Hard water spots, buffer & chemicals - help needed.

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KawBoy

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Hello Everyone,

My '09 Black Sapphire BMW shows hard water spots everywhere. I have tried clay, Wolfgang Paintwork Polish Enhancer, some Meguiars products and others, you name it, with no success (all applied by hand). A friend told me that I should get a Dual Action buffer and I am OK with that, even though I am not really comfortable in using one due to the lack of experience. But I can learn.

I have heard about the Porter Cable and just recently learned about Griots. I understand this is more like a personal opinion, but if you were going to buy one, which one would you get and with what accessories?

I really want to get rid of those hard water spots and try to put a protective coat of something that will minimize the reoccurrence. Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant 3.0 didn’t help much. I'd appreciate if guys could steer me on the right direction as I am lost.

Brgds.
 
I personally own and have only used the PC7424 and LOVE it. I hear great things about Griots and will most likely get one just to feed my obsession.

If you have tried proper washing, claying, and a variety of products by hand your next step is to try and buff them out. I just buffed out some water spots on my friends 2006 GTI on the hood. I had to go over it twice with some Meguiars Ultimate Compound and an orange pad but now they are completely gone.

With the Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant did you let it haze for a good 45 minutes? Make sure you apply it in a thin even amount and then let it haze for 45 minutes then buff out with a quality microfiber. Also, after it is buffed out let it cure for 12 hours in a garage. The WG isn't suppose to get wet in those 12 hours or it will throw off the process. Then if you can top it with a quality carnauba wax. (Pinnacle SSII, Pinnacle Souveran, Fuzion, Nattys Blue/Red)

I literally just got done applying WG Deep Gloss to my entire car today after only doing the hood yesterday before it rained. Very quality product.

I hope you can get those water spots out I know how much of a pain they are! Give it a shot with a buffer i'm sure you won't be disappointed!
 
fancy,

I guess I will go with the Griots, because of the lifetime warrantee. I will probably also get the 3" one, for the small areas. What do you think?

I did let the WG haze for like 45 to 60 minutes. But I admit that I did that just once, the first time. Will have to remind myself in doing so next time.

Should I try again the WG Polish Enhancer by machine or would you recommend something stronger? Thank you. Brgds.

jpegs,

Thank you for the link. I am sure I will find a lot of useful info there.
 
I've never used the WG Polish Enhancer but i'm assuming by hand would be sufficient. Remember that the WG Deep Gloss is a sealant so it should last a good 3 months on the low end as long as it is topped with a quality wax.

Also, I wish I had the 3" griots for those hard to reach areas. I hear the Griots has more power and the lifetime warranty is a huge bonus! So yeah, good call on getting both if it's in your budget. Remember to get a good amount of pads to work with. I just burnt through an orange pad today and it was the only pad I brought with so that sucked.
 
Eric,
Most definitely the WG Polish Enhancer applied by hand didn't do the job. I guess I will give it a try with the buffer. You mentioned topping the WG Deep Gloss with a wax. If I do that, do I have to always do the 3 step process, polish, seal and wax? Or just seal and wax would suffice?
Since I have no knowledge whatsoever on pads, which ones should I get?
Again, thank you for all your help.
Brgds.
 
If you do a 3 step process of polish, seal, and wax.. you will only need to wash and then use a quick detailer until the wax wears off. Depending on which wax you get and weather condition this could be anywhere from 2 weeks to 2 months. Sealants last typically 3 months unless for a daily driver. Sealants like Klasse last anywhere from 6 months to a year.

If you can see swirls, its time to do the 3 step process again. With proper washing technique after a 3-step process you should only have to worry about sealing and waxing for a long time.

As for pads I recommend just simply browsing the store and choosing what's in your budget. I currently am using Lake Country pads and find them to be fairly good. Make sure to get some orange and white pads for your cutting. Then you can simply pick and choose if you want finishing and jeweling pads.
 
Thank you. I really appreciated your help.
Brgds.
 
I just got my PC7424XP with a bunch of 5.5" LC flat pads and the Megs 105/205 combo. I'm a big fan. It took my truck from a swirly mess with lots of RIDS to clear paint that the metallic shimmers in the sun.

With no experience on a buffer, I was able to remove 95% of ALL defects from my paint, including making a key mark that went half way down the bed almost go away (You really have to look for it to see it now).

I can see how people talk about liking the extra power with the GG machine because on a few spots (hood and roof) the PC was kinda iffy about keeping the pads spinning, but I'm sure that had some to do with the non-perfect technique.

I'm not sure you want to just go with the 3". I would recommend that you go with either the 5.5 pads on the PC or the GG machines. Just doing spot touchups here and there on a car that hasn't seen a machine might end up looking 'splotchy'.
 
The mineral deposits (hard water spots) should be removed chemically and not with an abrasive. The minerals in the hard water spots are very hard, in fact as hard as if not harder than most abrasives found in abrasive polishes. The Wolfgang Paintwork Polish Enhancer is a oil in water emulsion paint moisturizer. You would want to use a chemical paint cleaner type of polish such as Pro Polish from Poorboy's World. PB Pro Polish will disolve the minerals when used with a dual action polisher. It is much more effective at removing mineral deposits than even something as abrasive as Meg's 105.

I find that the best way to remove mineral deposits with Pro Polish is to work in a 2 foot square section. Prime your pad with the Pro Polish and then rub the pad around on the 2 foot section to apply a thin layer of the polish over the hard water spots. If you allow the polish to dwell on the paint for a few minutes it make things a bit easier. After a few minutes dwell time, place your pad on the section and turn on the machine and run a few section passes.

If they are in fact deposits and not etchings this will work nicely and will be easy on the paint too.
 
Pray they have not turned into etchings! I have water spot etchings all over my paint and windows (even tried glass science glass scrub). I have tried M105 w/ orange and then a yellow pad. A vinegar bath, IPA wipe downs, Mineral spirit wipe downs , and I can not get rid of all the etching. I am going to try a different pad that Matt recommended, if that does not work, I don't know what I am going to do. I had a friend with a paint thickness magnet say I have only have 5 mils of paint, so a wet sand is not going to happen.
 
tuscarora dave said:
The mineral deposits (hard water spots) should be removed chemically and not with an abrasive. The minerals in the hard water spots are very hard, in fact as hard as if not harder than most abrasives found in abrasive polishes. The Wolfgang Paintwork Polish Enhancer is a oil in water emulsion paint moisturizer. You would want to use a chemical paint cleaner type of polish such as Pro Polish from Poorboy's World. PB Pro Polish will disolve the minerals when used with a dual action polisher. It is much more effective at removing mineral deposits than even something as abrasive as Meg's 105.

I find that the best way to remove mineral deposits with Pro Polish is to work in a 2 foot square section. Prime your pad with the Pro Polish and then rub the pad around on the 2 foot section to apply a thin layer of the polish over the hard water spots. If you allow the polish to dwell on the paint for a few minutes it make things a bit easier. After a few minutes dwell time, place your pad on the section and turn on the machine and run a few section passes.

If they are in fact deposits and not etchings this will work nicely and will be easy on the paint too.
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I dont think they are deposits as I have tried a lot of different things to remove them. I am almost positive they are etchings. Should I still try the PB Pro Polish or would you recommend something more abrasive? I'd rather start with something not too agressive as I have no experience with a buffer. Thank you.

Brgds.
 
Locutus said:
Pray they have not turned into etchings! I have water spot etchings all over my paint and windows (even tried glass science glass scrub). I have tried M105 w/ orange and then a yellow pad. A vinegar bath, IPA wipe downs, Mineral spirit wipe downs , and I can not get rid of all the etching. I am going to try a different pad that Matt recommended, if that does not work, I don't know what I am going to do. I had a friend with a paint thickness magnet say I have only have 5 mils of paint, so a wet sand is not going to happen.
Click to expand...

Too late for a prayer now. I have done pretty much everything you did and nothing. Even on the glass. Please let me know the results you get when the new pad. Thank you.
Brgds.
 
markm said:
Surebuf pad or wool pad........da or rotary
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I didn't even know there were things like that; please excuse my ignorance. This Surbuf seems interesting. I should probably try the Surbuf and PB Polish. I am yet to finish my "shopping cart"; so many new and different things. I thank you for your help.
Brgds.
 
Either a machine or a LOT of elbow grease is necessary to remove either type of water spot when they are bad. I recommend using a machine. tuscarora dave has the deposit side covered and etchings should come out with more polishing. If your working by hand, expect to work each section for a long, long time. You cannot just wipe-on wipe-off a polish and get great results. Even by machine, bad spots might need a good amount of time, if you haven't got the spots out, your not trying hard enough... Just be careful and persistent. :dblthumb2:
 
Locutus said:
Pray they have not turned into etchings! I have water spot etchings all over my paint and windows (even tried glass science glass scrub). I have tried M105 w/ orange and then a yellow pad. A vinegar bath, IPA wipe downs, Mineral spirit wipe downs , and I can not get rid of all the etching. I am going to try a different pad that Matt recommended, if that does not work, I don't know what I am going to do. I had a friend with a paint thickness magnet say I have only have 5 mils of paint, so a wet sand is not going to happen.
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They will come out, just check out two of my show and shines that had water etchings/acid rain. One was a black Z06 and the other was an 05 black Mustang. It took time but they were removed.
 
KawBoy said:
Too late for a prayer now. I have done pretty much everything you did and nothing. Even on the glass. Please let me know the results you get when the new pad. Thank you.
Brgds.
Click to expand...

KAWBOY have you tried 0000 steel wool on the glass with a bit of diluted vinegar?
 
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