What is Happening Doesn't Make Sense

[BlackCoupe]

Black Lexus.

After a year of two a week washes, I have a lot of spider webbing.

I am doing numerous test spots, and repeating the ones the best results, comparing, etc., trying to reduce the consequence of technique differential.

I am, every time, getting a better result with a CCS Orange Pad and Meg's 83 and going straight to Menzerna FP II on CCS Grey Pad (Process 1), than I do on side by side tests with CCS Orange Pad and Meg's 83, followed by CCS White Pad with Meg's 80, followed by Menzerna FP II on CCS Grey Pad (Process 2).

To verify, I both pull it out in to the sun and use the Dual Xenon light in the garage. Process 1 gives a noticeably better optical clarity, and I am totally happy with it.

Doesn't make sense. Any ideas?

EDIT--I understand the cobwebs--I suspect this is happening during the drying process. The part that doesn't make sense is that Process 1 skips a step and gives better results than Process 2. Comments and/or discuss amongst yourselves. Don't fill more than one blue book.

 

[BILL]

Black Lexus.

After a year of two a week washes, I have a lot of spider webbing.

I am doing numerous test spots, and repeating the ones the best results, comparing, etc., trying to reduce the consequence of technique differential.

I am, every time, getting a better result with a CCS Orange Pad and Meg's 83 and going straight to Menzerna FP II on CCS Grey Pad (Process 1), than I do on side by side tests with CCS Orange Pad and Meg's 83, followed by CCS White Pad with Meg's 80, followed by Menzerna FP II on CCS Grey Pad (Process 2).

To verify, I both pull it out in to the sun and use the Dual Xenon light in the garage. Process 1 gives a noticeably better optical clarity, and I am totally happy with it.

Doesn't make sense. Any ideas?

i feel your pain......that happens on my wifes black T- bird im beginning to believe there is no cure, just treatment

 

[trhland]

i Spent 9 Hours Polishing My Truck 3 Weeks Ago With Optimums Polish And A Medium Green Pad. All The Swirls Were Gone. Now Theres A Few That Popped Up . Dont Know How Im So Carefull With My Washing. Thats Why I Ordered The Foam Gun . Itll Be Here On Tuesday Hopefully That Will Help Avoid This. If Not I Might Start Useing More Glazes .insted Of Polishing The Paint Like Crazy And Wearing Down My Clear

 

[BILL]

i Spent 9 Hours Polishing My Truck 3 Weeks Ago With Optimums Polish And A Medium Green Pad. All The Swirls Were Gone. Now Theres A Few That Popped Up . Dont Know How Im So Carefull With My Washing. Thats Why I Ordered The Foam Gun . Itll Be Here On Tuesday Hopefully That Will Help Avoid This. If Not I Might Start Useing More Glazes .insted Of Polishing The Paint Like Crazy And Wearing Down My Clear

GOOD THINKING

 

[Nica]

Blackcoupe, wish I could help you out but I've never used Menzerna and I've only use some Meg's stuff. As to why process 1 is better looking better then process 2....I can't really comment my friend sorry. But what I can comment on is the scratches coming back, I didn't believe this but drying your vehicle by blow drying it is probably the best. The other thing I didn't believe is the use of a water filter, wow I was amazed how soft the water feels and how it quickly glides off your vehicle...not only that but you ever noticed that when you start drying the vehicle with a Guzzler and you start on one side by the time you get to the other side you some times have to use a QD to remove the water. Well with a good water filter you don't need a QD to remove the water. Like I said I never believed this but I'm a believer now....all thanks to a friend of mine that showed me the light lol.

Well hope this helps...a little.

 

[supercharged]

How carefull are you when washing? Using Grit Guard? Good wash mitt? Good lubrication shampoo? What about drying? What kind of towel? Do you use any QD?

 

[P1et]

Let's all face reality: it's very hard to keep a daily driver completely swirl free with no spider webbing or anything.

All we're doing by using MFs, ShMITTs and lots of lube is damage control.

 

[trhland]

the only way to keep a car swirl fee is to polish it then wax then leave it in your garage and never drive it

 

[BILL]

How carefull are you when washing? Using Grit Guard? Good wash mitt? Good lubrication shampoo? What about drying? What kind of towel? Do you use any QD?

ALSO ARE YOU USING THE 2 BUCKET SYSTEM

 

[ScottB]

keeping swirls at bay means changing your washing and drying techniques. Even the application of polishes and waxes. (no circles)

That said, most polishes have alot of fillers in them. So when you are polishing you are almost packing the swirls with these fillers also. Sure it looks great, but after a wash or two the fillers are gone and the swirls they were hiding are back. This is why I preach that you stop, do an alcohol wipe, and repolish as needed. Otherwise you are somewhat being tricked ...

 

[BlackCoupe]

Let's all face reality: it's very hard to keep a daily driver completely swirl free with no spider webbing or anything.

All we're doing by using MFs, ShMITTs and lots of lube is damage control.

Gosh everybody, thanks, but my question was about why Process 1 is giving a better result than Process 2, since it skips a step.

But since you have asked about the cobwebs, I think Lexus paint is notorious for cobwebbing, but, yes, I use the two bucket method with two grit guards, a Meg's wash mitt, Gold Class wash soap, Cobra drying towels, and QD the last water droplets and any streaks off with a MF. Perhaps I should also mention that I only do about a3X3 area with the wash mitt before flipping it, and then return it to the rinse bucket where I swish it and then rub it on the grit guard before returning it to the soap bucket. I have several mitts, one is dedicated for around the bottom of the car. I think this is pretty much "textbook" wash method. I "think" the webbing is from the drying--I am going to blot in the future, instead of rubbing the towel around, then spray wax with Liquid Souveran (which arrived unexpectedly at my front door yesterday!).

 

[BlackCoupe]

keeping swirls at bay means changing your washing and drying techniques. Even the application of polishes and waxes. (no circles)

That said, most polishes have alot of fillers in them. So when you are polishing you are almost packing the swirls with these fillers also. Sure it looks great, but after a wash or two the fillers are gone and the swirls they were hiding are back. This is why I preach that you stop, do an alcohol wipe, and repolish as needed. Otherwise you are somewhat being tricked ...

OK--thats it. I am going to come to all of your homes and wash your cars with Number 80 sandpaper and a bag of Quikcrete for lubrication! My question was at to my polishing process with the different products and pads.

Dear friends,set aside for the moment the origin of the swirls, WHY IS PROCESS 1 GIVING ME A BETTER RESULT THAN PROCESS 2?

 

[ScottB]

your sexy when your mad ....

(and your never coming to my bat cave with that attitude)

 

[trhland]

keeping swirls at bay means changing your washing and drying techniques. Even the application of polishes and waxes. (no circles)

That said, most polishes have alot of fillers in them. So when you are polishing you are almost packing the swirls with these fillers also. Sure it looks great, but after a wash or two the fillers are gone and the swirls they were hiding are back. This is why I preach that you stop, do an alcohol wipe, and repolish as needed. Otherwise you are somewhat being tricked ...

pure polishes like optimum have fillers in them ?? i never new that. so after i polish and area i have to go over it again with a solvent to see if i really did anything??

 

[ScottB]

pure polishes like optimum have fillers in them ?? i never new that. so after i polish and area i have to go over it again with a solvent to see if i really did anything??

see PM for better explanation. Use a test area to guage if polish and pad choice are correct. Most polishes have some light filling ability, so better to test and redo as needed prior to finishing entire car.

 

[P1et]

BlackCoupe, are you sure that an orange pad is totally necessary? I would think that spider webbing etc. would benefit from one or two passes of the white pad with a medium/fine polish.

Perhaps skip the orange pad, and do two passes of the white. Then follow with the gray and see what happens.

 

[BlackCoupe]

BlackCoupe, are you sure that an orange pad is totally necessary? I would think that spider webbing etc. would benefit from one or two passes of the white pad with a medium/fine polish.

Perhaps skip the orange pad, and do two passes of the white. Then follow with the gray and see what happens.

I did various combinations, writing them down, and giving each a second try, taping off, and comparing in sunlight and in the garage with a dual xenon light.

But regardless, two passes of white and one of Menzerna is a total of three. Right now, I can go from orange w/ 83 right to Menzerna, total two passes,

Howeve, It will experiment some more with the trunk, although, for some reason, it does not seem to have the same amount of spiderwebbing. I agree that it makes perfect sense that a white pad with 80 and a medium/fine polish should do it, but it hasn't. I will experiment with some SSR1 I have, with a white CCS.

 

[BlackCoupe]

your sexy when your mad ....

I know! and I flaunt it!

P.S. Thanks for mentioning the filler thing. After reading that, I wiped down with IA after the Menzerna to see if I was being fooled, and the finish was still high gloss, no webbing. I love that stuff. I don;t know why someone hasn't ripped off the forumla--it can't be rocket science.

 

[turbos17]

Killer could I get that PM too about the "fillers in polishes?" Thanks!

 

[ltoman]

Interesting that skipping a step would produce such results. I guess you never can predict.

I also think you're going to swirl the car no matter how careful you are - minimize the damage as much as possible, and don't kill yourself over it. It's still going to look better than 98% of them, or moree, out there!
lauren