I'm baffled - still have swirls after hours of work

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Also, anytime you're using a tape-line don't buff directly on top of the tape line, just use the tape-line as a strong demarcation line to quickly and easily show you before and after results.

See this article...

The LINE ---> How to avoid the line!

 

[Bill220]

Ok guys, here are the pictures.

Left side of trunk lid (untouched)

Right side of trunk lid (polished as previously noted)

What temp is your garage? If its below 40° or extra dry you may need an extra squirt of detail spray to keep it lubricated if its skipping. As stated above it sounds like you need to get more aggressive.

It's 60 degrees in my garage. My garage is heated/cooled but it was 9 degrees outside last night so it's a bit cooler in there than it usually is.

Not sure why you have M205 on speed 4....I usually run it at 5, then 5 1/2 for the last passes, then lighten up the pressure on the last pass.

A local guy that I buy some of my supplies from suggested this to me.

IMO take 205 and start moving up the aggressive scale with your pads and see what happens. Once you have reached the most aggressive pad with 205 and no luck then might want to try going back 105 with least aggressive pad and work your way up the aggressive scale.

I'll give this a try. If the 205 doesn't end up working out, I was thinking of buying some Ultimate Compound and trying that. I'm afraid of the 105 now.

The process you described (Blk LC pad with 205 on speed 4) is the step you would do after corrections. You do this to refine the paint.

For moderate correction, you need to be at 5 or 6 with a cutting pad (possibly with M105) and firm pressure.

For Heavy correction, shrink your work area even more and proceed with the above.

What you are experiencing... is the "Art" of the detailing process. You probably realized by now that there is more to this then just picking up a few polishes and a buffer. There is no such thing as "One Method" that works with every car. There will be trails and errors and that's the importance of a test spot....to establish a method for the vehicle that you are working on.

Have patience. It will work for you.

Good Luck.

Funny you should say that because that's what I thought! I figured that I could do some reading, select a pad, polish and get to it.

I used half of my trunk lid for a test area. The other side of it I left untouched for comparison (see above pics).

Try m205 on white or orange. If that doesn't work, move up to m105

That's my next step.

Haven't read the whole thread so I don't know if this was asked already. Are they all over or localized to that area,the trunk? And if they're all over please post some pics of other problem areas.

They are all over the car. I'm thinking that it was from me using cheap MF towels from the time I had it resprayed until now.

+1 on the more pictures...

But as I have stated before, as far as it was possible to tell from the first pictures, which were kind of small, it wasn't haze from compound but scratches from something.... maybe you weren't working exactly clean on the first time and ended up putting some little deep scratches... and if that's the case (which seems to be by now), you should need to go the aggressive route as others have stated...

Just make sure, if you do need to get to m105 to correct it, work on very small areas.... make sure you put some pressure, but not a lot on speed 6... and if it doesn't do the job, increase pressure and reduce arm speed still on speed 6.

After you successfully remove these scratches, move to 205 2 to 4 medium high pressure (speed 6), followed by 2 moderated pressure (speed 5) and 2 light pressure (speed 4)

Could be. I think it was swirled before I started polishing but I definitely made it worse.

 

[Bill220]

Kind of busy doing the rest of the setup for this weekend's classes but from this pictures this looks like an easy fix.

First read this,

DA Polisher Trouble Shooting Guide


How to troubleshoot a problem
Find a section where you see the defects and place a tape-line across it so the defects are on both sides of the tape line.

Next buff on just one side using good technique with your compound and polish like you're doing a Test Spot.


How To Do a Test Spot
(and why it's so important)


Carefully wipe off the residue from your last machine polishing step using a clean, dry microfiber towel folded for ways like shown here,

How to correctly fold and use a Microfiber Towel


Then inspect and tell us what you see.

Also, anytime you're using a tape-line don't buff directly on top of the tape line, just use the tape-line as a strong demarcation line to quickly and easily show you before and after results.

See this article...

The LINE ---> How to avoid the line!

Thanks, Mike!

 

[Meticulous-Detail]

Something to keep in mind while you strive for perfection.
See this thread.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...illips/54462-there-such-thing-perfection.html

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

I think you're dealing with very soft paint. It just a matter of using the right technique, pad, and product. It's not easy when dealing with paint like this, but you'll figure it out. :dblthumb2:

If I were you, I'd stay away from M105 FOR NOW. Pick up some ultimate compound or D300.

 

[Bill220]

Something to keep in mind while you strive for perfection.
See this thread.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...illips/54462-there-such-thing-perfection.html

Do you think I'm being too picky? Do you think that the paint in the second pictures is good enough? My fluorescent garage lights hide every flaw and I'm just getting used to using the Brinkmann. I live in Southwestern PA and we get sun like 3 days a year so I can't really pull it outside regularly to check on my progress. I drive the car regularly in the summer (no rain) so I know that it's not going to stay perfect but I want it to look its best, within reason.

I think you're dealing with very soft paint. It just a matter of using the right technique, pad, and product. It's not easy when dealing with paint like this, but you'll figure it out. :dblthumb2:

If I were you, I'd stay away from M105 FOR NOW. Pick up some ultimate compound or D300.

I'm not going to go near M105. If need be I can pick up Ultimate Compound from a local parts store. My next car will not be a dark color. :doh:

 

[Wheelzntoys]

Your photo shows like it is better, definitely go for white pad and M205 and post back.

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

Your photo shows like it is better

I agree!

 

[RLucky82]

Do you think I'm being too picky? Do you think that the paint in the second pictures is good enough? My fluorescent garage lights hide every flaw and I'm just getting used to using the Brinkmann. I live in Southwestern PA and we get sun like 3 days a year so I can't really pull it outside regularly to check on my progress. I drive the car regularly in the summer (no rain) so I know that it's not going to stay perfect but I want it to look its best, within reason.



I'm not going to go near M105. If need be I can pick up Ultimate Compound from a local parts store. My next car will not be a dark color. :doh:

No your not being too picky! but something is a miss. and I agree those are swirl marks and don't warrant using m105. start looking at things like how are you washing your mf towels? and pads. I only use liquid laundry detergent and as little as possible. Now I think I read somewhere that you used new mf towels? if so then these are happening before the towels.

 

[Meticulous-Detail]

Do you think I'm being too picky? Do you think that the paint in the second pictures is good enough? My fluorescent garage lights hide every flaw and I'm just getting used to using the Brinkmann. I live in Southwestern PA and we get sun like 3 days a year so I can't really pull it outside regularly to check on my progress. I drive the car regularly in the summer (no rain) so I know that it's not going to stay perfect but I want it to look its best, within reason.

No, but being that you are dealing with a repaint and don't have a gauge, just be careful. Sometimes in the pursuit of perfection you can cause an imperfection, like burning the paint. I am saying this because I am a perfectionist and sometimes can't leave good enough alone and end up making it worse.

It does look better, so I would continue with 205 and more agressive pads. If you can't get the paint exactly the way you want it and don't want to continue polishing then try a good glaze to fill in the imperfections.

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

I think 11% IPA is too strong. Try closer to 20%.

 

[DaC]

I think 11% IPA is too strong. Try closer to 20%.

20% is actually stronger than 11%..... :laughing:

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

20% is actually stronger than 11%..... :laughing:

:doh:

I was thinking more water %! After thinking about it, 11% is good!

 

[Bill220]

No your not being too picky! but something is a miss. and I agree those are swirl marks and don't warrant using m105. start looking at things like how are you washing your mf towels? and pads. I only use liquid laundry detergent and as little as possible. Now I think I read somewhere that you used new mf towels? if so then these are happening before the towels.

Yes, I was using cheap Sam's Club MF towels up until a few days ago.

No, but being that you are dealing with a repaint and don't have a gauge, just be careful. Sometimes in the pursuit of perfection you can cause an imperfection, like burning the paint. I am saying this because I am a perfectionist and sometimes can't leave good enough alone and end up making it worse.

It does look better, so I would continue with 205 and more agressive pads. If you can't get the paint exactly the way you want it and don't want to continue polishing then try a good glaze to fill in the imperfections.

Please don't think I was being a smart@ss with my previous reply. I wanted your honest opinion.

It does look better but it's not quite there yet. I'll try the white pads again tomorrow and see how it looks.

 

[Meticulous-Detail]

Yes, I was using cheap Sam's Club MF towels up until a few days ago.



Please don't think I was being a smart@ss with my previous reply. I wanted your honest opinion.

It does look better but it's not quite there yet. I'll try the white pads again tomorrow and see how it looks.

Thought didn't even cross my mind. Good luck tomorrow and post results.

 

[ride5150]

that looks like compounding residue to me. compound residue can often give the illusion of scratches in my experience. i understand that youre doing an ipa wipedown but unless you do it a few times (using a new clean surface of your microfiber towel everytime) you wont get all the residue off. try "lightly" going over the places where you think there is scratching and see if they "change". if they do, that means that the residue is just being moved around causing it to look different.

also, m105 is a PAIN IN THE @$$ to remove. it could very well be reside from the m105 compound. i have personally sprayed with IPA, optimum power clean, meguairs all-purpose cleaner, wiped in between each one of these applications, and STILL had m105 residue on the car. finally i "buffed" it off by using m205 on a brand new white pad, then another clean white pad. its important to understand (when detailing) that wiping a surface with a towel is just like rinsing with water, they both simply "decrease the concentration" of whatever youre trying to remove. thats why you need to wipe multiple times with a clean microfiber surface, to ensure your actually getting the chemical "off" and not just moving it around.

also, if it is marring, you may be pressing too hard on the microfiber while removing polish/compound residue. this would induce scratches.

i am willing to bet that it is stubborn m105 residue.

 

[Bill220]

Round 3:

I've been working on the car most of the day, splitting my time between using Dr. Color Chip on the front of the car and polishing the deck lid.

The Dr. Color Chip came out pretty good, not so sure about the deck lid. I can still catch swirls with the Brinkmann but once again, the paint looks like glass under my garage lights.

I tried M205 with the following combinations of pads followed by an IPA wipe down and a check with the Brinkmann light. About half way through I started using M34 because the IPA solution kept leaving smudges behind.

Below is what I did to one third of the trunk lid today. All with moderate pressure and I went really slow. With the black pad, the last couple of passes I made were with light pressure.

8 passes with white, speed 6 - swirls unchanged
6 passes with orange, speed 5 – swirls worse
8 passes with white, speed 6 – swirls diminished from the damage I caused with the orange pad caused but back to where I was when I started.
8 more passes with white, speed 6 – very slight improvement
8 more passes with white, speed 6 - a little better
8-10 passes with black, speed 6 – At this point, I can't tell if it's any better or not.

I then compared the test section with the rest of the panel. It was somewhat better so I proceeded to do the rest of the panel with a white, then black pad. I don't think I'm able to improve on it unless Ultimate Compound would possibly help. I couldn't get to the store today, as I didn't have another car available to make a run to the parts store.

Below are a bunch of pictures, you guys be the judges. They are in the order that I took them but I don't remember after which steps. The last picture is how the paint looks under my fluorescent lights.

At this point, should I just do the rest of the car with 205, a white pad, then black and apply Blacklight, Lava, V7 and be done with it? If possible, could I toss a glaze in there that would mask the remaining swirls?

 

[CM8 6MT]

Looks better than before. Use this as a learning experience, so next time youll guide yourself in the right direction.

 

[Meticulous-Detail]

From those pics I really can't see swirls. Paint looks pretty good to me. IMO I would do the rest of the car with the combo you thought worked the best. Hit it with a BL, Lava and V7.

Next time you decide to do a full correction on it in the future try a different compound like UC or M101.

 

[RLucky82]

Those last three are pretty impressive. Just one last thing to throw out there, don't know if this has been covered already, make sure you use slow speed on final wipe down with MF towels. If your using fast hand movements the mf towels won't pick up 100% of the residue. Again that's sloooow hand movements.