Eric@CherryOnTop
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My opinion is that the Flex with Wolfgang twins finished down better than the Rupes with Rupes polishes. They took the same amount of time to complete a half of the hood.
Rupes 21 & Flex 3401 Comparison + Detailer's Paint Coating
- Thread starter Mike Phillips
- Start date
I have both but can't give an answer as the risk for an keyboard war would ensue. :dblthumb2:
rmagnus
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- May 28, 2011
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Do tell
I'm about to buy a Rupes21. But have wanted a FLEX for so long.
I'm only buying the 21 because everyone is telling me its the best thing since sliced bread.
My logic tells me the FLEX should be more powerful.
Your logic is sound. 3401 is the most powerful DA out there but it's not that simple. There is a place for the Rupes. There is no one BEST polisher and sliced bread is more convienent but may not be the best. It comes down to personal preference then getting to be an expert with your equipment.
I've seen incredible work done by both polishers. As the saying goes "It's the indian not the arrow."
I like forced rotation because IMO it's more consistent. YMMV.
PS if you're a big fan of the mf system maybe a traditional DA is the way to go because the 3401 isn't matched to this system very well. But then when you have this much power you really don't need the mf system that much. mf was designed to give the underpowered DA's more cut to compete with the rotary for better correction work.
JSou
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I did a side by side comparison with the Rupes from when I wetsanded the Charger. Wish I would've documented it better.
I gave the Rupes a slight advantage in correcting due to speed. It corrected down the sanding marks with 4 section passes than what I could do in 6 section passes on the FLEX. Very slow movement about an inch every 2.5 seconds. Pad was a HT Tangerine and product was M105 for both. The big stroke of the Rupes is maybe the factor here.
When I used the Flex on the fender and where the hood bumps up it didn't stop! I loved that. The Rupes didn't either but I was having a hard time guiding it over and up the body lines. The FLEX felt planted and I just floored through the curves. The precise feel and power of the FLEX is great. It's not hard to handle and I haven't experienced the "walking" everyone talks about. Didn't mind that it rotates counterclockwise neither.
The Rupes is enjoyable. Very smooth and you really just let the machine/pad/product do the work as you guide it along. The machine really got hot after 7 straight hours of use in 90 degree weather. Just wanted to note that.
I've had the pleasure of clocking several hours and spent long nights playing with both, I need to have 'em all!
My thoughts...
Bigger flat panels = Rupes
Curvy, contoured panels = FLEX
I own the Rupes 21. Love the machine but the FLEX is in my cart and I hope to make the purchase this week!
I gave the Rupes a slight advantage in correcting due to speed. It corrected down the sanding marks with 4 section passes than what I could do in 6 section passes on the FLEX. Very slow movement about an inch every 2.5 seconds. Pad was a HT Tangerine and product was M105 for both. The big stroke of the Rupes is maybe the factor here.
When I used the Flex on the fender and where the hood bumps up it didn't stop! I loved that. The Rupes didn't either but I was having a hard time guiding it over and up the body lines. The FLEX felt planted and I just floored through the curves. The precise feel and power of the FLEX is great. It's not hard to handle and I haven't experienced the "walking" everyone talks about. Didn't mind that it rotates counterclockwise neither.
The Rupes is enjoyable. Very smooth and you really just let the machine/pad/product do the work as you guide it along. The machine really got hot after 7 straight hours of use in 90 degree weather. Just wanted to note that.
I've had the pleasure of clocking several hours and spent long nights playing with both, I need to have 'em all!
My thoughts...
Bigger flat panels = Rupes
Curvy, contoured panels = FLEX
I own the Rupes 21. Love the machine but the FLEX is in my cart and I hope to make the purchase this week!
hernandez.art13
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- Apr 8, 2013
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I wish Rotary's didn't leave holograms because that is what I am comfortable with. Simple and easy to use.
WRAPT C5Z06
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I don't think this is a "comparison" of the two machines, as different pads and products were used. Great documentation, nonetheless. :dblthumb2:
WRAPT C5Z06
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I disagree. When I need the MOST cut, a MF pad on a DA will out cut anything I've ever used on the 3401.
Wheelzntoys
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- Dec 18, 2011
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Past two details I've only used 1 step with Rupes green pad and green compound, love this combo!
It would of benefited for a follow up polish but car owners did not want the extra time put into it - their approval.
Black VW Jetta
brianch
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- Jul 21, 2012
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When I am aiming for pure cut I just use wool with rotary.
WRAPT C5Z06
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No doubt about that. I wasn't comparing a rotary.
c8n
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Won't be making a purchase anytime soon, but which of the two compliments the HF DA better?
What I am thinking is to use either the Flex or the Rupes to do the bulk of the work and then use the HF DA with 4" pad to go after the RIDS since I would want to go slow on the RIDS as to not to take off clear coat no more than needed. I don't detail for a living so time is not that big of an issue but I still do value efficiency. Not only do I maintain my cars but I also work on friends' cars from time to time.
Am I on the right track with my thoughts regarding these two machines?
Having said that, I am kind of leaning towards the Flex....Feed back please
What I am thinking is to use either the Flex or the Rupes to do the bulk of the work and then use the HF DA with 4" pad to go after the RIDS since I would want to go slow on the RIDS as to not to take off clear coat no more than needed. I don't detail for a living so time is not that big of an issue but I still do value efficiency. Not only do I maintain my cars but I also work on friends' cars from time to time.
Am I on the right track with my thoughts regarding these two machines?
Having said that, I am kind of leaning towards the Flex....Feed back please
Mike Phillips
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- Dec 5, 2022
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I have all the pictures, just need the time to process them and than create the article.
The tires do look amazing though!
Good question and the answer is after you detail a car, if it's yours and you take care of it in a way that you won't have to compound it again.
If it's for a customer, you educate them on how to take care of your work so it won't have to be compounded again.
If the car in question is a daily driver and it's going to be abused, then you shouldn't be compounding it to put a show car finish on it in the first place but instead, maintain the finish and learn to live with the deeper defects as it's just going to get more scratches into the future.
Make sense?
Mike Phillips
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Thanks Al.
The last time trial I did for those reading this that might not know about it was when I buffed out a 1955 Ford Crown Victoria and I taped the car off right down the middle and used the Rupes Bigfoot 15 on one side and the Rupes Bigfoot 21 on the other side and tracked my time and even made a time lapse video of the entire process.
There was and still is talk about how a larger orbit enables a person to detail a car FASTER than a tool with a smaller orbit because the pad and the abrasives are being moved over a greater distance in the same OPM's (or something like that).
What I found was the Rupes 21 did enable me to do one side of the car faster but only by about 20 minutes as compared to the Rupes 15 and this was using all Rupes polishes and the Rupes were in their stock configuration.
To me the 20 minute difference is negligible and a mute point in the big picture and by that I mean if you're going to buff out a trashed car from start to finish it's going to take say 8 hours on average, maybe less time, maybe more time depending on who you are, your style and what you do, and cutting 20 minutes off the ENTIRE time isn't that big of a deal unless you're really in a hurry to get home or something...
Here's the video...
Rupes Polisher Time Lapse Video - 1955 Ford Crown Victoria
Here's the time-lapse video Yancy took for me as I buffed this classic out from start to finish...
[video=youtube_share;v7FjGcMCTEg&hd=1"]RUPES 21ES Vs 15 ES time comparison Time lapse -...[/video]
On the passenger side I used the Rupes 21 and on the driver's side I used the Rupes 15. There was about a 20 minute time savings using the larger pad, larger stroke machine over the smaller pad, smaller stroke machine but my opinion is that for most body panel designs on modern cars the 6" pad will be a better match.
This tool definitely has a lot more correction ability plus power over a traditional DA Polisher like the Porter Cable 7424XP.
I did find that when buffing a curved panel, either concave or convex, the uneven pressure applied to the face of the pad will slow down and even stop pad rotation. The key is to focus on the panel and keep the pad as flat as possible to the surface.
And because people from around the world will read this thread into the future, here's the products I used on the 1955 Ford Crown Victoria.
On Autogeek.net
Rupes LHR21ES Random Orbit Polisher
Rupes Zephir Gloss Coarse Gel Compound 500 ml.
Rupes Quarz Gloss Medium Gel Compound 500 ml.
Rupes Keramik Gloss Fine Gel Polish 500 ml.
Rupes Diamond Ultra Fine Gel Polish 500 ml.
RUPES Color Matched 7" Foam Buffing Pads
All RUPES Polishers, Pads and Polishes
Here's the write-up, if you've never read this before the pictures really tell the story...
Rupes side by side detail - 1955 Crown Victoria
When this classic Ford arrived here it was both contaminated and filled with swirls and scratches, but when it left she looked like she just popped out of the paint booth...
That project was a lot of work. Not just buffing out the car and keeping "on time" to make it a fair test, (that means hustling), but the writing up all the steps and then processing all the pictures took a lot of time.
Mike Phillips
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Thanks P Y
Just a passion thing...
Thanks Mike, I have the 1932 parked outside as we type and I'll take some Sun Shots today before it clouds up and rains.
I think we have some pretty cool cars that come and go through our shop. When I watch all the "Car Guy TV Shows", these are the kinds of cars they are working on, not new or modern cars, except for a couple of shows that are sponsored by car companies.
I once saw Bryan Fuller and Kevin Byrd hotrodding a Toyota Prius on Two Guys Garage and both Stacy and I laughed. Kind of felt embarrased for them at the same time. Nothing wrong with a Prius but I think Toyota already did all the engineering need for that car to do it's thing.
Can't wait to see your post and read your thoughts...
:xyxthumbs:
hernandez.art13
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- Apr 8, 2013
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I have all the pictures, just need the time to process them and than create the article.
The tires do look amazing though!
Good question and the answer is after you detail a car, if it's your you take care of it in a way that you won't have to compound it again.
If it's for a customer, you educate them on how to take care of your work so it won't have to be compounded again.
If the car in question is a daily driver and it's going to be abused, then you shouldn't be compounding it to put a show car finish on it in the first place but instead, maintain the finish and learn to live with the deeper defects as it's just going to get more scratches into the future.
Make sense?
Yes it does, thank you
Hi Mike, when you say "won't have to compound it again" could you elaborate on your continuum from compounding to polishing? In other words, does your definition of compounding end at some particularly heavy/aggressive pad and chemical combination, and anything even slightly less aggressive than that you don't call it compounding you call it polishing, even if it's say a "medium cut compound" and a cutting pad?
I didn't really think about the different places one could draw the line in the terminology distinction before reading what you wrote above, but I had been considering anything up to a very fine polish as a "compounding step" (or simplistically, if a step removes any paint defect, even a fine/faint swirl, I was considering it a compounding step) and it sounds like you draw the line (for a compounding step) at a much more aggressive level than that? Or maybe I'm misinterpreting what you wrote above....
Mike Phillips
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Good question.... without getting too deep... I call a compound a compound and a polish a polish but when it comes to polishes they offer various levels of cut.
I didn't really think about the different places one could draw the line in the terminology distinction before reading what you wrote above, but I had been considering anything up to a very fine polish as a "compounding step" (or simplistically, if a step removes any paint defect, even a fine/faint swirl, I was considering it a compounding step) and
it sounds like you draw the line (for a compounding step) at a much more aggressive level than that?
Or maybe I'm misinterpreting what you wrote above....[/QUOTE]
You are correct and you did not misinterpret what I wrote. I would never consider a polish or write about polishing with a polish as compounding.