MoBenzOwner
New member
- Sep 13, 2007
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Use Dawn to strip wax?
- Thread starter CC268
- Start date
I'm one of those who is vocal about this. If you want to see dawn stripping, hide in the bushes with a pair of binoculars and prepare to run if you hear sirens.
The simple fact is that any good modern wax will be designed to be resilient to some pretty strong chemicals. With many, you can wash several times with high pH and solvent levels and not strip. For us, if a trial wax comes off with a strong APC mix, that trial wax will hit the garbage shoot. So if you are then trying to tell me that your wax strips with a product which is safe enough to immerse your hands in, for a prolonged period, then I am inclined to tell you that you need to buy a proper wax in future!
The simple fact is that any good modern wax will be designed to be resilient to some pretty strong chemicals. With many, you can wash several times with high pH and solvent levels and not strip. For us, if a trial wax comes off with a strong APC mix, that trial wax will hit the garbage shoot. So if you are then trying to tell me that your wax strips with a product which is safe enough to immerse your hands in, for a prolonged period, then I am inclined to tell you that you need to buy a proper wax in future!
Lost Highway
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- Sep 23, 2011
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The Dawn story appears to clearly trace back to a misconstrued comment from Zaino. I would call that a relatively benign misunderstanding, I certainly don't think Zaino was getting kickbacks from Proctor & Gamble. On the other hand there are both U.K. and U.S. (think California) detailing product companies that have made what appear to be deliberately misleading statements about the ability of their shampoos to strip existing waxes and sealants and in these cases it certainly appears that the companies had a profit motive (driving sales) for being disingenuous. The only alternative explanation is that they are ignorant and/or technically incompetent. Assumptions that companies are telling the truth are simply not safe to make.
DasBurninator
New member
- Mar 18, 2013
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Someone posted up a test on reddit a few months ago showing that when washing a car with Dawn the only thing that prevents it from beading is the residue it leaves behind. A quick IPA wipe afterwards restored beading and the sealant that was on the car still held up fine.
Link of said experiment
Dawn Wash - Album on Imgur
Food for thought
Link of said experiment
Dawn Wash - Album on Imgur
Food for thought
Look... truth is I don't know what strips wax, but it is NOT some invisible force-field that is impermeable to everything. It makes sense car wash shampoo does not strip most wax or sealants.
That said, degreasers and strong detergents like dawn probably strip wax. Heck it will strip crude-oil off dying birds after a huge oil spill! It will wash the food-grade wax off apples making them not shiny anymore...
Am I supposed to believe Alcohol and Dawn will not strip wax, but some magic clear stripping liquid from Grios will or some Citrus cleaner?
What's the verdict? Do we need mineral spirits, lacquer thinner, prep-sol, or Easy-Off oven cleaner?
What's reasonable guys?
That said, degreasers and strong detergents like dawn probably strip wax. Heck it will strip crude-oil off dying birds after a huge oil spill! It will wash the food-grade wax off apples making them not shiny anymore...
Am I supposed to believe Alcohol and Dawn will not strip wax, but some magic clear stripping liquid from Grios will or some Citrus cleaner?
What's the verdict? Do we need mineral spirits, lacquer thinner, prep-sol, or Easy-Off oven cleaner?
What's reasonable guys?
Dawn isn't a magic product. Think about it, you can soak your hands in it for prolonged periods and it will do no harm. The truth is that dawn is a close relative of your car shampoo. In fact, our biggest selling car shampoo is sold to another market. You guessed it, save for colour and fragrance, the car shampoo also sells as a commercial hand wash dish detergent.
Stronger products will mean high pH. Yes, they will degrade a wax but a dilute solution will rarely strip a good wax in a single application. A good LSP should need scrubbed with a very strong solution to remove it. I challenge you to get some flakes of carnauba and mix with your apc (neat). The wax will not dissolve. Try the same with alcohol. They just aren't that effective. To be honest, even a suitable non polar solvent, wont easily dissolve wax. If you have ever made wax you will know that you won't dissolve the wax without heat added.
Try an analogy. Your overhead power lines, if one comes down and you grab it, you will die. But it one touches a tree... The tree won't die. Just because something is 'strong' doesn't make it universally effective.
How to remove it? As noted previously, several companies claim that their water dilute bless wash products strip wax. Sorry but I believe their marketing people are confused. It's the same scenario where a surfactant residue sits on top of and hides the wax. Unless the product has extreme pH, it doesn't stand a chance. If you want a guaranteed removal of an LSP, you need to get a mild polish out. I have tested hundreds of LSP samples and I have found nothing short of this to be certain. Poor durability products may come off with high pH, some will come off with xylene but some will not and could need repeated application. Alternatively, a mild abrasive polish and a single buzz with the DA and everything short of a coating will be gone.
DogRescuer
New member
- Apr 6, 2013
- 1,801
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But if car or panel doesn't need polishing? Simply claying will remove lsp no?? I believe in less agressive first.
Don M
Active member
- Jan 8, 2010
- 2,254
- 14
Some will say claying removes wax, some will say it doesn't. I believe that oftentimes when you clay, you are introducing marring at some level that will need polished out. SO there you are in a vicious circle ... do I clay and hope it removes all the wax without marring and then have to polish to remove the clay marring, or do I just polish to remove the wax, any current micro-marring and be done with it.
Personally, I wouldn't clay a car without polishing afterwards.
DogRescuer
New member
- Apr 6, 2013
- 1,801
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I see
I agree in the least aggressive approach but lets look at the options.
1) Dawn or safe detergent product - they don't work.
2) High pH/caustic/heavy solvent product - really quite aggressive and may well not work
3) Mild polish - only slightly aggressive and will work
If you break it down that way, the mild polish is probably the least aggressive option. You may well find that you can get away with a good paint cleanser and a finishing pad, making it less aggressive again.
I was just looking at the Zaino site and, to this day, they still recommend a ONE time wash with Dawn ultra. I would guess they did some research back in the day but not sure if it would still apply today when it comes to stripping off old sealants. Maybe back then they just assumed everyone was using the old Turtle Wax paste!!!