My FIRST bad interaction with customer

For all of you who say you will not wash a car without decontaminating it... what happens if you marr the paint? Personallly I am very weary of doing a clay job without a polishing job afterwards. Especially on black cars. Doing a wash and wax job plus claying for 80$? No thank you. It takes me 1.5 hour just to wash the car, add 30 mins to seal it using Reload. If I was to clay it on top of it, it would takes about 30 mins more if I do it quickly. So that doesn't fit in a 80$ job for me. And as I said, what happens if you marr the paint? You are looking at a few more hours to polish it out. Maybe you guys like to work for free but I certainly don't.

I think the important is communication. When you talk to the client and he asks for extra stuff, quote him for the time it will take. For those scuff marks, give him a quote for it. If he doesn't want you to do it, and you want to try taking them out quickly. Then do so. But if you tell him I will try, in his mind that is a yes and if you don't do it he will be disappointed. And I totally agree with you that you should not be doing freebies for things people want you to do to their car. On the other hand if you see something while doing the detail and it takes no time to fix, by all mean do it and tell them... those are the things people will appreciate.
 
It's important to remember that every market is different, especially in smaller communities. Pricing and bundled services have to meet the market demand to a certain extent. If there's little demand for paint decon in his area, making it a mandatory part of every package beyond a wash may not be good for business, even if it's part of the proper way to do the job. Waxing without decon is better than no wax - and fewer customers. Of course, if the paint is so contaminated that even hand waxing it could result in adding damage, that needs to be discussed with the customer.

FreshRides, maybe you can become the detailing evangelist for your area. Many people don't see the benefit of a three step process compared to using an AIO product; they just want a shiny car that beads water in the rain. They don't care about the benefits of decontamination because they don't know anything about it. If I were in this business, I'd find a big, flat hood at a salvage yard. Something with darker paint that's intact, but obviously in need of some help. Tape it off into three or four large sections. Leave one section as is, and run through your offered paint processes on the other sections - AIO wax only, decon + AIO wax, decon + 3step, coatings, etc. Walk customers through the processes so that they know the benefits and gain some understanding of what you can do for them. Tell them about the LSP lasting longer when applied to decontaminated paint, and let them do the baggie test on the different sections. That display will make it easy to show the differences, and it'll justify the higher prices for the more labor intensive processes.
 
Jeremy1976 said:
I refuse to do a detail job without claying the vehicle. A complete and full detail requires that. I don't offer wash and wax packages.

I keep it simple
Cars:$150
Small.and regular sized suv:$200
Trucks and large Suv:$250.

All my details include:
Pressure wash, foamed, 2 bucket wash, microfiber towel dried, full clay, paint sealed, then topped with wax. Windows clayed and sealed. Tires dressed, wheels sealed, door jambs clayed and sealed, interior vacuumed and wiped down with an APC, then dash door panels, and steerimg wheel dressed and conditioned.

Engine bay detailing is an extra $50.
leather cleaning and conditioning extra $50.

Paint correction price would be determined upon size of vehicle and paint condition.

To me a wash and wax is a half ass job. Not to insult anyone. Just my opinion. That is why I refuse to offer that.

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Don't think the clay/seal is overkill for the door jams for a detail like that? I'd think of doing that only for a car getting a full correction?? I usually just do a spray wax while I wipe down the door jams.


Just an honest opinion. It would save you 30min easy. For sadly something, no one would see the difference, unless they're an OCD nut like all of us here lol.
 
scuff said:
It's important to remember that every market is different, especially in smaller communities. Pricing and bundled services have to meet the market demand to a certain extent. If there's little demand for paint decon in his area, making it a mandatory part of every package beyond a wash may not be good for business, even if it's part of the proper way to do the job. Waxing without decon is better than no wax - and fewer customers. Of course, if the paint is so contaminated that even hand waxing it could result in adding damage, that needs to be discussed with the customer.

FreshRides, maybe you can become the detailing evangelist for your area. Many people don't see the benefit of a three step process compared to using an AIO product; they just want a shiny car that beads water in the rain. They don't care about the benefits of decontamination because they don't know anything about it. If I were in this business, I'd find a big, flat hood at a salvage yard. Something with darker paint that's intact, but obviously in need of some help. Tape it off into three or four large sections. Leave one section as is, and run through your offered paint processes on the other sections - AIO wax only, decon + AIO wax, decon + 3step, coatings, etc. Walk customers through the processes so that they know the benefits and gain some understanding of what you can do for them. That display will make it easy to show the differences, and it'll justify the higher prices for the more labor intensive processes.
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EXCELLENT idea!!!!
 
Jomax said:
Don't think the clay/seal is overkill for the door jams for a detail like that? I'd think of doing that only for a car getting a full correction?? I usually just do a spray wax while I wipe down the door jams.


Just an honest opinion. It would save you 30min easy. For sadly something, no one would see the difference, unless they're an OCD nut like all of us here lol.
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In Wisconsin here the cars get the iron deposits (orange spots) all over them especially in the door jams. I can't let a car leave my shop like that. Hand claying takes me 15 to 20 minutes to do so and then sealant applied with a MF applicator.

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IMO to run the vac through the interior takes only a couple minutes, and makes for a nice gesture. You should consider adding that to your normal process. I'd also allow customers to make 1 special request, such as removing some small scuffs like that. I wouldn't do much more than hitting it with some polish on a microfiber prior to the waxing, but it'd be enough to keep this guy happy. I'm not saying that you're wrong all, but sometimes you have to romance some customers more than others to make them feel special.
 
Since you were planning on doing it for 50.00 I think I would have removed the scuffs and charged him the 80.00. I assume we're talking hitting it with the polisher and being done in 2 or 3 minutes. Then when he picked up the car tell him the wash and wax was less so you were able to get the scuffs out and stay at the agreed price. That way he's happy, but he also knows you didn't do any work for free.
 
Years ago...someone told me...a happy customer tells 2 people...an unhappy one tells 200. If he brought three cars to you, find a way to make him happy, within reason. As another poster said...if the scuffs were from shoes...they come off easy.
 
Just like women, you let them take advantage of you, they will lose respect for you and never stop. Stand your ground.
 
I've been in the service business for well over 30 years so have run into many, many people like you describe. Most just want a little extra here and there to feel special, while others will push the envelope to see how many no cost extras they can get out of someone, especially a small business owner.

My suggestion is throw in a couple extras and factor it in the next estimate. If he is the type who pushes the envelope and makes what you do for a living unpleasant, just politely suggest he try someone else. After all you are the boss.

Believe me you have not dealt with over the top give it to me for free type until you work with the owners of Bars.
 
Jeremy1976 said:
I refuse to do a detail job without claying the vehicle. A complete and full detail requires that. I don't offer wash and wax packages.

I keep it simple
Cars:$150
Small.and regular sized suv:$200
Trucks and large Suv:$250.

All my details include:
Pressure wash, foamed, 2 bucket wash, microfiber towel dried, full clay, paint sealed, then topped with wax. Windows clayed and sealed. Tires dressed, wheels sealed, door jambs clayed and sealed, interior vacuumed and wiped down with an APC, then dash door panels, and steerimg wheel dressed and conditioned.

Engine bay detailing is an extra $50.
leather cleaning and conditioning extra $50.

Paint correction price would be determined upon size of vehicle and paint condition.

To me a wash and wax is a half ass job. Not to insult anyone. Just my opinion. That is why I refuse to offer that.

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I totally agree with you. I just wouldn't put a coat of wax or sealant on top of paint with contamination
Like you said thats a half ass job. The only time a may do it if i had already clayed and wax within 2 to 3 months.
 
I'm with some of you guys on here. I'm a part timer so I can be selective of my jobs and document most of my details on Facebook so people can see my work and the comments of the owners. I only do the whole car. Not can you detail my interior or I need a wax job. Not my style I tell them. I been doing a lot of 6 figure cars since December so they see what I'm capable of and I just flat out tell them it's all or nothing. I work in a car dealership , not as a detailer though and see what people try to get for free ans usually get away with because" we can't have a bad survey" I sat to hell with that. You do it my way or it's the highway. I don't need hassle so that's how I control it. Stay on offense and don't get into a defensive position. People try and say 'the customer is always right" They want half done but want it too look like it's the full monty when your done. My philosophy is when you get rid of the weeds the lawn will flourish.
 
The customer is always right, even when he is wrong. Take a few minutes and remove the scuff marks, write it off to good karma.
 
If it ever comes around to you from another person, just claim you smelled alcohol...
Jk
 
Old fellas and forty something year old women I fear the most. I end up doing a lot of free small things for them, but as long as it doesn't take too long, just to avoid bad mouthing. Talkative men, with old cheap trashed cars I fear them too.
Women like the interior more, men exterior. If he is rich, I use matte finish. If he is poor or have a lot of chrome, shiny finish.
I also try to figure it out my client, his personal preferences, if he is a wheel guy, or a glass guy, leather/interior guy etc.
I had a client once, rich guy with a brand new toyota sw4 who told me bluntly 'I don't give a f%&£ about the exterior, but I want immaculate glass'. Ok, two hours cleaning his windows and tons of mf towels, and a coated windshield for free.
Best regards
 
Nothing wrong in what you have done.. BUT... for some scuffs i would have whipped out the 3' pad on the rotary, run over it with an AIO and given it a quick buff.. ie no more than 15 mins..
Then i would have explained what i had done, and suggest that at some tim ein the future he woudl enjoy the result of a full decontamination, polish and a wax.. and that having done it it could look notably better for a year of two blah blah blah..
This assumes you have the spare 15mins and no next job to run on to right away..
Exceed their expectations and they'll bring the custom back with friends.. only meet their expectations and you get nothing back...
On balance with that is setting VERY clear expectations from the out set.... otherwise all hell breaks loose..

All the best.
 
Justin@FinalInspection said:
What I would do for your 80$ service is to include a courtesy vac. It doesn't have to be a super detailed vacuum but just a go over to get the main stuff. Like stated above little things that may take an extra 20min is something customers love.

Or maybe automatically include the clay bar process and vacuum and up your price a bit. Look into using a nanoskin pad on your DA polisher. It cuts the decontamination process in half.

My basic express detail on a car is 125$ and takes 2-3hrs max.

Exterior washed
Tires and wheels washed and dressed
Paint decontamination process with nanoskin pad and rinseless wash as a lubricant
Hydro2 for exterior protection
Jambs cleaned
Interior and exterior windows cleaned
Carpets vacuumed
Dash gets a quick wipe.
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I'm kind of in the same boat as Justin here. First off, I think 80 bucks is a perfectly reasonable price for a wash and wax.

It's tough because you said no to him on the Buick, which I agree with. The shoe scuffs though, if they are what I think they are would have taken you about a minute to remove with some cleaner wax on a microfiber and the guy would have been happy. That type of thing isn't a "full extra service" that you might offer like an interior detail.

I do my basic full detail starting at $150 for regular sized cars as such:

Rinse less wash
Optimum spray wax as I'm drying
Tires and wheels washed and dressed
Glass in and out
Exhaust tips hand polished
Interior vacuum
Dash and door panels / seats wiped down with the leftover ONR solution.
Jambs cleaned with Ultima waterless wash.

Takes me around 3 hours to do this on a reasonably well maintained car. I don't do any decontamination for fear of marring the paint (it's happened to me before and it wasnt worth it). It might be worth not offering separate interior and exterior service and just combining them into a "full detail." One thing I've learned is that the term full detail is really a misnomer. Most people want the car clean and shiny and this accomplishes that for them, doesn't take me too long, and is worth my time for the money made (I do this part time too).

People used to call me all the time asking how much for a full detail and I took this to mean a full 2-3 step correction with sealant and wax so I was quoting them like 800 bucks and for some reason they never booked. The ones who want that type of service know what they want and will usually ask for it and won't balk at the price because they know what's involved in it.
 
Jeremy1976 said:
I refuse to do a detail job without claying the vehicle. A complete and full detail requires that. I don't offer wash and wax packages.

I keep it simple
Cars:$150
Small.and regular sized suv:$200
Trucks and large Suv:$250.

All my details include:
Pressure wash, foamed, 2 bucket wash, microfiber towel dried, full clay, paint sealed, then topped with wax. Windows clayed and sealed. Tires dressed, wheels sealed, door jambs clayed and sealed, interior vacuumed and wiped down with an APC, then dash door panels, and steerimg wheel dressed and conditioned.

Engine bay detailing is an extra $50.
leather cleaning and conditioning extra $50.

Paint correction price would be determined upon size of vehicle and paint condition.

To me a wash and wax is a half ass job. Not to insult anyone. Just my opinion. That is why I refuse to offer that.

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Of course you're free to go about it how ever you want, but that's not business savvy in any way. How often do you think you should clay a car? If you think you have such a huge market available to you that it's ok to only see customers once or twice a year, with them paying someone else to maintain their car in between, then good on you. Is it good for business? Not at all. Even if you can convince them that you need to clay their car every month, you're basically lying to them and they may eventually figure that out and not return.

I haven't gone full time with my own business yet, but when I worked under my friend with his business, we had many repeat customers, some every two weeks. They didn't want to touch their car. They wanted to pay us to completely maintain the condition of their vehicle. One particular guy had a new Jag XKR and 7 series BMW. He also got us a lot of business from his neighbors. We're not going to run a clay bar all over a brand new XKR every two weeks.

Then throw in referrals to people who don't need or want to pay for that extensive of a detail, and you refuse to work a on a car for a referred customer? How is that going to look to the customer that referred you? Probably not going to refer you again.

You can say it's half-assed, but it's expanding a customer base. I would easily tell you that vacuuming and not using an extractor on the carpet and floor mats is half-assed. My buddy's mobile detailing business was consistently bringing in over $10-$13k a month in revenue with only one truck and two guys working. Some of the best profits came from "wash and wax" customers with weekly scheduled visits to businesses where we could do 6-10 cars at the same location before lunch.
 
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