spiralout462
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- Dec 14, 2012
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I would hate to stick that magnet on the hood of my truck! I wonder what the retail price of that thing is?
New Rupes LHR75E Mini in action at SEMA
- Thread starter Mike Phillips
- Start date
I would hate to stick that magnet on the hood of my truck! I wonder what the retail price of that thing is?
Love's Auto
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- Aug 14, 2013
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Hey Mike,
I know in the past you said the Rupes wasn't your go to polisher due to the bogging down, how is the Rupes 12 when faced with similar situations? Just wondering because I like my Rupes 15 but I'm always looking for the latest tools. Thank you.
I know in the past you said the Rupes wasn't your go to polisher due to the bogging down, how is the Rupes 12 when faced with similar situations? Just wondering because I like my Rupes 15 but I'm always looking for the latest tools. Thank you.
Could you post a link to where you believe Mike said this? I'd like to read the context of it.
All free-rotating DAs will slow or stop rotating with friction/pressure so that would be like saying all DAs except the Flex are inadequate as a go-to polisher, and I have a feeling there's more to the context of what he was saying than the way you've summarized it. Seeing the full discussion would help frame it.
Thanks.
Love's Auto
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- Aug 14, 2013
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It was on a Rupes review or somewhere and I assure it you was said, I just don't know where.
Mike Phillips
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- Dec 5, 2022
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- #47
I've personally never stated either the Rupes 15 or 21 were not my go-to dual action polishers due to them bogging down.
I appreciate RS99's asking for a link to anywhere I used the words bogging down in context with the Rupes polishers as the context will show my use of the words bogging down were in a reply to Art and the words bogging down were his words not mine. I simply repeated them as a reference to his post because he used them in his post.
In this article I wrote about removing sanding marks using the Rupes Bigfoot 21,
Removing #1500 Sanding Marks with Rupes Bigfoot 21 Polisher
The discussion about the Rupes polishers bogging down comes up when Art Hernandez brings it up in a discussion he had with Mike Stoops at Meguiar's.
in Post #11 of my thread on removing wetsanding marks with the Rupes Bigfoot 21 Polishers, here's Art's post followed by my post in context...
The technique I left it on the youtube channel. Lol
When I attempted this. Michael Stoops got out Meguiars MF polishing pad and M100.
I asked him why not use the MF cutting pad instead of the polishing pad?
He just looked at me, smiled and just said "just try it" so I did
And yep they were removed, i'd say just as easy or even easier then the Dewalt I was using that night. It did leave a haze however. But I used zero pressure.
I asked him about the Rupes bogging down. So he turned it on, put a ton of pressure and it kept spinning. So I am still not sure what everyone is talking about? :dunno:
But just polished the haze out with M205
I'm not sure if we were even supposed to be "technically" wet sanding and buffing lol. Since it was Thursday night.
A few AG members were there. I also want to take the advanced class. My Body shop skills came out pretty easily that night. My wet sanding, I had spattered compound everywhere haha :laughing:
Yet the Meguiar's guys were working just like me or maybe even more than me, and they were spotless clean, I looked like I had came out working at a body shop the whole day haha
It was a blast however
I want to see how the Rupes reacts to curved panels. I've only gotten the chance test it out on flat test panels.
Joe Fernandez from Superior Shine has a little thread on FB. "Ask Superior Shine" So I asked, the Rupes or Flex
Art
The technique I left it on the youtube channel. Lol
When I attempted this. Michael Stoops got out Meguiars MF polishing pad and M100.
I asked him why not use the MF cutting pad instead of the polishing pad?
He just looked at me, smiled and just said "just try it" so I did
And yep they were removed, i'd say just as easy or even easier then the Dewalt I was using that night. It did leave a haze however. But I used zero pressure.
Mike's a sharp guy and remember...
"You don't know what you can do until you try"
hernandez.art said:
The bogging down is when buffing out curved panels as you'll have only a small portion of the panel touching a small portion of the face of the pad and this can impede pad rotation.
The Thursday Night Open Garage classes were always fun and it's good to see they continue the tradition.
I make it a best practice to buff out entire cars, not just spots on a flat panel to really get the feel for a tool, pads, product or technique when possible.
The first time I used the Rupes polishers I chose a BIG car with lots of flat panels and LOTS of curved panels. Even made a time lapse video of the project and I think this was the FIRST time lapse video ever made showing a car being buffed out from beginning to end using the Rupes polishers.
Here's the link to the full write-up and a portion below...
Rupes Polisher Time Lapse Video - 1955 Ford Crown Victoria
Here's the time-lapse video Yancy took for me as I buffed this classic out from start to finish...
[video=youtube_share;v7FjGcMCTEg&hd=1"]RUPES 21ES Vs 15 ES time comparison Time lapse -...[/video]
On the passenger side I used the Rupes 21 and on the driver's side I used the Rupes 15. There was about a 20 minute time savings using the larger pad, larger stroke machine over the smaller pad, smaller stroke machine but my opinion is that for most body panel designs on modern cars the 6" pad will be a better match.
This tool definitely has a lot more correction ability plus power over a traditional DA Polisher like the Porter Cable 7424XP.
I did find that when buffing a curved panel, either concave or convex, the uneven pressure applied to the face of the pad will slow down and even stop pad rotation. The key is to focus on the panel and keep the pad as flat as possible to the surface.
And here's the complete and in-depth write up using the very cool 1955 Ford Crown Victoria...
Rupes side by side detail - 1955 Crown Victoria
Joe is not only incredibly nice he's also very knowledgeable and always conducts himself in a professional manner. His word is as good as gold. I count him as a very good friend.
Saw this discussion over the weekend and I'm happy to have chimed in to straighten out any confusion.
:xyxthumbs:
cardaddy
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- Nov 20, 2012
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Mike, I did notice when you were talking about the new Rupes machines introduced at SEMA you said something to the effect of being on a train with the old ones, liking the new ones better, and something about the new one having you feeling as if you are the conductor of the train. I know this isn't verbatim but I'd love to hear you elaborate on these new machines and how they compare.
I for one did not jump on the Rupes train a few months back when people were leaving the Flex for them left and right, but me thinks about now I hear a whistle a blowin' off in the not to distant future.
Mike Phillips
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- Dec 5, 2022
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Dang....
I typed up my answer and then somehow click on the wrong thing and lost it all...
Too much to do to try to retype because I'm working on pictures and info for your question Tony, suffice to say, see what I wrote in this thread,
Rupes LHR75E Mini
Post #16
The first sentence about pads is targeted at a question by statusdetailing
Also, note the time stamp for this thread, it's over 2 years ago and in this meeting I suggested and recommended that Flex consider a high performance version of the Porter Cable 7424XP STYLE of dual action polishers and the Rupes Duetto fills the bill.
I'd like to see Flex introduce their spin on a PC, until that day you're going to see me using the new Duetto quite a bit on the cool project cars that we work on here at AGO.
I typed up my answer and then somehow click on the wrong thing and lost it all...
Too much to do to try to retype because I'm working on pictures and info for your question Tony, suffice to say, see what I wrote in this thread,
Rupes LHR75E Mini
Post #16
The first sentence about pads is targeted at a question by statusdetailing
Also, note the time stamp for this thread, it's over 2 years ago and in this meeting I suggested and recommended that Flex consider a high performance version of the Porter Cable 7424XP STYLE of dual action polishers and the Rupes Duetto fills the bill.
Mike Phillips said:Secret meeting with the Flex Engineers!
Upon our arrival on Thursday afternoon, we were welcomed to the Flex Corporate Offices and then introduced to most of management and key personal.
After introductions we had what I think was one of the best parts of our trip and that was a chance to meet with and discuss power tools with the Flex Engineers. Sorry but no pictures of the actual meeting as it was private but here's the skinny... both Nick and I had a chance to talk one-on-one with all the top engineers at Flex including Dirk Rock, the engineer behind the Flex PE14
This was our opportunity to share our thoughts about tool design and the direction and needs of both the enthusiast and professional markets. It was truly an honor to sit and discuss tools and technology with the Flex engineers. I brought along two Brinkmann Swirl Finder Lights and gave one to Dirk since his job includes testing the paint polishing tools on painted hood panels in the training room.
Sorry but I can't share what we discussed nor any pictures of Nick and I with the engineers, but here's the meeting room...
Meeting Room
I'd like to see Flex introduce their spin on a PC, until that day you're going to see me using the new Duetto quite a bit on the cool project cars that we work on here at AGO.
Mike Phillips
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- Dec 5, 2022
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The simple answer is I like how it works better. I didn't know why I liked how it works better till I spoke with Marco at SEMA.
He told me because it has a shorter orbit stroke than the Bigfoot 15 and Bigfoot 21 they purposefully desinged it to offer a higher rotation speed or higher rpm to go with the smaller orbiter stroke.
I didn't know this technical feature for this tool when I recieved the prototypes back in April, all I knew after using the tool is that I really liked how it operated.
swanicyouth
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- Mar 3, 2011
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The simple answer is I like how it works better. I didn't know why I liked how it works better till I spoke with Marco at SEMA.
He told me because it has a shorter orbit stroke than the Bigfoot 15 and Bigfoot 21 they purposefully desinged it to offer a higher rotation speed or higher rpm to go with the smaller orbiter stroke.
I didn't know this technical feature for this tool when I recieved the prototypes back in April, all I knew after using the tool is that I really liked how it operated.
I can believe that. One thing I notice with the Bigfoot, sometimes the large stroke makes it hard to judge how close you can get to the edge of something with the pad.
Mike Phillips
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During the live broadcast this Thursday night I'll see if Yancy can use the boom camera to come in and capture some close-up video of the pad as it's working next to an edge or body line.
Live Broadcast on AutogeekOnline this Thursday Night!
:xyxthumbs:
The simple answer is I like how it works better. I didn't know why I liked how it works better till I spoke with Marco at SEMA.
He told me because it has a shorter orbit stroke than the Bigfoot 15 and Bigfoot 21 they purposefully desinged it to offer a higher rotation speed or higher rpm to go with the smaller orbiter stroke.
I didn't know this technical feature for this tool when I recieved the prototypes back in April, all I knew after using the tool is that I really liked how it operated.
Interesting...according to this spec sheet (assuming this is final production data):
the minimum opm (rpm) for the Duetto is 4000, and maximum is 5500.
Compare that to the Rupes 15: 1700-4800 rpm, and the Rupes 21: 1700-4200 (although I've also seen 5000 as the max in some places).
So the duetto, in terms of OPM, is always on the high side of the OPM range, even when the speed control is set on low (or I guess that's how to interpret this).
I guess you could emulate this on the 15 and 21 by only using settings above 4 or whatever, and it's a tad short on the maximum rpm. However, most people seem to be using the 15 and 21 below the max speed anyway.
Love's Auto
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- Aug 14, 2013
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I've personally never stated either the Rupes 15 or 21 were not my go-to dual action polishers due to them bogging down.
I appreciate RS99's asking for a link to anywhere I used the words bogging down in context with the Rupes polishers as the context will show my use of the words bogging down were in a reply to Art and the words bogging down were his words not mine. I simply repeated them as a reference to his post because he used them in his post.
In this article I wrote about removing sanding marks using the Rupes Bigfoot 21,
Removing #1500 Sanding Marks with Rupes Bigfoot 21 Polisher
The discussion about the Rupes polishers bogging down comes up when Art Hernandez brings it up in a discussion he had with Mike Stoops at Meguiar's.
in Post #11 of my thread on removing wetsanding marks with the Rupes Bigfoot 21 Polishers, here's Art's post followed by my post in context...
Here's my answer "in context" and the pertinent part of my opinion and experience in bold red letters.
Mike's a sharp guy and remember...
"You don't know what you can do until you try"
The bogging down is when buffing out curved panels as you'll have only a small portion of the panel touching a small portion of the face of the pad and this can impede pad rotation.
The Thursday Night Open Garage classes were always fun and it's good to see they continue the tradition.
I make it a best practice to buff out entire cars, not just spots on a flat panel to really get the feel for a tool, pads, product or technique when possible.
The first time I used the Rupes polishers I chose a BIG car with lots of flat panels and LOTS of curved panels. Even made a time lapse video of the project and I think this was the FIRST time lapse video ever made showing a car being buffed out from beginning to end using the Rupes polishers.
Here's the link to the full write-up and a portion below...
Rupes Polisher Time Lapse Video - 1955 Ford Crown Victoria
Here's the time-lapse video Yancy took for me as I buffed this classic out from start to finish...
On the passenger side I used the Rupes 21 and on the driver's side I used the Rupes 15. There was about a 20 minute time savings using the larger pad, larger stroke machine over the smaller pad, smaller stroke machine but my opinion is that for most body panel designs on modern cars the 6" pad will be a better match.
This tool definitely has a lot more correction ability plus power over a traditional DA Polisher like the Porter Cable 7424XP.
I did find that when buffing a curved panel, either concave or convex, the uneven pressure applied to the face of the pad will slow down and even stop pad rotation. The key is to focus on the panel and keep the pad as flat as possible to the surface.
And here's the complete and in-depth write up using the very cool 1955 Ford Crown Victoria...
Rupes side by side detail - 1955 Crown Victoria
Joe is not only incredibly nice he's also very knowledgeable and always conducts himself in a professional manner. His word is as good as gold. I count him as a very good friend.
Saw this discussion over the weekend and I'm happy to have chimed in to straighten out any confusion.
:xyxthumbs:
Really sorry for misquoting you Mike I read the thing a while back and I know "bogging down" was said somewhere in the write up although it wasn't the main focus of the post. I guess my point of the post I made was what machine do you prefer flex 3401 or Rupes?
hernandez.art13
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- Apr 8, 2013
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For reference I don't recall saying "specifically" since I've only used it for minutes at a time.
The whole bogging down thing on the Rupes i did not originate that comment and was not made up from me. I guess I just read like others did. My new machine is coming over tomorrow by :xyxthumbs:
The whole bogging down thing on the Rupes i did not originate that comment and was not made up from me. I guess I just read like others did. My new machine is coming over tomorrow by :xyxthumbs:
hernandez.art13
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- Apr 8, 2013
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I did say bogging down when I asked Michael Stoops if it really bogs down. He showed me and from what I saw it did not bog down. But don't own one so can't truly comment.
When spinning it cuts so beautifully and easily btw
When spinning it cuts so beautifully and easily btw
Rsurfer
Well-known member
- Jan 26, 2007
- 14,159
- 26
Dear Sirs,
Please stop posting pics of the Duetto and the Mini until the items are for sale.
Thank you,
An Interested Customer
PS Thank you and have a nice day
Wipe the drool, John.:laughing:
Mike Phillips
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- Dec 5, 2022
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- #60
You know, while doing paint correction demonstrations for 4 days straight, on a black demo hood with 4 Rupes polishes on one side of me and two Flex polishers on the other side of me, the most common question asked was,
Which tool do you prefer the most, the Flex 3401 or the Rupes polisher?
And my answer was always the same, for me it's not about which tool do I personally prefer, it's which tool would I use for the task at hand.
In all cases, I would ask the person,
What type of detailing work do you mostly do?
- Production Detailing?
- Multi-Step Show Car Detailing?
If the answer is production detailing I would recommend the Flex 3401 with the Lake Country 4" backing plate so the person could use either 5" pads or 6.5" pads depending upon the car.
If the answer is multi-step show car detailing, then I recommended the Rupes Duetto Polisher when it becomes available.
I would also say that if a person in detailing cars for a career then instead of limiting themselves to a single "type" of tool, then just like a good mechanic they should have more than one tool in their tool chest.
A good mechanic has more than a single 9/16 wrench in their tool chest, instead they have multiple wrenches as well as a whole array of tools so they can always use the best tool for the job. For example you always break head bolts using a 6-point socket, not a 12-point socket, that's using the right tool for the job.
Besides using the right tool for the job there's a certain level of personal preference when it comes to each person deciding which tool is their go-to tool of choice and the ONLY way to know which tool is best for you and your style of car detailing is to put some time behind each tool to get real-world, hands-on experience and the more cars and the more time you can get behind any tool the better you can become with each specific tool.
So I never mind when someone tries to box me into a canyon and get me to go on record as to which tool is my go-to, favorite tool but it's not about me... it's about you.
Here's the deal... I can do everything car detailing related with a good rotary buffer and a Porter Cable dual action polisher. But given my druthers, I'd druthers have more tools than just these two available and then pick the best tool for the task at hand.