Why seal?

[DogRescuer]

Hi why would you guys/gals put a sealant on under say 845 for the winter, couldn't you just lay down 2 or even 3 coats of 845?
Thanks

 

[Setec Astronomy]

I don't know that there is any proof that 2 or 3 coats of 845 is any thicker than 1 coat, besides the second coat insuring ever coverage.

The idea of "layering" a sealant and a wax is that the sealant is going to bond to the paint, and the wax is going to adhere to the sealant...which is different than doing two coats of sealant or two coats of wax.

 

[frankprozzoly]

So if sealant bonds to the paint, what does wax do? I'm not being a smartass I just don't know this stuff like most of the people here

 

[Don M]

I don't know that there is any proof that 2 or 3 coats of 845 is any thicker than 1 coat, besides the second coat insuring ever coverage.

The idea of "layering" a sealant and a wax is that the sealant is going to bond to the paint, and the wax is going to adhere to the sealant...which is different than doing two coats of sealant or two coats of wax.

The wax theoretically acts as protection for the sealant, which is then supposed to give the sealant a longer life.

 

[wdmaccord]

845 is a hybrid sealant/wax. No need to have a sealant underneath. Agree with Setec that the only reason for multiple coats of 845 would be to ensure full coverage. I get 6 months out of it by itself through the winter with DGRW+AW washes and the touchless once a month or so (I try to go as long as possible before I do this, but eventually it gets too cold to do RW in the insulated garage with no heater...so maybe a total of 3 touchless washes towards the end of winter).

 

[FUNX650]

So if sealant bonds to the paint, what does wax do? I'm not being a smartass I just don't know this stuff like most of the people here

•Just thinking aloud:

-I'd almost bet that there's probably some catalyzation going on down at the molecular level. Perhaps even some robust polymerization.

-Assuming there is some type of bonding that occurs
between Auto-paints, Waxes, Sealants, or even Coatings...
I wonder what it would take to break those bonds.


Bob

 

[buddee]

From what i've read, most people apply wax over a sealant for visual purpose, and added protection. Sealants are great for durable protection but i've read they lack the visual appeal that a good wax provides. Wax provides a deep, warm paint appeal that sealants supposedly don't provide as much of.

 

[frankprozzoly]

So I had to look those words up Bob. If I understand correctly, wax and sealant are possibly having a chemical reaction to become stronger?

Most new cars have clear so its bonding to that not paint. Do you think these products bond better directly to paint or are the products now made for clear. Or is clear made of similar products that paint is made from?

What did you mean by what would it take to separate that bond? People talk about ipa wipe downs, wouldn't that break the bond

 

[Kamakaz1961]

From what i've read, most people apply wax over a sealant for visual purpose, and added protection. Sealants are great for durable protection but i've read they lack the visual appeal that a good wax provides. Wax provides a deep, warm paint appeal that sealants supposedly don't provide as much of.

:iagree:

 

[Desertnate]

Hi why would you guys/gals put a sealant on under say 845 for the winter, couldn't you just lay down 2 or even 3 coats of 845?
Thanks

I wouldn't put a sealant under 845. From my experience, it would be a waste of time. One coat of 845 will easily make it through winter all on it's own. No need for a sealant.

This fall, I double coated with 845 simply to ensure even coverage over the whole vehicle. I'm not sure why you'd need to bother with a third coat. I doubt you'd gain anything in looks or durability.

 

[frankprozzoly]

I thought people were saying that 476 is more durable and 845 is more geared towards heat resistance

 

[FUNX650]

Most new cars have clear so its bonding to that not paint. Do you think these products bond better directly to paint or are the products now made for clear. Or is clear made of similar products that paint is made from?

Clear Coat Paint is paint---paint without pigments; but, paint that may, instead, contain UV-absorbers/UV-inhibitors.

What did you mean by what would it take to separate that bond? People talk about ipa wipe downs, wouldn't that break the bond

There's always so much talk and hypotheses about how LSPs bond to paint, and/or each other...without ever delving too much into the Science/Chemistry that it would take for such development of any bonding to occur...that I thought it would be interesting to dig down and try to discover any factors that could tear apart any such bonds.

To me it just seemed a natural progression (or is that regression) as it may be applicable towards LSPs' bonding.

And...IMO:
Even though IPA could be considered a "chemical solution" to wipe away (un-bonded) polishing residues...I doubt IPA would be the product of choice to tear asunder many bonds: such as the ones currently being discussed.


Bob

 

[frankprozzoly]

I was thinking clear coat was more like a polyurethane type. That tells you how much i know. Well, I don't know much about chemistry but I do know that it all makes our cars look beautiful

 

[FUNX650]

I was thinking clear coat was more like a polyurethane type. That tells you how much i know. Well, I don't know much about chemistry but I do know that it all makes our cars look beautiful

And it makes us want to "bond to such beauty"!

To me:
This is another aspect of "breaking bonds" to consider.
Almost like clockwork:
There appears a weekly thread about a particular LSP that an AGO forum member applied to a vehicle, wherein it is posted that this particular LSP must no longer be "working"---its characteristics are no longer present---way before it's advertised/stated end-of-life-cycle time.
(In fact: there's a current thread regarding this very matter)

So:
Did something or another break any of the bond(s)...whether they're alleged, or not...between the top-coat paint-film layer (be it a SS or BC/CC paint systems) and an LSP...or between film layers of LSPs themselves, if "building of layers" of LSPs is indeed possible?


Bob

 

[swanicyouth]

I've played around with layering multiple products and found ZERO evidence it makes either product last any longer. I still play with it going after a certain look for fun - but for durability it's a complete waste of time IMHO.

 

[frankprozzoly]

How many of us do you really think push the limit. I probably wax every two to three months. And I use a spray wax every other week. So I'll probably never know how long something lasts.

And if your waiting that long, you need to send me some of your wax. Because you have way too much

 

[Setec Astronomy]

845 is a hybrid sealant/wax.

I think a lot of this is spin. 845 is a wax...Collinite used to say it also had some "resins" in it, but this concept of it being a hybrid and that it's a sealant has just popped up all of a sudden and I think it's marketing hyperbole.

I thought people were saying that 476 is more durable and 845 is more geared towards heat resistance

845 is simply the liquid version of 476S.

I was thinking clear coat was more like a polyurethane type.

That's exactly what clearcoat is, it's a catalyzed polyurethane.

 

[frankprozzoly]

[QUOTE=Setec Astronomy;



845 is simply the liquid version of 476S.


Good to know. I might have bought some on the basis it was different

 

[KenR]

To get my cars through the winter I stripped the old wax and sealant off and applied a new coat of Menzerna Power Lock sealant and topped that with with Collinite 476S.