Removing #1500 Sanding Marks with Rupes Bigfoot 21 Polisher

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Removing #1500 Sanding Marks with Rupes Bigfoot 21 Polisher


Yesterday I created a thread to share the new 3M Flexible Hookit Sanding Sheets here,

Dry Sanding & Wet Sanding with 3M's Flexible Abrasive Hookit Sheets


As a part of sharing them I also sanded a small section on the hood of this hotrod Model A. I sanded just enough to capture a couple of shots showing what orange peel looks like as you start to knock off the tops of the hills to make them level with the valley.

Here's a few pictures from the above thread...


3M Flexible Abrasive Hookit Sheets
These new flexible Hookit sheets us an anti-loading technology to help prevent the face of the paper from loading up with paint as fast and as easily as traditional wet/dry sandpaper.

I sanded this section with about 10 back and forth passes and found the #1500 to cut incredibly fast.

Here you can see the orange peel being removed as you look towards the bottom of the picture the orange peel is being removed leaving behind a very flat surface that after compounding and polishing will produce a smooth, high gloss finish with excellent Distinction of Image or DOI.

Removing Sanding Marks

"It's easy to sand paint... that's putting scratches into the paint. The tricky part is getting them 100% out"


This morning I wanted to test out what it was going to take to remove the sanding marks to get an idea as to how hard the paint is. Normally I would finish out at #3000 or #5000 grit sanding marks to make the compounding step cooler, faster, easier and safer.

Instead, I threw caution to the wind and just tried removing the #1500 grit sanding marks and to do this I used the Rupes Bigfoot 21 Polisher with the Rupes Zephir Gloss Coarse Gel Compound and Blue Foam Cutting Pad followed by the Rupes Keramik Gloss Fine Gel Polish and the Rupes matching Yellow Foam Polishing pad. I followed this with a quick application of Pinnacle XMT 180 Paste Wax machine applied using a Griot's Garage 3" Mini Polisher with a Rupes 4" polishing pad.


This was just a test to a small section as I'm saving this car for this weekends detailing boot camp class. The Rupes Bigfoot 21 along with their compound and foam cutting pad remove 100% of the sanding marks after just a few passes.



This first pictures will frame up the shot so you can see I worked in the same place I hand sanded...

Now I've zoomed in and you can see the orange peel on the right side where I did not sand and how the paint starts to flatten out as you look to the right side of the picture.

Below are some shots taken using different camera settings including one group of shots with the flash on.


Orange Peel

No Orange Peel but also no sanding marks and no holograms or haze...

Orange Peel

No Orange Peel but also no sanding marks and no holograms or haze...

Orange Peel

No Orange Peel but also no sanding marks and no holograms or haze...

The sanding marks removed very easy without having to use a rotary buffer or wool pad which while it would likely work faster, the rotary buffer and the wool pad would have left holograms behind.

 

[Christopher.Brown]

can definitely attest to removing 1500 sanding marks..

using the rupes with a megs Mf cutting pad and M100 almost finishes down perfectly


rops:

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

can definitely attest to removing 1500 sanding marks..

using the rupes with a megs Mf cutting pad and M100 almost finishes down perfectly


rops:

I was surprised at how fast the sanding marks came out?

My first though is soft paint.

My second thought is uniform particle size on the sanding sheets as I didn't see any tracers at all.


Of course, the Rupes compound and foam cutting pad are a very aggressive combo.


At this time I'm planning on having my class use rotary buffers with wool pads though because there are a lot of curves on this hotrod and historically, the fastest way overall to sand and buff out the sanding marks out of an entire car is via a rotary buffer. It's also about hands-on training and practice, not just doing a car a certain way because you can.

My class will get tons of hands-on time buffing out the 1965 Dodge Cornet with the Rupes system.

 

[Calendyr]

I wish they had those in disk form for DA backplate. I have been searching for this all week. Finally found some but have to buy it in boxes of 100 disks ;( Would not be so bad if the box contained various grit sizes, but since I need 500, 800, 1500 and 3000 grit, that's 400 disks!

 

[hernandez.art13]

I was very surprised how easy the Rupes took out 1500 too

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

but since I need 500, 800, 1500 and 3000 grit, that's 400 disks!

What do you need such agressive discs for? Are you doing body work?

 

[Calendyr]

Nah, just for headlight restoration.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Nah, just for headlight restoration.

Well you really want 3" discs. Like this,

I agree it would be handy to be able to purchase a mixed disc kit.

Good topic for it's own thread.

 

[hernandez.art13]

This video is what gave me the idea of asking Michael Stoops if I could attempt removing 1500

http://youtu.be/wfLdwFtAfaM

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

This video is what gave me the idea of asking Michael Stoops if I could attempt removing 1500

RUPES LHR 21E Random orbital polisher - YouTube

Good video. One thing though, you can hear him pushing down pretty hard on the Rupes and it's designed to use light pressure and slow, even arm speed. Regardless, looks like he was getting the sanding marks out.

Flat panels are pretty easy to work, curves will be more difficult.

 

[hernandez.art13]

The technique I left it on the youtube channel. Lol

When I attempted this. Michael Stoops got out Meguiars MF polishing pad and M100.

I asked him why not use the MF cutting pad instead of the polishing pad?

He just looked at me, smiled and just said "just try it" so I did

And yep they were removed, i'd say just as easy or even easier then the Dewalt I was using that night. It did leave a haze however. But I used zero pressure.

I asked him about the Rupes bogging down. So he turned it on, put a ton of pressure and it kept spinning. So I am still not sure what everyone is talking about? :dunno:

But just polished the haze out with M205

I'm not sure if we were even supposed to be "technically" wet sanding and buffing lol. Since it was Thursday night.

A few AG members were there. I also want to take the advanced class. My Body shop skills came out pretty easily that night. My wet sanding, I had spattered compound everywhere haha :laughing:

Yet the Meguiar's guys were working just like me or maybe even more than me, and they were spotless clean, I looked like I had came out working at a body shop the whole day haha

It was a blast however

I want to see how the Rupes reacts to curved panels. I've only gotten the chance test it out on flat test panels.

Joe Fernandez from Superior Shine has a little thread on FB. "Ask Superior Shine" So I asked, the Rupes or Flex

Art

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

The technique I left it on the youtube channel. Lol

When I attempted this. Michael Stoops got out Meguiars MF polishing pad and M100.

I asked him why not use the MF cutting pad instead of the polishing pad?

He just looked at me, smiled and just said "just try it" so I did

And yep they were removed, i'd say just as easy or even easier then the Dewalt I was using that night. It did leave a haze however. But I used zero pressure.

Mike's a sharp guy and remember...


"You don't know what you can do until you try"

I asked him about the Rupes bogging down. So he turned it on, put a ton of pressure and it kept spinning. So I am still not sure what everyone is talking about? :dunno:

The bogging down is when buffing out curved panels as you'll have only a small portion of the panel touching a small portion of the face of the pad and this can impede pad rotation.

It was a blast however

The Thursday Night Open Garage classes were always fun and it's good to see they continue the tradition.

I want to see how the Rupes reacts to curved panels. I've only gotten the chance test it out on flat test panels.

I make it a best practice to buff out entire cars, not just spots on a flat panel to really get the feel for a tool, pads, product or technique when possible.

The first time I used the Rupes polishers I chose a BIG car with lots of flat panels and LOTS of curved panels. Even made a time lapse video of the project and I think this was the FIRST time lapse video ever made showing a car being buffed out from beginning to end using the Rupes polishers.

Here's the link to the full write-up and a portion below...


Rupes Polisher Time Lapse Video - 1955 Ford Crown Victoria


Here's the time-lapse video Yancy took for me as I buffed this classic out from start to finish...

[video=youtube_share;v7FjGcMCTEg&hd=1"]RUPES 21ES Vs 15 ES time comparison Time lapse -...[/video]​

On the passenger side I used the Rupes 21 and on the driver's side I used the Rupes 15. There was about a 20 minute time savings using the larger pad, larger stroke machine over the smaller pad, smaller stroke machine but my opinion is that for most body panel designs on modern cars the 6" pad will be a better match.

This tool definitely has a lot more correction ability plus power over a traditional DA Polisher like the Porter Cable 7424XP.

I did find that when buffing a curved panel, either concave or convex, the uneven pressure applied to the face of the pad will slow down and even stop pad rotation. The key is to focus on the panel and keep the pad as flat as possible to the surface.




And here's the complete and in-depth write up using the very cool 1955 Ford Crown Victoria...

Rupes side by side detail - 1955 Crown Victoria

Joe Fernandez from Superior Shine has a little thread on FB. "Ask Superior Shine" So I asked, the Rupes or Flex

Art

Joe is not only incredibly nice he's also very knowledgeable and always conducts himself in a professional manner. His word is as good as gold. I count him as a very good friend.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Joe Fernandez from Superior Shine has a little thread on FB. "Ask Superior Shine" So I asked, the Rupes or Flex

Art

Don't forget about this little gem... lots of info and pictures...

Rupes 21 & Flex 3401 Comparison + Detailer's Paint Coating


Buffing Curved Panels
For both tools, I had Eric really focus on how the tool worked when buffing curved panels like you see below....

 

[hernandez.art13]

I guess time will tell at which machine I will pick

I was talking to another AG member on the phone. He owns both Flex and Rupes. We talked about how I could go over to his place and try both machines side by side. Before I make my final order next month. I didn't know the Rupes just like the PC, stopped spinning. In a way, (I know they are 2 different machines so I'm sure they each have there advantages and disadvantages. so just saying)

I brought up picking up the bead at Meguiar's on the Rupes and Flex. They told me that I shouldn't because I'll make a mess

I've done it on rotary's, PC and Flex 3401.

That link showed me that it can be done on the Rupes as well. I prefer picking up the bead then applying dots. A nice finish is what should matter in the end. So to each there own.

Thanks for the link Mike :xyxthumbs:

Art

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I brought up picking up the bead at Meguiar's on the Rupes and Flex. They told me that I shouldn't because I'll make a mess

I've done it on rotary's, PC and Flex 3401.

That link showed me that it can be done on the Rupes as well.

I prefer picking up the bead then applying dots.

I prefer picking up a bead also. It just takes a little practice and the most important thing with the Rupes "system" is to make your bead of product short if it's thick or long and thin. The big picture is don't overuse the product.