First shot at fixing the black Vette

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J S Machine

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I got my package in from autogeek today and went to work on a test spot with my car. If you have not seen it, my black Corvette is pretty swirled up, and in addition to that it has wet sanding marks. The last detailer who did the wet sanding must have loaded up his paper occasionally, because I have straight line zig zag marks here and there, like where a piece of grit or dirt got in between the paper and the paint while he was rubbing. Here's a pic of some of the damage:

2012-10-19_17-09-51_363.jpg


So anyway, I went to work with a orange low profile pad, and Wolfgang TSR using the PCXP. I primed my pad with pad conditioner, and did the exact same steps that Mike Phillips does in his swirl removal vids - one, two, and three on youtube.

I made 6 section passes and checked it out. It got the majority of the swirls out, but the straight line scratches still show through in some places. They are obviously deeper and they could be too deep in certain places. I took some 2000 grit paper and lightly sanded a few of them and the came right out. The ones I checked beforehand did not catch my fingernail. I think very few of them are that deep.

Now the problem I'm having is that after another six section passes with TSR and an orange pad, the sanding marks I made are not coming out. I think I need something more aggressive. I'm told there isn't too much difference between the yellow pads and orange, so if I had some compound with a little more cut, I may try that.

Interestingly, the clear which was applied in the repaint last year is softer than I expected. It feels just about like 48 hour old clear. It was very easy to wet sand. I guess this is a good thing, because I won't wear myself out too bad doing the rest of the car. Just need some suggestions on what else to try.

I do have a bottle of Presta Ultra cutting creme, which is what I have used before with a wool pad and rotary. I'm scared to use the rotary on this though. I feel like the D/A should be able to correct most of this.
 
There are a lot of different flavors here and differing opinions too. I'd be using Meguiars M-105 on your car and having followed the threads on your car, I'd check my work after every 2 section passes to be sure I wasn't removing more of the precious clear than necessary to remove the sanding marks. Then finish with a finishing polish of your choice.

Expect the 105 to flash dry rather quickly and begin to dust some. Just because it's flashing doesn't mean it's not still cutting. I think that's the problem most folks have with 105, they think just because it appears to be drying up that it's done cutting. Simply not so. There is a bit of a learning curve with it but with your orange pads it's likely the best choice of compounds to cut the defects that you're working on.
 
I get mine at Advance Auto in the body shop supplies isle, or any body shop supply business should carry it. The Wally World about 30 miles from here carries it too...for now... I think it was Michael Stoops that made a thread over at MOL that lists all the WalMarts that will carry the MF disks/G110V2 and they should all also have the 105.
 
Here you go, is this walmart anywhere near you?

State City Street Address
AL BOAZ 1972 HWY 431

Edit...Looks like you'd have better luck at Advance or an auto body supply, or of course ordering from AG.
 
tuscarora dave said:
... I think it was Michael Stoops that made a thread over at MOL that lists all the WalMarts that will carry the MF disks/G110V2 and they should all also have the 105.
Click to expand...

ANy chance of getting that list here? Zip 78258
 
I wonder how much difference there is between the megs 105 and Presta Ultra cutting compound?

From what I've read, not much...

The problem is that I would like to use it with the D/A but I don't know if a foam pad will work though.
 
Paint correction is all about trial and error. Never really know how things will work out until you do a test section.

If I had to guess, I'd say that the Presta is more of diminishing abrasive compound designed for rotary use that may have to be worked for quite a while to break down the abrasives with a DA, if it even will break down properly at all. Now keep in mind that this is a guess from experience at trying out auto body production type compounds.

You'll most likely have quite a hazy finish left after chemically removing polishing oils and fillers and you'll likely be removing too much clear as you try and try to get decent results with it. Not to mention the clear you'll remove finishing out the hazy paint after compounding with your Presta Compound.

The non diminishing abrasives in M-105 don't have to be broken down and are pretty fine to begin with so you can have a really controlled amount of clear removal with a really nice finish as you check your work after each section pass.

You'd be better off to grab a small bottle of Ultimate Compound that can be purchased anywhere, and just forget about that Presta product.

If you had plenty of clear coat to experiment with it really wouldn't be a big deal, but now that you've had multiple hacks running rotary buffers over your paint, I'd suggest leaving the experimentation to other projects and go with a product that's easy to use and easy to follow in terms of how much clear is being removed.

You may or may not understand this stuff I'm typing, depending on whether you've used any SMAT compounds yet. They are a simple "turn the machine on and buff, stop and check your work" type of product that finish very well without the need to work and work and work the product to break down the abrasives.
 
Point taken and understood.

will I be able to use the 105 with my PCXP?

Pad recomendations?

Follow up?

Would this replace the Wolfgang TSR and should I just go to the Wolfgang polish after 105?
 
I just googled the Presta product and read their product description and it's pretty much exactly as I typed it out above. Just a typical production diminishing abrasive rotary compound. I would save that for when you get to rotary buffing something and get yourself some SMAT products for your Corvette project. The marks you are currently trying to get rid of on your Corvette are caused (Partly) by the Presta type products.

Presta is simply not the right tool for the job in your case as a DA user. I'm sure you've come to this site to get set straight in your efforts so leave the Presta to the production guys and step up in technology.
 
J S Machine said:
Point taken and understood.

will I be able to use the 105 with my PCXP?

Pad recomendations?

Follow up?

Would this replace the Wolfgang TSR and should I just go to the Wolfgang polish after 105?
Click to expand...
Absolutely. Just go with your orange pad and run a pass or 2 and see where it takes you. I hope you realize that my posts are in the helpful spirit and not me trying to look like a know it all. Did the TSR finish nicely? If so finish with that on a finishing pad.
 
I do realize you guys are just trying to help. I know how delicate this situation is because of the previous attempts, and I'm just trying my best to save what's left. Not in to letting anybody else "try". I know I can do it, I just have to find the best combination of pad and chemical.

The TSR finished up awesome, but those little sanding scratches remained. Here is a pic I took before I started. If you look close, you can see the straight line scratches very slightly running vertically. After I finished, the swirls were just about gone and those stuck out like a sore thumb (now that they were not being camoflaged by the swirls.)

2012-10-29_17-54-23_517.jpg


Truth be told, they would probably come out if I made about twenty more section passes..but if I have to do this on the rest of the car it might be next year before I finish, lol
 
Well, no luck. I hit an O'Reillys, autozone, and walmart yesterday, in addition to one of the paint supply stores near me. None of them had 105 or 205. I did buy a bottle of Diamond cut compound, thinking it was the same thing as the 105 (just a newer brand name change).

I called Meguiars as soon as I left the paint supply store and they pretty much told me that Diamond cut is for rotaries only. They said it would not do much good when used with a D/A. They said the 105 has MATS technology - better for use with a D/A...After reading here and on google, this appears to be the case. Obviously 105 is waaaay better. I would place another order, but I'd really like to get my hands on some of this stuff by the weekend. If I order it today that most likely won't be the case. My last order with autogeek was placed last wed, and I didn't get it until this past monday. I need the weekend to work...time changes next week and I won't have the daylight in the afternoons.

I guess I might try to drive to boaz, and just pray they have it.

Also to note: Someone told me yesterday that the reason the clear may be softer is because of flex additive being added. At first I thought "why would they add this to the paint and spray the whole car, vs. only spraying the areas that need it (Bumper covers)"...but then I realized in a body shop world, that would most likely never happen because it takes too much time and costs too much..

But then I ran that by the guy at the paint supply store and he said that very few people even use it anymore..He said with the advances in polyurethane clear technology, it really isn't needed as much. That being said, I'm not sure mine has it or not, but that could be the reason my clear is so soft.
 
Sorry to hear of all the running around without finding what you're looking for. Diamond Cut will pretty much be just as I described how I thought the Presta compound would be in reply#11, It will cut the sanding marks but will require more follow up work to get the clear looking haze free and glossy. Definitely not what you want to use on a car that has the detailing history that your car has. It is quite aggressive.

Meguiar's Ultimate compound will be your next best choice if you can't find 105. I think you could find Meguiar's Ultimate Compound nearly anywhere. It has the non diminishing Super Micro Abrasive Technology that 105 has but isn't quite as aggressive as 105. Ultimate Compound will just take a little longer to achieve the results than 105 is all.
 
You might want to get a few MF pads. Not only will it have an easier time getting those sanding scratches out, it might reduce your workload as far as number of passes required for compounding.
 
I would follow Dave's advice in picking up a bottle of Meguiar's Ultimate Compound. It doesn't have the learning curve that M105 has, which may not be a bad thing with how frustrated I can imagine you are with the situation you're currently in. Ultimate Compound still has quite a bit of cut, so if your clear is as soft as you're saying, you shouldn't have an issue with getting those sanding marks out fairly quickly. And you can pick up a 16oz bottle of it, nearly anywhere for around $10 and that will definitely do your entire Vette with plenty to spare. Follow that up with your fine polish and admire your work.
 
So the Ultimate compound will give me good results too? How would it compare to the 105?

I can get the 105 from autogeek, but I'm probably gonna have to pay two day shipping to get it to me by friday.

If I can get the Ultimate compound anywhere and it will get these scratches out, I'll surely go pick up a bottle. I assume I just use it with my orange flat pads?

Also, I'm curious how it compares ot the TSR. I just don't want to get stuck with another product that isn't strong enough that leaves me looking again..
 
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