Isopropyl + ONR prior to OptiCoat 2.0?

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Typerx

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Guys --

Just finished correcting my paint using Sonax PF and a PC7424. I am now ready to make sure the paint is ready for OptiCoat 2.0.

I've read the hearsay about Sonax PF having durable fillers and Sonax USA claiming that isn't the case -- unfortunate it isn't 100% clear. Regardless, I am ready to progress to coating and will keep my fingers crossed! Good news is the OC 2.0 is a leftover syringe from a couple years ago, so no incremental money spent on it.

Suggestions on how to proceed? Options are:
1. One or two wipe downs with ~35% isopropyl (70% diluted 50/50 with distilled water)
2. ONR wash
3. Combination of 1 and 2, could go ONR wash first then isopropyl wipe down or vice versa


Also, any problems with adding a small amount of ONR to my isopropyl mix? I hate the grabbiness of the isomix alone and figured ONR might help that without reducing impacting OptiCoat application.

Thanks!
 
That will work. Optimum actually recommends an ONR wipe down prior to applying Opti-Coat, helps remove polish residue and aids in bonding.
 
I believe if you wash with ONR you can proceed to coating. Also if you polished with an Optimum product the same holds true. You could take the quick way and ONR and coat, or be anal and ONR, IPA wipe or some other panel wipe prior to coating. Either way, good luck!
 
Sorry to highjack the thread from the OP but I am in nearly the same situation. Just finished polishing with menz 4000 and I have either Opti Clean or CarPro Eraser that I could use prior to 2.0. Would I be better using the Optimum product or is Eraser more 'thorough' for using to prep for a coating? Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks!
 
OP, personally, if not using OPT polishes, i'd use IPA if there isn't visible dust and such to remove all oils and residue. if there is dust, i'd use ONR then IPA.

"boomdone", don't use Opti-Clean prior to coating.

it is an awesome product, but it is too rich in polymers for this job. ONR would be ok if you had that.

Eraser works great.
 
builthatch said:
OP, personally, if not using OPT polishes, i'd use IPA if there isn't visible dust and such to remove all oils and residue. if there is dust, i'd use ONR then IPA.

"boomdone", don't use Opti-Clean prior to coating.

it is an awesome product, but it is too rich in polymers for this job. ONR would be ok if you had that.

Eraser works great.
Click to expand...


Awesome, thanks!
 
Any general thoughts on putting a little ONR in with isopropyl/water mix? Just want to make sure it isn't a bad idea.
 
With Sonax, I'd use the strongest IPA you have and do several wipe downs.

No need to ONR after that, but you can if you want to.

When I worked for 3D, we compared all the heavy hitting compounds on fresh jet black paint. When wiping down with 100% IPA, all of them looked like sh*&^t naturally except for S3. Took several more wipe downs to get rid of what ever was hiding. I'd never go near sonax if I was coating. This is just my experience, not an opinion.
 
Typerx said:
I am now ready to make sure the paint
is ready for OptiCoat 2.0.

the OC 2.0 is a leftover syringe from a couple years ago...

Suggestions on how to proceed?
Click to expand...
Just curious:
If you had success...with whatever you used
to prep for OptiCoat 2.0 a couple of years ago...
Couldn't you also use to prep for the
OC 2.0's application this time around?


Bob
 
FUNX650 said:
Just curious:
If you had success...with whatever you used
to prep for OptiCoat 2.0 a couple of years ago...
Couldn't you also use to prep for the
OC 2.0's application this time around?


Bob
Click to expand...

Good point! :)

The stories circulating about Sonax PF just have me double guessing myself on this, and the post directly above yours better indicates why.

I've coated 3 of my cars previously with OptiCoat and have always used Menzerna polish followed by a quick wash (to help reduce the oil left behind and clean up dust) and then alcohol/water wipedown right before the coating.
 
I remember all of the Menzerna oily-stories
that were/are circulating around the interweb.

However:
You evidently overcame those barriers and found
the solution to getting rid of Menzerna's oils.

Are Sonax PF's oils that more formidable?
Surely, for the sake of coating-prep-sanity:
They are not!!


Bob
 
tdekany said:
With Sonax, I'd use the strongest IPA you have and do several wipe downs.

No need to ONR after that, but you can if you want to.

When I worked for 3D, we compared all the heavy hitting compounds on fresh jet black paint. When wiping down with 100% IPA, all of them looked like sh*&^t naturally except for S3. Took several more wipe downs to get rid of what ever was hiding. I'd never go near sonax if I was coating. This is just my experience, not an opinion.
Click to expand...

I've had pretty good success with HD stuff prior to coating. Their stuff being water based probably helps a lot.
 
Typerx said:
Any general thoughts on putting a little ONR in with isopropyl/water mix? Just want to make sure it isn't a bad idea.
Click to expand...

That is my standard IPA mix. I make a 20% IPA mix with Distilled water then add Optimum Wash and shine concentrate to bring it to quick detailer concentration.

I use that for all my Scellant and wax preps. Never had an issue.

The onr will add lubrication to your mix and prevent scratching when you do the wipe down. since you are doing it for a coating I would probably reduce the onr concentration a little since it does leave behind some protection you don't need/want.
 
I didn't do any math on this - just went ahead and added about 1/4 capful of ONR to 16oz of 35% IPA. Did a quick ONR wash/dry after polish to get rid of whatever dust there was and then soaked/wiped down after the wash with the IPA mix. Going to do another wipe down with the IPA mix and then coat.

Since Optimum says ONR before Opticoat is okay, I think the small amount of ONR in the IPA mix should be just fine.

Thanks for the feedback all!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
VP Mark said:
That will work. Optimum actually recommends an ONR wipe down prior to applying Opti-Coat, helps remove polish residue and aids in bonding.
Click to expand...
Mark, wouldn't this same step work for opti-seal as well?

builthatch said:
"boomdone", don't use Opti-Clean prior to coating.

it is an awesome product, but it is too rich in polymers for this job. ONR would be ok if you had that.

Eraser works great.
Click to expand...

Too rich in polymers? Not disputing that claim, but it's the first time I've ever read that. Why wouldn't you use it is a question I ask myself. I suppose I'm thinking either the polymers of both opti-clean and onr are synergistically compatible or they are not. Maybe I am wrong, but that's my "train" of thought anyway.

I've never heard of anyone using (doesn't mean no one has done it, rather, I've never heard of it) opti-clean for clay lube, detail spray, waterless wash, rinseless wash, etc., like you hear about with ONR...and if opti-clean has that many more polymers in it, then one would think it would be "ok" for the above as well as for a wipe down before a coating or before opti-seal. Not only that, but if opti-clean had that much more polymers in it, then wouldn't it leave more of it's own protection behind for water beading than ONR?

What makes Opti-clean and ONR so different anyway? Anybody?
 
Hoytman said:
Too rich in polymers? Not disputing that claim, but it's the first time I've ever read that. Why wouldn't you use it is a question I ask myself. I suppose I'm thinking either the polymers of both opti-clean and onr are synergistically compatible or they are not. Maybe I am wrong, but that's my "train" of thought anyway.

I've never heard of anyone using (doesn't mean no one has done it, rather, I've never heard of it) opti-clean for clay lube, detail spray, waterless wash, rinseless wash, etc., like you hear about with ONR...and if opti-clean has that many more polymers in it, then one would think it would be "ok" for the above as well as for a wipe down before a coating or before opti-seal. Not only that, but if opti-clean had that much more polymers in it, then wouldn't it leave more of it's own protection behind for water beading than ONR?

What makes Opti-clean and ONR so different anyway? Anybody?
Click to expand...

Opti-Clean's benefit is the buffering action of the polymers without water against filth. they are not for residual protection. there are a lot of polymers out there and they have different purposes. the rich concentration of polymers don't add protection to the surface, per se, but could possibly be left over after cleaning since they aren't rinsed and because the concentration is so rich, they could interfere with the bond of the coating to the substrate. in fact, the new version of Opti-Clean specifically cites increasing gloss so that would indicate it's even more of a no no prior to coating. you want no residual anything on the surface if you are going to use Opti-Coat, Gloss-Coat, etc.

outside of obvious performance and concentration differences, i don't know how the polymers are the same or different in ONR vs. Opti-Clean, that is a question for Dr. Ghodoussi.

Opti-Clean is specifically designed to be used at a rather rich solution (3:1) for waterless wash. that concentration makes up for the fact that there is minimal water involved compared to rinseless. yes, it's also a superior instant detailer, in fact, the ultimate instant detailer if you value keeping the surface safe whilst "instant detailing". but, it's expensive compared to the actual instant detailer Optimum offers. so if you strictly want an instant detailer, you should use OID or ONR at that strength since you'd be saving money and getting the job done. save Opti-Clean for cleaning situations where you don't have water and particularly need the safest way to clean a dirty surface.

bottom line is IPA is cheap, especially when diluted with water. ONR, especially at wash dilution, is terribly cheap. those two things are what is recommended by OPT as pre-coating friendly ways to clean the surface. using Opti-Clean, which has not been recommended prior to coating, is more expensive on top of not being recommended.

to whomever was asking about mixing ONR and IPA solution, that's fine. Chris Thomas mentioned it somewhere a while back. i don't remember the dilution details, but wash dilution will certainly work for the water part of the IPA solution.
 
Hoytman, I'm sure it would be beneficial using any polish high in oils can hurt your LSP durability.
 
tdekany said:
Only if you use optimum polishes.
Click to expand...

very valid clarification. thanks Thomas.

yes, OPT has specifically mentioned ONR is fine if using Optimum polishes but otherwise will likely not be sufficient to remove polishing oils, etc. from other brand polishes and thus is not recommended for that. they have recommended several things over the years, any of which would probably suffice: Power Clean wash, Dawn wash, 15% IPA solution, etc.
 
IPA mix after each polishing step. Then use a panel wipe before you apply a coating. Why guess with IPA mixtures after this or that polish?
 
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