FG400 Question

What size pad are you using? With the PCXP, speed 5 is fine. Clean your pad on the fly with a pad conditioning brush(after every section) instead of the pad washer. Start with a "X" on a fresh pad, then follow with 3 drops thereafter. Use enough pressure to keep ample backing plate rotation, but don't use too little pressure.

Agree here. I have used it at 5.5 on the GG6 (6370 OPM) and had great results (5.5" orange flat LC). If you do 4 slow section passes with good downward pressure and 2 passes at lighter pressure, you should get good results. Here's a trashed Nissan Armada (fresh from Nissan dealership..."certified used"). Granted it was about 110F with humidity that day which could have allowed a longer working time.

The clear on this was medium - harder than I expected for japanese clear.
 
Agree here. I have used it at 5.5 on the GG6 (6370 OPM) and had great results (5.5" orange flat LC). If you do 4 slow section passes with good downward pressure and 2 passes at lighter pressure, you should get good results. Here's a trashed Nissan Armada (fresh from Nissan dealership..."certified used"). Granted it was about 110F with humidity that day which could have allowed a longer working time.

The clear on this was medium - harder than I expected for japanese clear.
:props:
 
Really glad to see all this info just pouring in! Hopefully it ends up helping a lot of others as well!

I will get out there this morning and try it again!

I am using a 5.5 pad as well. Man, this detailing thing becomes addictive after seeing results.
 
Really glad to see all this info just pouring in! Hopefully it ends up helping a lot of others as well!

I will get out there this morning and try it again!

I am using a 5.5 pad as well. Man, this detailing thing becomes addictive after seeing results.

You've just started too lol. It only gets worse!

Let us know your results, lots of great feedback and reliable members giving great information here.
 
Also IMO, Menzerna polishes as well as Wolfgang polishes are more effective with the closed cell designed pad rather than the open cell design featured on many other pads. The closed cell design allows more of the polish to stay on the face of the pad rather than being saturated into the pad.

This is some very insightful information here!

I've been pondering this myself.

1. Will an open cell pad be less efficient in breaking down the abrasive?

2. Would reducing the amount of product applied to the pad mitigate the reduced pressure offered by an often more pliable open cell pad, and the possibility of pad saturation?

I predominantly use smat polishes on open cell pads (and microfiber) and find that kbm/too much product hinders overall performance, and over saturates the pad. I also find that I don't need much pressure to achieve cut with that set up. The two open cell pads I use most are the green the logic, and pink ccs.

However, with the Menzerna polishes in my cart, I'm leaning towards Cyan Hydrotech for the 400, and White flat for the 4000 on the PC. I feel like the extra rigidity of the Cyan will really assist in getting the most out of that FG 400.
 
Really glad to see all this info just pouring in! Hopefully it ends up helping a lot of others as well!

I will get out there this morning and try it again!

I am using a 5.5 pad as well. Man, this detailing thing becomes addictive after seeing results.

Just wait till you start having dreams of polishers, pads, etc...
 
Exactly. The week after every AG sale -- think Bing Crosby's Holiday Inn, a sale every holiday on the calendar -- is like waiting for Xmas morning!

It gets bad enough that even if you're only a weekend warrior, your garage will be better stocked and likely better equipped than most of the local "pro" detailing shops (read: "welfare make-work" hand car washes). I likely have more polishers, pads, towels and product here than any of the local big-name detailing outfits, and I'm pretty sure I do better work than most of what they turn out. I'm not knocking them -- they are in business to make money, and as MP says, the money is in "make it shiny," defect correction be darned.
 
dlc95: Those dreams have already started LOL!

I think I'll pick-up a Hydro-tech Cyan pad today as I've read a few people having good success with that and FG400. Will also pick-up some Optimum Power Cleaner as well for interior cleaning.
 
Again, get six pads in one color, whichever color, for compounding. I got four orange and four white LC Hybrids when I got my Flex, and found that even with cleaning on the fly or brushing four oranges were not enough for a normal midsize car. Ended up using a couple of whites on less-trashed sections. I've since ordered a pad washer (blame Smack again) and a couple extra pads in each color.
 
This is some very insightful information here!

I've been pondering this myself.

1. Will an open cell pad be less efficient in breaking down the abrasive?

2. Would reducing the amount of product applied to the pad mitigate the reduced pressure offered by an often more pliable open cell pad, and the possibility of pad saturation?

I predominantly use smat polishes on open cell pads (and microfiber) and find that kbm/too much product hinders overall performance, and over saturates the pad. I also find that I don't need much pressure to achieve cut with that set up. The two open cell pads I use most are the green the logic, and pink ccs.

However, with the Menzerna polishes in my cart, I'm leaning towards Cyan Hydrotech for the 400, and White flat for the 4000 on the PC. I feel like the extra rigidity of the Cyan will really assist in getting the most out of that FG 400.

1. I have no concrete evidence that an open cell pad takes longer to break down DAT based polishes. But IME personally, I have achieved better results with Menzerna polishes on closed cell pads rather than open cell pads. With a closed cell pad, less product is needed and more of that product stays on the face of the pad rather than being absorbed into the foam.

Also, a flat faced closed cell pad ensures maximum performance from DAT based polishes as it forces and even 100% of the product to work at the same time. With an open face pad, bits of polish will be re distributed as centrifugal force dictates and thus introducing a continual fresh set of larger abrasives into a mixture of smaller abrasives that are in the process of being broken down.

Yes, I may be nit picking but I like to ensure that every component of my selection Machine, pad, polish etc) are all working in harmony to achieve their utmost performance.

2. Yes. With DAT based polishes you need a firm yet pliable pad with closed cell construction to ensure that the polishes is evenly broken down in an efficient manner without over saturation into the pad. This style pad selection for DAT polishes ensures maximum performance IME.

The KBM method with DAT polishes regardless of pad choice greatly hinders the ability of said polish to perform at maximum performance often with less than desirable results. Here you want to ensure that said DAT polish is taken from 100% in a fresh state to fully exhausted 0% and that no cross contamination i.e. mixture of fresh polish with partially broken down polish occurs. Hence the reason I feel that CCS pads are not a great pad for DAT polishes.

Now with a closed cell pad regardless of machine choice you want to be rather heavy handed at first to engage the abrasives to break them down and cut the paint. After 2-3 passes ease up and finally come to no downward pressure on the last 1-2 passes. Here you may be at the 6-8 section pass range but will find that even with FG400 on a closed cell cutting pad you effectively remove the defects while finishing out impeccably well for such a heavy polish.

If you decide to pick up the Cyan Hydrotech cutting pads, may I suggest grabbing the Tangerine polishing pads to use with SF4000? This will give you better performance over the white pad.
 
dlc95: Those dreams have already started LOL!

I think I'll pick-up a Hydro-tech Cyan pad today as I've read a few people having good success with that and FG400. Will also pick-up some Optimum Power Cleaner as well for interior cleaning.

Like SameGuy says, get more if you can, sir.
 
1. I have no concrete evidence that an open cell pad takes longer to break down DAT based polishes. But IME personally, I have achieved better results with Menzerna polishes on closed cell pads rather than open cell pads. With a closed cell pad, less product is needed and more of that product stays on the face of the pad rather than being absorbed into the foam.

Also, a flat faced closed cell pad ensures maximum performance from DAT based polishes as it forces and even 100% of the product to work at the same time. With an open face pad, bits of polish will be re distributed as centrifugal force dictates and thus introducing a continual fresh set of larger abrasives into a mixture of smaller abrasives that are in the process of being broken down.

Yes, I may be nit picking but I like to ensure that every component of my selection Machine, pad, polish etc) are all working in harmony to achieve their utmost performance.

2. Yes. With DAT based polishes you need a firm yet pliable pad with closed cell construction to ensure that the polishes is evenly broken down in an efficient manner without over saturation into the pad. This style pad selection for DAT polishes ensures maximum performance IME.

The KBM method with DAT polishes regardless of pad choice greatly hinders the ability of said polish to perform at maximum performance often with less than desirable results. Here you want to ensure that said DAT polish is taken from 100% in a fresh state to fully exhausted 0% and that no cross contamination i.e. mixture of fresh polish with partially broken down polish occurs. Hence the reason I feel that CCS pads are not a great pad for DAT polishes.

Now with a closed cell pad regardless of machine choice you want to be rather heavy handed at first to engage the abrasives to break them down and cut the paint. After 2-3 passes ease up and finally come to no downward pressure on the last 1-2 passes. Here you may be at the 6-8 section pass range but will find that even with FG400 on a closed cell cutting pad you effectively remove the defects while finishing out impeccably well for such a heavy polish.

If you decide to pick up the Cyan Hydrotech cutting pads, may I suggest grabbing the Tangerine polishing pads to use with SF4000? This will give you better performance over the white pad.

I love it! Great dialogue.

Absolutely, the tangerine makes a lot of sense to follow the cyan with.

I was also thinking 4500 with a grey flat, but maybe the red ht would be more appropriate. I probably wouldn't do all three, but make the call between the 4000, and 4500.

Again, thanks for the insight and feed back!
 
I was also thinking 4500 with a grey flat, but maybe the red ht would be more appropriate. I probably wouldn't do all three, but make the call between the 4000, and 4500.
4000 is all you need, without a doubt. 4500 is very oily and performs best on a rotary, IMO.

Red HT > LC Flat Black
 
4000 is all you need, without a doubt. 4500 is very oily and performs best on a rotary, IMO.

Red HT > LC Flat Black

You may have just saved me some cash there!

I'll keep some red ht pads on hand. I may find a situation where 4000 might work well with them.
 
I love it! Great dialogue.

Absolutely, the tangerine makes a lot of sense to follow the cyan with.

I was also thinking 4500 with a grey flat, but maybe the red ht would be more appropriate. I probably wouldn't do all three, but make the call between the 4000, and 4500.

Again, thanks for the insight and feed back!

For me SF4500 is reserved for pulling the maximum gloss from the panel. This of course after the panel has been pre polished with SF400.

SF4000 has enough pull behind to finish out whatever hazing FG400 may have left behind no matter how aggressive you may have had to get with the first step.

SF4000 is rated at a 4 for cut while SF4500 is rated for 2. Both are rated at 10 for finish however I think SF4500 should be rated as an 11 for finish.

SF4000 on a tangerine will give you all the power needed to remove any and all hazing if so left by FG400 while finishing out LSP ready. If you are craving the maximum amount of gloss try SF4500 on the crimson pad.
 
For me SF4500 is reserved for pulling the maximum gloss from the panel. This of course after the panel has been pre polished with SF400.

SF4000 has enough pull behind to finish out whatever hazing FG400 may have left behind no matter how aggressive you may have had to get with the first step.

SF4000 is rated at a 4 for cut while SF4500 is rated for 2. Both are rated at 10 for finish however I think SF4500 should be rated as an 11 for finish.

SF4000 on a tangerine will give you all the power needed to remove any and all hazing if so left by FG400 while finishing out LSP ready. If you are craving the maximum amount of gloss try SF4500 on the crimson pad.

Ah, ok. 4500 is the "cherry on top" so to speak.
 
Just wanted to chime back in on this. I got a Cyan Hydro-Tech pad today and so far this has been the best pad to date! Not sure if its the flatness or just the hydro-tech pad itself but this is what I expected out of FG400. Really the only thing that changed is I went to 5 section passes as well besides the pad. Thanks for all the insight!

 
Just wanted to chime back in on this. I got a Cyan Hydro-Tech pad today and so far this has been the best pad to date! Not sure if its the flatness or just the hydro-tech pad itself but this is what I expected out of FG400. Really the only thing that changed is I went to 5 section passes as well besides the pad. Thanks for all the insight!


How is your pad holding up?
 
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