Pinnacle Jeweling Wax

fightnews said:
That is false, The abrasives in a jeweling wax are extra fine and have less cut. You could say they all fall into the general catageory of "cleaner waxes" but they are not the same product. There's 3 types of cleaner waxes as far as I know.

Chemical cleaner waxes that use no abrasives to clean

AIO cleaner wax that has abrasive's and or uses chemicals to clean and cut.

Jeweling wax that has ultra fine abrasive's. Similar to a jeweling polish. Think 3800 or rupes ultrafine.

You seem to be asserting that every product is the same?
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For the casual hobbyist I CERTAINLY AM making an argument that they are effectively the same. That's why I started the thread, using PJW as a proxy for the discussion. Whether the pad or product abrades is semantics, chemical cleaners or not, I can understand some may need the granular definition and choose to jewel. But at the end of the day a gold-tipped pen still writes with ink, regardless of how good it looks or expensive it is to acquire.
 
Jeweling wax, cleaner wax, same same, they clean, shine protect. A rose by any other name...
 
A "jeweling wax" Is not going to have as much cut as something like hd speed and it should finish better. I could make the same arguement op is making about wax or anything really. Why is 1 wax $5 dollars and the other $1200 they do the same thing?
 
fightnews said:
A "jeweling wax" Is not going to have as much cut as something like hd speed and it should finish better. I could make the same arguement op is making about wax or anything really. Why is 1 wax $5 dollars and the other $1200 they do the same thing?
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All things being equal, at some point you are being price gouged for something that isn’t x times better than another product.

A company labeling this as a jeweling wax matters very little to me, because if hd speed or blackfire one step both finish down haze free, what can this really do that you’d even be able to notice without pulling out a gloss meter or something?

Hd speed is .93 per ounce
Bf one step is 1.25 per ounce
Pinnacle jeweling wax is 2.87 per ounce

Is it really worth 2-3x more than competing products that are notorious for finishing down beautifully while providing pretty solid correction too?

I’m not trying to bash the product or anything, as it’s clearly not marketed towards someone like me. The value for the $$ just can’t possibly be there (subjective, no doubt.)

But I think it’s definitely worth being realistic about what it is. It’s just an AIO, same as any other abrasive AIO. To label it otherwise just seems like arguing semantics.


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Do a side by side and see if you notice any difference between a jeweling wax and any aio.
 
Finick said:
All things being equal, at some point you are being price gouged for something that isn’t x times better than another product.

A company labeling this as a jeweling wax matters very little to me, because if hd speed or blackfire one step both finish down haze free, what can this really do that you’d even be able to notice without pulling out a gloss meter or something?

Hd speed is .93 per ounce
Bf one step is 1.25 per ounce
Pinnacle jeweling wax is 2.87 per ounce

Is it really worth 2-3x more than competing products that are notorious for finishing down beautifully while providing pretty solid correction too?

I’m not trying to bash the product or anything, as it’s clearly not marketed towards someone like me. The value for the $$ just can’t possibly be there (subjective, no doubt.)

But I think it’s definitely worth being realistic about what it is. It’s just an AIO, same as any other abrasive AIO. To label it otherwise just seems like arguing semantics.


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Well again I disagree, While those AIO's do finish down well there is always room for improvement. When I used blackfire 1 step on my roof it worked well but I'm not going to say it's the best the finish could possibly get. Haze free and perfect are to different things. If the jeweling wax is true to it's name it will finish better or at least the wax inside should be a higher quality.

Some of us do break out the gloss meter. You look like one of us going by your avi pic. Again I could say about a 1000 dollar wax " It’s just a wax, same as any other wax. To label it otherwise just seems like arguing semantics.
 
Ronin47 said:
Do a side by side and see if you notice any difference between a jeweling wax and any aio.
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Side by side comparisons are almost useless. You have to look at the whole car overall at different lights and angles to really see a diffrence between 1 product and another. That's just a fact. Ive seen 100's of side by side comparisons on this site between every diffrent product there is and I almost never see any difference in that setting.

Also if you say there is "no difference" then logicially I assume you don't think there is any difference between any 2 AIO's side by side? So should everything always come down to getting the cheapest product available?
 
Just looked at the Renny Doyle Jeweling Wax (Envy). It's $55 for 16 oz. Clearly there's a market for these products I guess.
 
fightnews said:
Well again I disagree, While those AIO's do finish down well there is always room for improvement. When I used blackfire 1 step on my roof it worked well but I'm not going to say it's the best the finish could possibly get. Haze free and perfect are to different things. If the jeweling wax is true to it's name it will finish better or at least the wax inside should be a higher quality.

Some of us do break out the gloss meter. You look like one of us going by your avi pic. Again I could say about a 1000 dollar wax " It’s just a wax, same as any other wax. To label it otherwise just seems like arguing semantics.
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I think the point is that there are certain AIO's like HD Speed & BF One-step that have the potential to finish as good or better than even the finest finishing polishes on the market. IMO, HD Speed & BF 1-step could easily be considered both an "AIO" as well as a "Jeweling Wax"
 
mwoywod said:
I think the point is that there are certain AIO's like HD Speed & BF One-step have the potential to finish as good or better than even the finest finishing polishes on the market. IMO, HD Speed & BF 1-step could easily be considered both an "AIO" as well as a "Jeweling Wax"
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This was pretty much my point. Hd speed and bf one step easily rivals the finishing polish I have on hand (pinnacle advanced finishing, which i like a lot.)

Trying to quantify where you draw the line on whether something is jeweling or not seems arbitrary, given the nature of how some products finish down on certain paints.

If UC finishes down LSP ready on some paints does that make UC a jeweling compound in those cases? What about m205 or UP? Those finish down beautifully for many people and provide crazy gloss, but I don’t see them labeled for jeweling.

I just think at a certain point you get into an area of detailing where definitions become nebulous, and enthusiasm trumps objectivity.

I don’t advocate the cheapest products, but supporting products that are expensive just to be expensive isn’t really my style.

That being said though; this strikes me as an enthusiast product, which makes sense in terms of pricing.


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Ultra/fine abrasives plus some added protection use to be called an AIO, now they being marketed as Jeweling wax, next they will be called Finesse Wax or Super Gloss Last Step Polish Wax... CarPro Essence has fine abrasives and lays down a high gloss lsp, yeah..Essence is my Jeweling Wax!
 
Ronin47 said:
Ultra/fine abrasives plus some added protection use to be called an AIO, now they being marketed as Jeweling wax,
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I would respectfully disagree.

I've used cleaner/waxes or AIOs if that's the term you like to use to refer to a one-step cleaner/wax, that used ultra fine abrasives and the products micro-marred the HELL out of the paint.

There's a huge difference in what I call abrasive technology used in car care product.


Just because a product says "ultra fine" doesn't mean it's good.


Last night I buffed out a black car using good abrasive technology, paint came out looking great. Today I have another black car to buff out and again I'm going to use great abrasive technology and I assume the paint will come out looking great.

For everyone reading this into the future, I created a poll where I asked what the most important factor is when it comes to polishing paint and the majority of people voted --> Technique.


POLL - What's the number one most important factor when it comes to polishing paint?


The answer technique is ego-driven because it means "you" are the reason paint comes out looking great. Sorry to hurt the feeling of all the alpha male detailers out there but I've shown little kinds, ladies and seasoned members of our society how to make paint look GREAT and they've never used a buffer before in their lives. The reason they were successful wad due to great abrasive technology.


In that poll - I voted abrasive technology and I'm sticking with that answer.


:)
 
Mike@ShineStruck said:
Americana Jeweling polish is better priced
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Denny Doyle product is a finishing polish. That's a perfect example of twisting the name. They have a compound medium polish and a finishing polish. There is no ultrafine jeweling polish.

Look at menzerna, they have 3500 the finishing polish. Then 3800 the ultrafine polish. Same thing with rupes. That's what ultrafine means. It has to be a polish beyond the regular finishing polish
 
Ronin47 said:
Ultra/fine abrasives plus some added protection use to be called an AIO, now they being marketed as Jeweling wax, next they will be called Finesse Wax or Super Gloss Last Step Polish Wax... CarPro Essence has fine abrasives and lays down a high gloss lsp, yeah..Essence is my Jeweling Wax!
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Ultrafine..... as in finer then a fine finishing polish.
 
fightnews said:
Ultrafine..... as in finer then a fine finishing polish.
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Menzerna Power Protect Ultra or PP Ultra as its commonly known works for me as an Aio or Jeweling wax too. Half a dozen of this or 6 of that...
 
Even if u took the abrasives out of it wax quality alone is enough to justify a higher price theoreticially if they are using a better wax
 
Tested out the Pinnacle Jeweling Wax last night on a 2017 Bentley Sport. Sometime in the next few days I'm going to write an open letter to Bentley and highly recommend they change their paint system. I've worked on a lot of paint systems in my life and they have run from the extreme of so hard that you simply cannot buff them and remove defects, (yellow Ferrari story back in Oregon), and so soft that just wiping them with a clean, dry soft microfiber towel risks scratching the paint.

The Bentley paint falls into the extremely soft side of the paint hardness/paint softness spectrum.

I quite frankly don't think the average customer of Bentley could wash and dry this car without marring the hell out of the paint.


I have a Maserati coming in today and I'm going to do the exact same process to it as I did the Bentley. I hope the paint is harder. Here's a couple of pics, I'll post the full review in the next few days, have some work to for my upcoming Roadshow Detailing Classes that takes first priority.


This is AFTER washing...

super_soft_Bentley_paint_002.JPG




This is after the Pinnacle Jeweling wax using the flash of my camera with the overhead lights turned off. That little line below the outline of the flash is not a scratch, it's a reflection of the top curve of the camera lens.

super_soft_Bentley_paint_003.JPG





Insane gloss.... almost looks like it has a ceramic coating...

super_soft_Bentley_paint_005.JPG




Just an old 4-door Bentley....

super_soft_Bentley_paint_004.JPG




You guys can make up your own minds about what words mean but here's what I know from a lot of real-world, hands on experience buffing out thousands of cars over the decades... there is a difference between abrasive technology. You can't just lump all products into the same basket and say they're all the same because they are in the same category.

I guarantee you... not all cleaner/waxes or AIOs can finish out on super soft black paint like a true jeweling wax, that is a cleaner/wax that uses great abrasive technology.


:cheers:
 
Beautiful, Mike. Great job. Looks like a very nice product, one that I will likely want to try out!
 
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