Glaze? Sealant? good combo?

[PiPUK]

There is nothing 'durable' listed in that product but it is hard to know what 'conditioners' refer to. That could easily be a polymer blend of some kind.

You would have to do a 50:50 test. Do half a bonnet with the glaze in there, half without (i.e. with a wax/LSP over the top). My suspicion is that, in the case of most glazes, the glaze added section will look great when applied, but give it a couple of weeks and you won't be able to see any difference between the two halves.

 

[JAMM0N]

yeah i'd hate to just put glaze on my car and have it look nice but not be able to seal it in. i guess i can do portion on my roof since no one really stares at the roof of my car and log results. glaze just itself and glaze with sealant.

 

[Zubair]

There was a nice thread by a fellow forum user where he tested PL alone and PL over BH and the sealant wasnt affected much if any. I have 845 over PB WD and PL over WD glaze on two cars for 6 months now and both cars beading still.

Edited to add, think the guy who tested is called swanicyouth

 

[PiPUK]

The concern is the lifetime of the glaze, not that of the sealant. Short of a coating, most sealants will not suffer from the presence of a bit of filler/glaze. The question is whether there is any point sealing over a glaze, in order to prolong the life of the glaze. I strongly suspect that there is none at all.

 

[Zubair]

Aah okay, glazes dont last on their own and if they don't last under a wax or sealant either I will certainly not be buying any ever again, now am more curious than ever.

 

[PiPUK]

Aah okay, glazes dont last on their own and if they don't last under a wax or sealant either I will certainly not be buying any ever again, now am more curious than ever.

This is a marketing job, of course. The reality is that most people who are into detailing sufficiently to know about glazes are also the sort of people who will have a pretty good paint finish. As such, they are not needing it there to do a whole lot of filling, the glazes are just giving gloss and colour depth. The problem is that it is damned near impossible, without a comparison, to actually see when that gloss/colour diminished. Short of applying some more to an area, most eyes will have no chance of discerning just how much glaze is left elsewhere on the vehicle.

 

[Desertnate]

There was a nice thread by a fellow forum user where he tested PL alone and PL over BH and the sealant wasnt affected much if any. I have 845 over PB WD and PL over WD glaze on two cars for 6 months now and both cars beading still.

Edited to add, think the guy who tested is called swanicyouth

I got 6 months out of 845 over Black Hole, which is probably a very similar product to White Diamond, last winter.

Right now, I'm running 845 over Amigo, and it is holding up really well after two months. I don't see how it would not last as well as my test of BH last winter.

 

[Zubair]

Yeah the 845 is still there but is the BH or Amigo still there after a few days ir a wash? Or has it dissolved even being under an lsp?

 

[allenk4]

Aah okay, glazes dont last on their own and if they don't last under a wax or sealant either I will certainly not be buying any ever again, now am more curious than ever.

Are the glaze and sealant miscible or is the sealant forming a separate layer on top of the glaze?

 

[runrun411]

Are the glaze and sealant miscible or is the sealant forming a separate layer on top of the glaze?

IMHO it's one or the other, not both. Here's why.

When you put a sealant on top of a glaze, the sealant can't bond to the surface because of the oils in glazes. The surface to be sealed should be prepped the way you would prep a surface for a coating. That way the sealant can adhere to the surface and thus give you expected durability.

When you put a glaze on top of a sealant, remember, glazes (majority of them anyway) have a slight abrasive along with those oils and would therefore abrade the protective sealant.

I've read on this forum that some people think glazes are a waste of time. But if your showing off your ride at a car show or just hanging out under some bright lights on a Saturday night, then you may want to go for that extra pop you get from a glaze. If you need durability and don't want to have to protect every week or so, than go for a good sealant. 845, DGPS, Menz, Reload are great sealants just to name a few. If you properly prepare the surface and use a good sealant the question will then be: "how the heck do I get this stuff off my car".

Just my .02

 

[Desertnate]

Yeah the 845 is still there but is the BH or Amigo still there after a few days ir a wash? Or has it dissolved even being under an lsp?

There is no real way to scientifically measure it, but I'd say the glazes were still holding up for at least four of those six months. After six months of salt, rain, dirt, ice, snow, ext, I wasn't too surprised they were gone. The wax was barely holding on.

 

[dlc95]

Will certain sealants approximate the result of a glaze? Both filling surface imperfections as well as sealing the paint?

I ask because some sealants available state that they can "eliminate" fine swirls, and "lock in the shine".

 

[Zubair]

Carnaubas generally have a filling effect which mask imperfections whereas sealants seem to highlight defects from my own experience and ocd- critically analyse my finish from all angles and under different light after I lsp.

 

[allenk4]

IMHO it's one or the other, not both. Here's why.

When you put a sealant on top of a glaze, the sealant can't bond to the surface because of the oils in glazes. The surface to be sealed should be prepped the way you would prep a surface for a coating. That way the sealant can adhere to the surface and thus give you expected durability.

When you put a glaze on top of a sealant, remember, glazes (majority of them anyway) have a slight abrasive along with those oils and would therefore abrade the protective sealant.


Just my .02

Since the term "glaze" is ill defined, it seems that their characteristics and applications are all over the board. This is an excerpt from an article by Todd Cooperider over at DI:


"Chemical Guys EZ Creme Glaze. If you read the label, you’d think of this as a normal “glaze”. But a large percentage of the detailing world uses this product as a paint prep after polishing and before the application of a wax or sealant. It does a great job of cleaning any polishing oils or residue, and provides a great base."

 

[FUNX650]

IMHO it's one or the other, not both. Here's why.

When you put a sealant on top of a glaze, the sealant can't bond to the surface because of the oils in glazes. The surface to be sealed should be prepped the way you would prep a surface for a coating. That way the sealant can adhere to the surface and thus give you expected durability.

IMHO:
Not really.
Not unless the Sealant's application directions specifically calls for the paint to be "prepped as if for a Coating".

I've read on this forum that some people think glazes are a waste of time.

When you put a glaze on top of a sealant, remember, glazes (majority of them anyway) have a slight abrasive along with those oils and would therefore abrade the protective sealant.

When a vehicle's CC reaches a point where further "correction-type/abrading" is not recommended...That becomes at least one pretty good reason to use Glazes.


Bob

 

[runrun411]

IMHO:
Not really.
Not unless the Sealant's application directions specifically calls for the paint to be "prepped as if for a Coating".


When a vehicle's CC reaches a point where further "correction-type/abrading" is not recommended...That becomes at least one pretty good reason to use Glazes.


Bob

Good point Bob, taught me something. What kind of durability do the sealant glazes have?

 

[FUNX650]

What kind of durability do the sealant glazes have?

Off the top of my head...
Klasse HGSG is one LSP that has "glaze" on its label.

And...as you can guess:
There are way too many durability-variables to postulate a definitive time period.


Bob

 

[JAMM0N]

id run correction through the car at least all the way around. 4 passes light cut/heavy polish then glaze... which i believe will be fine. glaze and wax.

i was reccommended that some glazes should be applied w wax more than sealant but i am guessing the glaze wont last really long. ill end up washing it polish and seal it when it starts to fade

 

[Desertnate]

IMHO:
Not really.
Not unless the Sealant's application directions specifically calls for the paint to be "prepped as if for a Coating".


When a vehicle's CC reaches a point where further "correction-type/abrading" is not recommended...That becomes at least one pretty good reason to use Glazes.


Bob

In addition to those factors there are some glazes specifically designed to be used in a system with sealants, i.e. Prima Amigo and Poorboys Black Hole, so there will be no issues topping them with a sealant.

Off the top of my head...
Klasse HGSG is one LSP that has "glaze" on its label.

And...as you can guess:
There are way too many durability-variables to postulate a definitive time period.


Bob

I've used HG for a long time, and I've never observed any filling properties. I'd be willing to say the whole "glaze" term in the product title is just marketing. In fact, my experience has shown it to enhance flaws rather than hiding them due to the glass-like shine the product creates. It highlights everthing...good, bad, or ugly.

My experience with a glaze under one coat of 845 last winter showed I could go 6-months on a daily driver which only sees a garage at night.

 

[PiPUK]

In addition to those factors there are some glazes specifically designed to be used in a system with sealants, i.e. Prima Amigo and Poorboys Black Hole, so there will be no issues topping them with a sealant.

I would beware of how much you let yourself be marketed to. There isn't really much you can do to make these products work together. At best I would suggest that they have been developed or tested side by side and shown to work OK. The implication of an actual synergy is almost certainly something from the marketing department, not the science guys.