer has them convinced that wool pads on a rotary with sealant is what’s right!

I’ll be taking over our in house rental details. These are new cars that are rented out for 3k miles so I’ve been doing clay bar, BF one step with white or orange hybrid pads with my BEAST.

If they require more correction I have a host of Sonax compounds and polishes as well as BLACKFIRE compound and polish. Currently I’m using LC hybrid pads exclusively.

I’m trying to take baby steps with these guys, I’ve managed the delivery dept. for a dozen years and aside from the occasional salesman begging for them to pay me to correct a car here and there, this is the first real shot I have gotten to start putting out a solid product.

My plan is for our rental cars to look so good that the sales guys prefer to sell them over a new car because honestly, even with the occasional stone chip, the first four I completed for them do indeed look better than a new car.

We are on the main drag in Detroit so almost every car in our inventory is plagued with road grime and couple that with train tracks 75 yards away, every car we have should receive some extra love compared to most dealers.

Also thank you Mike, Autogeek, and members of this forum. Your posts are very helpful in keeping me motivated and geared up.


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[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

so I’ve been doing

1. clay bar,
2. BF one step with
3. white or orange hybrid pads
4. with my BEAST.

That is a PROVEN system for high quality results and the LEAST amount of time.

Also thank you Mike, Autogeek, and members of this forum. Your posts are very helpful in keeping me motivated and geared up.

Thanks for sharing your endeavor - I admire your passion and tenacity.


:cheers:

 

[dgage]

Mike, I just bought a CBeast as I was tired of the GG9 stalling on the “complex” body lines of my ’12 Acura TL. Do you ever run into paint where you CAN’T address with pads and products using a forced-rotation Flex and have to switch to free-spinning to finish down? I’m hoping/expecting I can just use the CBeast as my one stop shop with my pad collection (Rupes. Uro-Tec) and numerous compounds/polishes to address my hobbyist paint correction needs. Thanks.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Mike, I just bought a CBeast as I was tired of the GG9 stalling on the “complex” body lines of my ’12 Acura TL.

Congratulations. Invest some time behind the tool. Learn the way of the BEAST.

If you do a lot of "polishing" work, I recommend getting the new RUPES yellow and white CP foam pads. These pads both 7" and 6" work really well on all the BEASTS.

Do you ever run into paint where you CAN’T address with pads and products using a forced-rotation Flex and have to switch to free-spinning to finish down?

Yes and for the record - I've shared this info for years on this forum. In fact, I demonstrated this last Friday during our last SEMA Live video.

Hang tight, I'll try to find the time stamp as to when I talk about it.

I’m hoping/expecting I can just use the CBeast as my one stop shop with my pad collection (Rupes. Uro-Tec) and numerous compounds/polishes to address my hobbyist paint correction needs.

Thanks.

It's a HUGE time saver. It costs more up front buy pays for itself after one detail job in time and energy saved.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Hang tight, I'll try to find the time stamp as to when I talk about it.

Start watching at the 12:30 time stamp mark.

Here's what's going on. I just pulled out #3000 grit sanding marks using the BLACKFIRE One Step.

I put the swirl finder light on the results and they are very good but not perfect. But not bad considering what I just did.

I then say if you want to take these results to a higher level - switch over to softer pad and a free spinning random orbital polisher.

The second step refines the results of the first step - easily.


In the real world - no one removes sanding marks using a cleaner/wax or AIO. That's just not what you do. The fact that I have no fear to do this live on black paint is because I understand what is real-world and what is un-real expectations.


And I believe this is the first time, possibly the second time I shared that in my opinion and experience, a free spinning random orbital polisher will finish out nicer on soft paint as compared to hard or medium paint.

Here's my write up from December of 2012


Christmas Detail - Ferrari P4 - Move over Rudolf


I was asked a question about why I corrected with the BEAST but finished with the Meguiar's G110 Polisher - which for those that might not know is a copy of the Porter Cable - in other words, the Meguair's G110 and the Porter Cable 7424XP are both 8mm free spinning random orbital polishers and VERY gentle and safe to paint.


Here's the question

What made you decide to finish out with the G110 vs the Flex? Pad size selection or the non forced rotation maybe?

And my answer,

Good question...

I find on softer paints like this car has that the PC style with a Fine Cut Polish finishes out nicer than with the more powerful Flex 3401.

The paint on this car was incredibly soft.

I only did my test spot using the Flex 3401 and end-results were acceptable, I did the 8mm free spinning step just to "make sure".

I also machine applied the wax using the Meguiar's G110 polisher.

So 8+ years ago as I type on November 11th, 2020, I shared at least in my own experience, (and not based on just this Ferrari), and "yes" when it comes to softer paints, some call them sticky or finicky, any brand of free spinning random orbital polisher will finish out nicer more consistently than any brand of gear-driven orbital polisher.


That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I love YouTube comments....

On the topic of why I finished out with the free spinning tool to make the paint look even better in the video I shared above.

Why would you finish off with this cordless one ?

Or could you finish the job with the beast as well, and do a perfect or identical job as with the cordless finisher ?

Generally speaking - a free spinning random orbital polisher will finish out nicer on the widest spectrum of paint systems than a gear-driven orbital polisher.

Make sense?

I love YouTube and Facebook and Instagram and Periscope, and ChittyChatty, etc.

But on a forum - it's so much easier to have a real dialog. So many people are simply missing out.


:dunno:

 

[dgage]

I thought I had read that before. Thanks Mike. Great explanation and resource you are. Appreciate it! And thank you for making me spend way too much to become an “expert” hobbyist detailer.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I thought I had read that before. Thanks Mike. Great explanation and resource you are. Appreciate it!

Always glad to share what I know in my knower.

And thank you for making me spend way too much to become an “expert” hobbyist detailer.

Don't blame me, I'm just the how-to guy during the day and a blue collar working class dog on weekends.


Woof woof...

 

[Me Time]

***BUMP***

Mike, did you ever show the buffing pad options for these three polishers? Or did I miss it somewhere?

Thanks, Greg

***Placeholder***


As I get time, I'll include buffing pad options for all three polishers here.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

***BUMP***

Mike, did you ever show the buffing pad options for these three polishers? Or did I miss it somewhere?

Thanks, Greg

Ha ha.... I did write 2 new articles for this topic but never circled back to include them in this article.


Here's the most recent article where I includes B&S pads

Mike Phillips recommended foam pads for the FLEX Family of BEAST 8mm Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers


I get asked a LOT about which pads to get for the FLEX family of BEAST tools. If you don't know, the BEAST family of tools includes,


FLEX XC 3401 VRG - the original and also known as The BEAST - and the BEAST is spelled with all capital letters. This is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit orbital polisher.

FLEX XCE 10-8 125 aka The Supa BEAST - Supa is short for super and only the first letter is capitalized. This is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit orbital polisher.

FLEX XCE 8-125 18.0 aka The CBEAST - All capital letters and the letter C before the word BEAST simply stands for cordless. This is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit orbital polisher.



As of February 9th, 2021 - here are my preferred choices for pads for compounding, polishing, finishing work and when using AIOs

Here's the previous article - both articles have lots of extra info.



Buffing Pad Recommendations for the FLEX BEASTS Trio - BEAST - Supa BEAST - CBEAST


Lake Country and RUPES Foam Buffing Pads for the FLEX BEAST Trio

And this one is important too....


Supa BEAST and CBEAST Backing Plate Swap by Mike Phillips

It's what I do - create content.


:buffing:

 

[Me Time]

Thank you Sir.

I broke down and bought the Supa BEAST finally. I'm just an old weekend warrior, but I like how you keep preaching about it saving time and your body vs. my GG polisher. Getting old sucks so I'm ok with spending a couple of bucks to make it easier.

Now if they weather would just straighten up. Last week we had 3/4" of ice and then 2 days of snow that left us with 8". But you have been in the Sunshine State too long to remember snow. :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Ha ha.... I did write 2 new articles for this topic but never circled back to include them in this article.


Here's the most recent article where I includes B&S pads

Mike Phillips recommended foam pads for the FLEX Family of BEAST 8mm Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers


I get asked a LOT about which pads to get for the FLEX family of BEAST tools. If you don't know, the BEAST family of tools includes,


FLEX XC 3401 VRG - the original and also known as The BEAST - and the BEAST is spelled with all capital letters. This is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit orbital polisher.

FLEX XCE 10-8 125 aka The Supa BEAST - Supa is short for super and only the first letter is capitalized. This is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit orbital polisher.

FLEX XCE 8-125 18.0 aka The CBEAST - All capital letters and the letter C before the word BEAST simply stands for cordless. This is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit orbital polisher.



As of February 9th, 2021 - here are my preferred choices for pads for compounding, polishing, finishing work and when using AIOs

Here's the previous article - both articles have lots of extra info.



Buffing Pad Recommendations for the FLEX BEASTS Trio - BEAST - Supa BEAST - CBEAST


Lake Country and RUPES Foam Buffing Pads for the FLEX BEAST Trio

And this one is important too....


Supa BEAST and CBEAST Backing Plate Swap by Mike Phillips

It's what I do - create content.


:buffing:

 

[jas02ta]

The FLEX BEAST, Supa BEAST & CBEAST - 8mm Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers


Currently there are 3 versions of the FLEX BEAST available.


From left to right,

The Supa BEAST, the BEAST and the CBEAST

FLEX XC 3401 VRG

• 480 RPM and 9,600 OPM.
• Comes from the factory with a 6" Backing Plate.

The FLEX XC 3401 VRG is the original corded BEAST. The word BEAST is spelled with all capital letters. This is an 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit - orbital polisher. It's easily identified by the visible aluminum shroud at the head of the polisher.



FLEX XCE 10-8 125

• 430 RPM and 8,600 OPM
• Comes from the factory with a 5" backing plate.

This is the newest evolution of the original corded BEAST. I call it the Supa BEAST. The word Supa is short for super and only the first letter in the word Supa is capitalized and the word BEAST is all capital letters. Like the original BEAST, this is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit - orbital polisher. I personally use and recommend swapping out the factory 5" backing plate and installing the optional 6" backing plate. This enables you to use larger buffing pads and thus take full advantage of the power this tool offers with a larger footprint.



FLEX XCE 8-125 18.0

• 380 RPM and 7,600 OPM
• Comes from the factory with a 5" backing plate.

This is the CORDLESS BEAST aka the CBEAST . The word CBEAST is spelled with all capital letters and the letter C before the word BEAST simply stands for cordless. Like the original BEAST, this is a 8mm gear-driven fixed orbit - orbital polisher using Lithium-Ion re-chargeable batteries.



The original FLEX XC 3401 VRG 8mm gear-driven orbital polisher.

The FLEX Supa BEAST

The FLEX CBEAST

Body Design Changes

They are all roughly the same size and weight. In these pictures you can easily see the exposed aluminum head on the original 3401. The new design of the Supa BEAST and the CBEAST incorporate the handle into the head of the tool with a rubber overmold. With the original design, if the tool is dropped, it's possible for the handle to break. By removing the handle, breakage is now a non-issue.

Brushless Motor Technology
The newer Supa BEAST And CBEAST use FLEX brushless electric motors so there's never any brushes to wear out or replace. If you have the original BEAST an need to replace the brushes, here's a how-to video that shows you how to do it yourself.




Backing Plate Swap - Maximizing the ability of the Supa BEAST

After using all three of these tool extensively, my own personal preference is to invest in the larger 6" backing plate for the corded Supa BEAST. Being a corded model it has TONS of power and turning and churning larger pads is no problem. So, might as well take advantage of the power and of course, ZERO PAD STALLING and use larger pads that enable you to tackler more real-estate to get any detail job done faster.


Here's the link to the larger, optional 6" backing plate.

FLEX XFE 7-15 6 inch Backing Plate

My take on the three different BEAST options?

I get asked about these three different variations all the time. Here's my take,


The BEAST
If I REALLY want to bust-out a job and plow through it as fast as humanly possible I use the BEAST. The extra RPM and OPM are just a tick more than the Supa BEAST - BUT - if I'm in a hurry - I'll take full advantage of the extra speed and power.



The Supa BEAST
If not trying to hit Warp Speed - I grab the Supa Beast. It's much more enjoyable to use. It's an amazing tool. I would even say it's a freaking amazing tool. Compared to the original BEAST, it offers these 4 benefits.

1. Smoother
2. Quieter
3. Lighter
4. Cooler

The CBEAST
If I have an easy job, that means the car has only light swirls, scratches and these defects are shallow then I'll use the CBEAST. This also means I've done a TEST SPOT and found the paint corrects easy meaning the paint hardness is in the medium to soft range but definitely not what I would consider hard paint, then the pleasure of not hassling with a power cord cannot be understated. I love the freedom of no cord. Alas - most of the cars I detail are severely neglected with lots of swirls, scratches, water spots and oxidation so I don't use the CBEAST as often as I wish I could.


Tool choice for me is about the condition of the paint and the speed in which I want to plow through the job.

Hello Mike,

Would the cordless Makita gear driven polisher have more correcting power than the cbeast?


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