Orange Peel - A slow victim of the DA?

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Gokite

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I am curious if you guys who polish your vehicles once a year or once every other year notice the orange peel dissipate slightly with each DA polishing routine? My new vehicle has quite noticeable orange peel and I am considering a nano coating but don't want to coat the paint before I reduce the OP a bit. I'm curious if a couple passes of cutting will smooth it out or if I need to go with a process specifically to remove the OP.
 
That's a good question. But, theoretically the orange peel won't go away unless you sand it. I believe the foam or MF pads conform to the peaks and valleys of the orange peel. So, the peaks and valleys both shrink at a similar rate. You need to use something sorta stiff and aggressive that will just remove the peaks of the peel.
 
swanicyouth said:
That's a good question. But, theoretically the orange peel won't go away unless you sand it. I believe the foam or MF pads conform to the peaks and valleys of the orange peel. So, the peaks and valleys both shrink at a similar rate. You need to use something sorta stiff and aggressive that will just remove the peaks of the peel.
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Agree. I you want to remove or reduce orange peel you need to either sand it or abrade it using a compound with a hard flat denim pad.


If you sand, stick with the Trizact #5000 grit.


:)
 
I've actually reduced orange peel using a rotary buffer with a wool pad and a compound by buffing hard but wouldn't recommend it....

Even have an article on this topic....



Can orange peel be removed or lessoned by just machine compounding?


This is 1958 Chevrolet Belair that I compounded heavily from the center chrome trim up including the hood, roof and deck-lid. The owner didn't want to spend any more than $300.00 so wet-sanding was off the table.


The below pictures don't show the results as well as looking at the results in person but you could definitely see there was less orange peel on all the paint above the long stainless steel trim running down the car and the paint below the trim.

orangepeellessened01.jpg




Close-up, cropped out section...
orangepeellessened02.jpg



That was a huge car to buff out...

Note the use of newspaper even back then to cover and protect the wheels and tires during the buff-out...


Question: Can orange peel be removed or lessoned by just machine compounding?

Answer: You bet, been there and done that... but wet-sanding is the right way...



See this article...

Wetsanding - Fresh Paint vs Factory Paint


And this article,

Video: Wow! 3M #5000 Grit Polishing I mean Sanding Discs!

:buffing:





:D
 
Block wet sanding (finishing paper and a sanding block) is probably one of the most effective tools for orange peel (OP) removal.

But...
Using a product whose abrasives are SMAT;
With a buffing pad that's referred to as flat:
May reduce the peaks of OP to an extent that
The paint invokes: "Mirror finish is where it's at"!

Seriously...
The way I look at diminishing/removing OP is:
When you notice that this has happened, by whatever method, this means the expected service life of the
CC-paint has been reduced...Its "UV-protectors" even compromised.

Bob
 
Gokite said:
I am curious if you guys who polish your vehicles once a year or once every other year notice the orange peel dissipate slightly with each DA polishing routine? My new vehicle has quite noticeable orange peel and I am considering a nano coating but don't want to coat the paint before I reduce the OP a bit. I'm curious if a couple passes of cutting will smooth it out or if I need to go with a process specifically to remove the OP.
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I use 3M 3000-5000 Trizact papers to reduce orange peel and/or remove severe defects all the time. You can do either it with a rotary, wool pads, and "rocks in a bottle" compounds, but I don't recommend it. Wet sanding is much safer because it generates almost no heat. Clearcoats do not like heat --- at all. Read Mike's excellent article on using the Griots Garage 3" polisher to reduce orange peel.
 
Dealing with OP is normally done by the paint shop within a day or two after clear coat. When it is softer. Now you are probably in ultra fine sanding mode. Or live with it and shine what you have.

Back when it was softer the rotary and compound was able to "smear" it a little to flatten it out.
 
If you don't feel comfy wet sanding, use a "velvet" or "denim" buffing pad (as Mike stated) by CarPro to knock the OP down. It is slower, but give them a shot if you've never sanded/buffed before. Work great on a rotary, but also worked well on my 3401.
 
I sense this is factory clear coat you want to remove orange peel from, which is extremely thin to begin with. If you do this, the most likely best case scenario is that you will significantly thin the clear to the point of diminishing its longevity greatly. Bob said as much.

Also, this orange peel might be subduing the appearance of any waves in the bodywork that came out of the body stamping dies.
You need to think really hard as to whether you want to thin this factory clear just to remove orange peel.
Ideally, you should sand out all the orange peel and re clear it.
 
fly07sti said:
If you don't feel comfy wet sanding, use a "velvet" or "denim" buffing pad (as Mike stated) by CarPro to knock the OP down. It is slower, but give them a shot if you've never sanded/buffed before. Work great on a rotary, but also worked well on my 3401.
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If you have never sanded or buffed...I would not suggest trying to remove or diminish OP.

Wait until you have 100 hours on a machine and if you still want to attempt it, go ahead.

I have used the CarPro Denim on a small section of my truck. It worked great with M105, but you will be nervous the entire time. Watch the heat.

Last night a fellow AutoGeek, put a paint thickness gauge to my truck and I was alarmed not only at how thin Factory paint is, but how the readings were so different from one section of the car to another.

Proceed with caution on OEM clear.
 
You could have it sanded and then shoot 2 or so coats of additional clear. Then you'll have more clear to sand down the orange peel.

Side Note: so you had low reads Kyle? Time to Opti Coat it. :)

I'll text you...
 
hernandez.art13 said:
You could have it sanded and then shoot 2 or so coats of additional clear. Then you'll have more clear to sand down the orange peel.

Side Note: so you had low reads Kyle? Time to Opti Coat it. :)

I'll text you...
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4 to 4.5 on vertical panels
 
Yea. New Mazda cx5. Even if the foam pads conform, they will always take off more from the peaks of OP vs the valleys but it sounds like it is a negligible difference.

I am not a DA guru, yet...I have a GG6 right now. I guess I will stick with the current OP I see. I just see some incredibly crisp reflections on some photos here of even old cars so I figured I'd ask...
 
I would consider sanding under the door handle to make it smoother. There you could get almost all of it out because it looks very shallow, yet rough. You could get about 75% of it out with very little material taken off from what I can see. The roughness would bother me.
Maybe a 25% to 50% would be more advisable.
The rear quarter OP is so deep you would be unwise to sand it out.
I think you should learn to live with the quarter the way it is.
Eventually yes, it will be a slow victim of the DA. 25% might be taken off with a DA. It isn't bad enough to go after at the expense of cc thickness at this juncture IMO.
 
Disappointing to hear this. I was hoping there was a way for me to do something about it not requiring such expense or risk. Thanks for your help everyone.
 
Blackthorn One said:
I would consider sanding under the door handle to make it smoother. There you could get almost all of it out because it looks very shallow, yet rough. You could get about 75% of it out with very little material taken off from what I can see. The roughness would bother me.
Maybe a 25% to 50% would be more advisable.
The rear quarter OP is so deep you would be unwise to sand it out.
I think you should learn to live with the quarter the way it is.
Eventually yes, it will be a slow victim of the DA. 25% might be taken off with a DA. It isn't bad enough to go after at the expense of cc thickness at this juncture IMO.
Click to expand...

Careful giving definitive advice based on one cell phone photo.


If you correct only the area under the door handle, will it make the adjacent areas look that much worse?


"You could get about 75% of it out with very little material taken off from what I can see."

How can you tell?
 
allenk4 said:
Careful giving definitive advice based on one cell phone photo.


If you correct only the area under the door handle, will it make the adjacent areas look that much worse?


"You could get about 75% of it out with very little material taken off from what I can see."

How can you tell?
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"From what I can see" is the the operative phrase. from that angle, it looks as I described. However, he can see the car from all angles. If the peel looks deeper than that from other angles then he has the advantage, and needs to be more cautious.
As far as the quarter looking worse after he does the door, to ME, the door looks worse right now, so doing the door will make them look more even.

If this is to be done at all, it should not be sanded down to the deepest valleys of the peel. The high parts of the peel relative to the valleys are what bothers, so if one is very conservative and stay far away from the deep parts, I think improvement could be made at rather moderate cc loss.

Perfection is unrealistic here but a small improvement seemed to be what he was looking for based on the thread's title.

As I said initially, I don't think that sanding factory clear is practical. What if scratches happen later and you would really need that greater thickness to sand down to remove scratches?
Paint needs to be a certain thickness to have longevity, and factory paint tends to be thinner than show car's paint.
 
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