FLEX 3401 "power" question...

W

WRAPT C5Z06

New member
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Messages
12,615
Reaction score
0
What gives the Flex the ability to remove worse defects and faster compared to the other "new" DA polishers? Obviously the power is more, is that the only thing? Lets say I used a a Griots ROP on speed 5 to remove defects and it wasn't doing the job. What speed would I start with on the Flex?
 
07 z-oh-6 said:
What gives the Flex the ability to remove worse defects and faster compared to the other "new" DA polishers? Obviously the power is more, is that the only thing? Lets say I used a a Griots ROP on speed 5 to remove defects and it wasn't doing the job. What speed would I start with on the Flex?
Click to expand...
I agree with what Mike said, but if you can't remove defects with the new Griot then your doing something wrong or not having the right combination of polish and pad. The problem with the older generation of da/ro is that if you applied too much pressure the machine would stop rotating and there by taking a longer time to correct the defect. With the 2nd generation da/ro you would be hard pressed to stop it from rotating. Until the new polishers came out recently, the Flex da ruled...not anymore. With Meg's 105/205 KBM...you can correct almost any defect that is not too deep.
 
Rsurfer said:
I agree with what Mike said, but if you can't remove defects with the new Griot then your doing something wrong or not having the right combination of polish and pad. The problem with the older generation of da/ro is that if you applied too much pressure the machine would stop rotating and there by taking a longer time to correct the defect. With the 2nd generation da/ro you would be hard pressed to stop it from rotating. Until the new polishers came out recently, the Flex da ruled...not anymore. With Meg's 105/205 KBM...you can correct almost any defect that is not too deep.
Click to expand...
So you're saying the new Griot's ROP can remove the same type of defects and as fast as the Flex? Hmmm, the Flex must be severely overpriced then.
 
You are not considering a crucial variable...time. The Flex will save a considerable amount of time over the other two machines mentioned even if comparable results are reached. More product will be needed with more passed required of the other two as well. The Flex also have sensors to prevent it from overheating and a higher OPM. OPM+RPM=$$$ in less time.
 
C30-Mike said:
PC and Griots are ramdon orbital. It is possible to stop the machine if enought pressure is applied.
Click to expand...

Rsurfer said:
The problem with the older generation of da/ro is that if you applied too much pressure the machine would stop rotating and there by taking a longer time to correct the defect.
Click to expand...


All 3 of the new generation dual action polishers have much better ability to keep a pad rotating and it's when the pad is rotating over the surface that paint is removed best and removing swirls and scratches means removing a little paint.

With the first generation dual action polishers, the pad would stop rotating if you applied too much pressure but just as important if the pad became wet or saturated with product or if you held the buffer in such a way that the pad was not flat against the surface or if the face of the pad was on a high point so that thee was more pressure on one portion of the pad and less pressure on the surrounding areas of the pad.

The Flex is a hybrid polisher in that it oscillates like a Porter Cable 7424XP but it's forced, that is there is no slippage like there can be with a Porter Cable or Griot's or Meguiar's polisher. This means no matter what, the pad is going to rotate and oscillate on the surface and this equates to more power to remove paint.


:)
 
Rsurfer said:
but if you can't remove defects with the new Griot then your doing something wrong or not having the right combination of polish and pad.
Click to expand...

I strongly agree. From experience with all 3 new dual action polishers, you can't apply enough pressure to stop the pad from rotating when buffing on a flat panel, while holding the pad flat to the panel and when using a dry pad. Not dry as in no product on the surface, dry in that it's not saturated with product.

If you hold any of the DA Polishers on an edge you can slow down and stop the pad from rotating but not as easily as the first generation polishers. At the Dallas, Texas class at Nick's shop I purposefully held the Griot's on edge to see if the pad would rotate under pressure and it did and the reason I did this wax because the car we were working on had a long, thin, grooved panel and everyone wanted to know how to remove the swirls in that cupped out area and I showed them using the GG ROP. First generation polishers would never do this.

:)
 
If I'm understanding this correctly, the new generation griot's(and other new DA's) has really closed the gap as far as defect removal compared to the Flex? If used the same way, the Griot's will remove as much paint as the Flex? It seems as though if I already have the griot's, there's really no advantage of buying the flex? If the Flex will make it easier AND faster(compared to Griot's) to remove defects on hard paint of the Vette, I'm buying it, period!:buffing:
 
Last edited:
07 z-oh-6 said:
If I'm understanding this correctly, the new generation griot's(and other new DA's) has really closed the gap as far as defect removal compared to the Flex? If used the same way, the Griot's will remove as much paint as the Flex? It seems as though if I already have the griot's, there's really no advantage of buying the flex? If the Flex will make it easier AND faster(compared to Griot's) to remove defects on hard paint of the Vette, I'm buying it, period!:buffing:
Click to expand...
You should then buy it.
 
integritydetail said:
You are not considering a crucial variable...time. The Flex will save a considerable amount of time over the other two machines mentioned even if comparable results are reached. More product will be needed with more passed required of the other two as well. The Flex also have sensors to prevent it from overheating and a higher OPM. OPM+RPM=$$$ in less time.
Click to expand...
True you might be saving a little time, but then your stuck with the 6" pads, unless you use an edge system. Now you need a da for the smaller areas like pillars, around bumpers, and any tight areas. Of course you can do it by hand and now you just lost all the time you saved in the first place.
 
I do have the adapter and edge system. I also, have a PC7424, a PC7428 and a Cyclo...edge adapters on all of them. Makes life very simple not having to buy, store and maintain 3 different backing plates for the D/A and 3 more for the different threads on the Rotary. It was more cost effective for me too. I have found several people to buy from on the forums and got all my Edge pads for less than $10 each. I really liked the LC pads when I used them, but dual sides, no BP changes, and the fact that they work on all my machines is awesome. The adapter for the Flex was worth every penny and I will guarantee that I can change from 6 to 4 inch faster than changing backing plates. I do think the PC is fantastic for the money, but it only compares to the Griot's and the other non-forced rotation machines. The time the Flex saves me is more than slight, but admittedly the weekend warrior probably won't need it. For a pro, time is money.
 
integritydetail said:
I do have the adapter and edge system. I also, have a PC7424, a PC7428 and a Cyclo...edge adapters on all of them. Makes life very simple not having to buy, store and maintain 3 different backing plates for the D/A and 3 more for the different threads on the Rotary. It was more cost effective for me too. I have found several people to buy from on the forums and got all my Edge pads for less than $10 each. I really liked the LC pads when I used them, but dual sides, no BP changes, and the fact that they work on all my machines is awesome. The adapter for the Flex was worth every penny and I will guarantee that I can change from 6 to 4 inch faster than changing backing plates. I do think the PC is fantastic for the money, but it only compares to the Griot's and the other non-forced rotation machines. The time the Flex saves me is more than slight, but admittedly the weekend warrior probably won't need it. For a pro, time is money.
Click to expand...
Seems like you got it down to a tee. As for me I don't care for the edge pads. There are so many better pads that give better results than the edge pads. JMO. If time is money than you can't beat a rotary for speed and finish. Granted there are some paints that I cannot finish down with a rotary and must use a DA, but that's very few.:buffing:
 
integritydetail said:
I do have the adapter and edge system. I also, have a PC7424, a PC7428 and a Cyclo...edge adapters on all of them. Makes life very simple not having to buy, store and maintain 3 different backing plates for the D/A and 3 more for the different threads on the Rotary. It was more cost effective for me too. I have found several people to buy from on the forums and got all my Edge pads for less than $10 each. I really liked the LC pads when I used them, but dual sides, no BP changes, and the fact that they work on all my machines is awesome. The adapter for the Flex was worth every penny and I will guarantee that I can change from 6 to 4 inch faster than changing backing plates. I do think the PC is fantastic for the money, but it only compares to the Griot's and the other non-forced rotation machines. The time the Flex saves me is more than slight, but admittedly the weekend warrior probably won't need it. For a pro, time is money.
Click to expand...


I'm like you about the edge system .It is just so easy . I do also have the full complement of pads and various backing plates. But for ease of use the edge pads just win out. I feel I get just as good of results with them as I do with the others . Also them being dual sided I don't have to carry as many .
 
rwisejr said:
I'm like you about the edge system .It is just so easy . I do also have the full complement of pads and various backing plates. But for ease of use the edge pads just win out. I feel I get just as good of results with them as I do with the others . Also them being dual sided I don't have to carry as many .
Click to expand...
:iagree:

I too LOVE the Edge system. Sadly when I bought my Flex there was no Edge adapter. So, I traded out all my Edge stuff for LC pads. The cost would be great at this point to switch back especially since the Edge Flex adapter is so expensive.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top