Headlight Restoration-new UV sealant idea

When you say fogginess are you talking about being cloudy or from sandpaper scratches? No direct experience with spar/MS method, but I would assume it would fill in any sanding scratches at 3000 unless mixed too thinly.

If it's internal, there's not much you can do about it. I'm not wild about the spar method, but your process seems good. Would stay away from cordless drill and stick with D/A Groit. I'm assuming you're using 3" disks?

I would also eliminate final clean with MS if you're using alcohol wipe as final step. Just wipe off sanding residue then scrub with alcohol.

Also might suggest using a good sanding aid such as Speedokote during all sanding operations. Gives you a finer surface and minimizes possibility of paper balling. Also increases abrasive lifetime.

Would also try to increase spar to ms ratio. The more spar, the thicker the coating and longer lifetime. Will also cover sanding scratches better.

Depending on temperature and humidity, try 70/30 or 80/20 (spar vs. MS). Apply just a small patch and see how it flows. If it's too thick to apply, just wipe it off with MS, add additional MS and try again. After awhile, I've heard it's easy to judge conditions and mix accordingly.

Make sure you are using a quality paper like Mirka, 3M, Norton, etc. Paper quality does matter and will last longer. May be more expensive to buy, but cheaper overall because it will lower sanding efforts and last longer. Sanding aid also helps.
Ray6
 
It MIGHT be fogginess deep in the plastic itself, or on the inside of the headlight.

Or, has it been humid up your way lately, so that moisture is getting to the sealant as it cures?
 
All of my papers are Norton except the last step 3M trizec. All 3" on the Girot DA.

I've always used just water for a sanding aid. I didn't realize a special aid would help that much. Do you recommend wet sanding all the way up or doing some dry sanding at first?

Is there a way to rule out the humidity factor?

I'll also try thickening the mix as well.

Thanks.
Doug
 
Could try turning the headlights on high beam for a few minutes to drive off humidity. Also, as Ray said, the alcohol wipe might be the better choice for the final cleaning before coating, as alcohol is miscible with water and could draw out more moisture, if you allow it to dry thoroughly before applying the urethane (another reason to turn the headlights on).
 
I recommend using sanding aid for all steps.
Eliminates dust.
Lubricates abrasive and keeps headlight cooler.
Makes removed particles float on the surface instead of clogging up abrasive.
Lower evaporation rate than water.
Speedokote is also a foam so it sticks well to the surface.

Downside is that if you're not careful, it will throw slurry on paint that will have to be wiped off when done.

Although Speedokote is great, if you don't have it, add Dawn dishwashing soap to your water. Wipe your disk frequently.

High humidity or moisture on the headlight when applying coating will generally show itself as white streaking.

If humidity/temperature is a constant problem, I would consider going to a 2K water based coating. More expensive than solvent based, but much easier to work with and longer lifetime. Would probably add 75 cents cost per headlight.
ray6
 
There's been so much talk about using the spar/MS method we were able to get a sample from one of our out of state dealers (can't buy it in California) and run some tests. Was actually surprised how well it did, but still am concerned with it's projected lifetime.
Will follow up with the same test sequance using other coating products.
Left photo
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13350&stc=1&d=1346259508
This is what the headlight surface looks like before restoration. The UV protective layer has broken down and is no longer cross-linked.
next
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13351&stc=1&d=1346259508
This is what the surface looks like after sanding with 500 grit.
next
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13352&stc=1&d=1346259508
Here's 1000 grit.
next
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13353&stc=1&d=1346259508
Here's 1500 grit, minimum for most solvent based coatings.
Far right
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/attachment.php?
attachmentid=13354&stc=1&d=1346259508
Here's the surface after 1 coat of spar/MS at 50:50. Notice how it fills in most of the sanding scratches.
ray6
 
Last edited:
I did a pair last night, modifying slightly. Unfortunately I didn't read your post about the speedcoat / dawn, so used water as a lube from 800 up. If neither is available, would Optimum No Rinse / water combination be ok?

400, 600 dry
800, 1500, 3000 wet

Cleaned everything with Odorless Mineral Spirits, had the lights put on for a few minutes. Cleaned again twice with Proponol then sealed. Once again, they looked great till the lights were turned on and then you could see some cloudiness. It didn't seem humid at the time.

Do the rest of you get no noticeable haziness / cloudiness even with the lights on?

Thanks
 
All i gotta say is WOW! Tried this today on one of my headlights for a sample. Last week I resurfaced my headlights as they were starting to oxidize and had some deeper scratches in them. My normal process is 800,1500,2000 wet sand, then polish & UV protect with meguiars, but last week I sealed with this new PTFE/Acrylic sealant I have.

So today I wanted to do one headlight with the 50/50 Mineral spirits and spar urethane. SO i cleaned the headlights with 70% Ipa, sanded with 2000, IPA again, then the 50/50 mixture.

I had to do my light 2 times because i found that the more you try and level out the lines while it's drying, the more lines you get and it doesn't look even. So i cleaned with mineral spirits and then IPA again and went back with the mixture. I soakd the shop towel good and in straight and flowing motion coated the headlights and only went over 2-3 times and left it. The lines evened themselves out and it dried to perfection. This method is noticeably better than polishing. the headlight really looks brand new now. WOW!
 
Always Learning said:
I did a pair last night, modifying slightly. Unfortunately I didn't read your post about the speedcoat / dawn, so used water as a lube from 800 up. If neither is available, would Optimum No Rinse / water combination be ok?

400, 600 dry
800, 1500, 3000 wet

Cleaned everything with Odorless Mineral Spirits, had the lights put on for a few minutes. Cleaned again twice with Proponol then sealed. Once again, they looked great till the lights were turned on and then you could see some cloudiness. It didn't seem humid at the time.

Do the rest of you get no noticeable haziness / cloudiness even with the lights on?

Thanks
Click to expand...


You may have a problem simply with the inside of the lens. If the lens is not sealed properly from the factory dirt and moisture can get in (also if the bulbs seal is no good), or if there are cracks somewhere.....you can get cloudiness/fog on the inside. There is no way to fix that...unless you have a way to seperate the two halves....clean the inside...and reassemble with a sealer so that it is air-tight.
Also, some lenses simply have damage to the polycarbonite itself and this will show up when you turn the headlights on. Nothing that I know of can fix this condition.
 
I would suggest not using 70% IPA for your final clean. 70% contains 30% water. Water is your enemy. You're better off just using the MS as a final clean.

100% alcohol will clean slightly better than MS and will dry faster, but MS is better than 70% IPA since moisture can give you real problems.
ray6
 
ADD on to my post above:

A couple of days have gone by. the headlights still look awesome, however when you touch the headlight now, it feels still tacky and it scratches very easily. It seems the urethane/MS @ 50/50 doesn't dry to a rock hard shell. I think over time debris will stick to it a little and leave behind light scratches after you clean it.

Is there anything to do to make it dry to a harder shell?
 
jrs1418 said:
ADD on to my post above:

A couple of days have gone by. the headlights still look awesome, however when you touch the headlight now, it feels still tacky and it scratches very easily. It seems the urethane/MS @ 50/50 doesn't dry to a rock hard shell. I think over time debris will stick to it a little and leave behind light scratches after you clean it.

Is there anything to do to make it dry to a harder shell?
Click to expand...


It should have been dry and hard long before 2 days. Something is not right. The lights I do are dry to the touch in about 1/2 hour. What type of container are you using to mix your MS/Spar in? Maybe the MS is melting some of your container and its mixing with your coating thus changing the drying/hardening ability of the coating..?
 
I used a plastic mixing cup they sold in the fiberglass resin patch area. Seems like a heavy duty kind of cup.

Maybe I mis-explained, yes its dry. But since its urethane the headlights take a feeling up urethane'd wood, where the surface is still a little tacky feeling and kinda soft shell'ed no matter how long its been on.
 
Thanks for the tips on cloudiness. I was really afraid that maybe I wasn't spending enough time on the finer papers or needed to add an intermediate, say 1000 or 1200. My average time start to finish is 1.5 hours so I would think that I'm doing enough steps, since it sounds like most of the pros are much quicker.

I'd really like to get my time down without sacrificing quality. I find the proponol works great, really like the characteristics of it and always wipe down twice before apply any sealant.

Doug
 
Update: It has since dried and hardened very well, no more tacky feeling. But it does get scratch rather lightly, if i just rub my finger on it there's a small scratch left behind.

Which gives me a question to ask u guys.. Why can't you do this with clearcoat in a can instead of Spar Urethane?
 
hello everone! so im going to attempt to this on my 06 mustang gt, ill post a picture in a min to everyone can see the condition, i wanted to start out with 800, 1200 then 1600. question is , besides the sandpaper, what product should i use to polish it with? and i dont have a buffer, but a drill and where do i get the attachmnet with the local stores?
 
I've also got yet another question.

I know the importance of using decent quality abrasives, what line of Norton, 3M and Mirka abrasives should I use as a minimum?

I've been using Norton right for all steps except 3000 for which I've been using the 3M Trizec. I'm not sure off hand the Line of the Norton discs I've been using.

I'm curious since I'm in need in new supplies. If anyone knows of a reliable supplier that ships to Canada, I'd really appreciate an PM :xyxthumbs:
 
so i used the 3m kit, and im not too sure what to say. im still getting a haze after applying the compound and not a bright shine?
 
jrs1418 said:
Update: It has since dried and hardened very well, no more tacky feeling. But it does get scratch rather lightly, if i just rub my finger on it there's a small scratch left behind.

Which gives me a question to ask u guys.. Why can't you do this with clearcoat in a can instead of Spar Urethane?
Click to expand...

By clearcoat, I assume you mean like a 1k or 2k spray? As in, what they use to clear coat paint on cars? People do all the time. The issue with spraying, is having a controlled enough environment. For a mobile service that is not easy to do. Plus all the extra masking, and such. As for any kind of brush on or wipe on clear I would think it either doesn't self level enough, have UV protection, or is too thin to use on a vertical surface. Although, I have not looked into it.



blvd85 said:
so i used the 3m kit, and im not too sure what to say. im still getting a haze after applying the compound and not a bright shine?
Click to expand...


The 3M compound gets it almost clear. I have noticed this as well. The good news is that once you spar it, it will look like new. In my experience that has been the case on over 100 vehicles. You will also probably find that most of your customers thinks that it looks great even before you spar it. I had a guy that thought I was done and he was thrilled with it, when I was only finished with the trizact step.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top