Why is the Flex 3401 considered so powerful?

[tuscarora dave]

Good information.

Don't if you saw my earlier post, but is "strokes per minute" different than "orbits per minute" ?

I am not an engineer but I would think that strokes would be somewhat different than orbits. The earth moving around the sun would illustrate an orbit. The location of the pencil point stuck through the hole in the geared disc of a spirograph would illustrate strokes as it is applied to the 3401. But with out the orbit you can't have the strokes.

It just keeps getting more confuzing.:dunno:

I just got to say "kudos to the guy who was able to figure all this out and design the tool" Because I love mine.

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

I am not an engineer but I would think that strokes would be somewhat different than orbits. The earth moving around the sun would illustrate an orbit. The location of the pencil point stuck through the hole in the geared disc of a spirograph would illustrate strokes as it is applied to the 3401. But with out the orbit you can't have the strokes.

It just keeps getting more confuzing.:dunno:

I just got to say "kudos to the guy who was able to figure all this out and design the tool" Because I love mine.

Orbit stroke length would have to factor into the math as well.

I agree, it's getting more confusing. Maybe it's a good idea to stop right here..haha

 

[tuscarora dave]

If this is true, it's false advertisement because Flex claims 9600 orbits per minute.

The technical information in my owner's manual states 160-480 R.P.M. but it also states Sroke rate Min-1 3200-9600. Nowhere in the manual does it mention Orbits or O.P.M. so maybe there is a typo somewhere.

 

[A4 1.8tqm]

Raw power is not everything and is not the only scorecard for grading the capability of a polisher...

It seems as though high OPM is the new *hype* for machines just like Megapixels is for cameras

Great analogy, Mega Pixel specs can be hilariously misleading.

I took the plunge($495) and ordered the Festool Rotex 150 FEQ dual mode polisher. I'm anxious to compare it to the 3401. Festool offers a 30 day money back guarantee(no questions asked). :buffing:

:applause: Looking forward to your findings

20 strokes x 480 revolutions per minute = 9600 strokes. So the backing plate is actually stroking back and forth 9600 times combined with the backing plate rotating 480 times, this all occurs within 1 minute at speed setting #6. That makes for some pretty good correction and the plastic gears only have the strain caused by the drag of the pad against the paint which isn't much.

As far as power goes it would be like measuring the horse power at the wheels on a car, in that is is geared power. I think if I tried to grab the backing plate and pad and stop it with my hand I would have some broken or at least injured fingers. So this tool has tremendous power. much more power than that of a rotary because it is geared to spin at only 480 R.P.M. but that power has nothing (other than the ability to apply downward pressure) to do with the rate of correction.

Great explanation Dave! Here's a pic of the Flex 3401 spare parts list, may help with understanding it.

 

[tuscarora dave]

I took the plunge($495) and ordered the Festool Rotex 150 FEQ dual mode polisher. I'm anxious to compare it to the 3401. Festool offers a 30 day money back guarantee(no questions asked). :buffing:

I'd be curious to see how that compares to the Dual Mode Makita. That will probably be the next heated thread. lol:dblthumb2:

 

[Koz]

The factory spec for the 3401 is "Orbital Rate - 3200-9600 RPM" not stroke rate (From their website). Side by side comparisons show that the 3401 corrects faster then the PC. Some people claim the PC and/or other ROs have more OPM and more power (Looking at output power, not input power). Between the OEM’s solid reputation and the FACT that the Flex corrects faster, common sense tells me that the OEM's specs are NOT smoke and mirrors! I sent an email to the engineers for clarification. I will post the results.

Koz

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

and the FACT that the Flex corrects faster, common sense tells me that the OEM's specs are NOT smoke and mirrors! I sent an email to the engineers for clarification. I will post the results.

I'm not doubting that at all. However, I would attribute the faster correction rate more so to *forced rotation* rather than OPM's with this specific machine.

 

[Irish]

This topic is like the undead cat a friend of mine told me about. Simply will not go quietly.

You crazy kids and your debates. :buffing:

 

[Deep Gloss Auto Salon]

I'm not doubting that at all. However, I would attribute the faster correction rate more so to *forced rotation* rather than OPM's with this specific machine.

In the context of this discussion, I feel OPM and forced rotation go hand in hand.

Reason being, if a given traditional DA (non forced rotation) has more OPM (on paper) than that of forced rotation unit the traditional DA can be slowed down via pressure, not flat surface etc. The forced rotation unit cannot be slowed down therefore, providing more OPM…

Hope that makes sense

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

In the context of this discussion, I feel OPM and forced rotation go hand in hand.

Reason being, if a given traditional DA (non forced rotation) has more OPM (on paper) than that of forced rotation unit the traditional DA can be slowed down via pressure, not flat surface etc. The forced rotation unit cannot be slowed down therefore, providing more OPM…

Hope that makes sense

Makes sense. Flex must figure their OPM different than the "industry standard".

 

[Deep Gloss Auto Salon]

Makes sense. Flex must figure their OPM different than the "industry standard".

I cannot confirm nor deny that and that was not the intent of my post.

In this case, IMO, when comparing OPM of a forced rotation machine vs a non forced rotation machine, when actually polishing (not just spinning the machine in the air) you are not comparing "apples to apples"

 

[RaskyR1]

Well it is the rotation that the majority of the correction comes from right? So a machine where rotation can't be slowed or stopped (Flex) should have significantly more correcting ability than one that can (PC), no?

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

Well it is the rotation that the majority of the correction comes from right? So a machine where rotation can't be slowed or stopped (Flex) should have significantly more correcting ability than one that can (PC), no?

Absolutely, and this is what I've come to understand. Even though the Flex doesn't spin at a very high MAX OPM, it's the forced rotation that makes it so effective. :xyxthumbs:

 

[Deep Gloss Auto Salon]

Well it is the rotation that the majority of the correction comes from right? So a machine where rotation can't be slowed or stopped (Flex) should have significantly more correcting ability than one that can (PC), no?

Great minds..........

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

I never doubted the Flex 3401 will correct faster/better than a PC. I just wanted a clarification to my original question when I started this thread. :xyxthumbs:

 

[Bunky]

I think there was a least two other active threads on the very same subject that kept the mods busy.

 

[Koz]

Absolutely, and this is what I've come to understand. Even though the Flex doesn't spin at a very high MAX OPM, it's the forced rotation that makes it so effective. :xyxthumbs:

I would go even further on this point. I think the fact that the rotation being forced in the opposite direction of the orbital rotation is the key to its effectiveness. Think about it, you have two opposite cutting forces happening at the same time. Sort of like cross-cutting a lawn, in one pass. Even when using any polisher you change direction with each pass.

Koz

 

[Fly bye]

Kinda like shaving againts the stubble :iagree:

 

[rohnramirez]

I just had a headache reading through this thread lol.

But i would love to hear a review from 07 z-oh-6 about his new toy!!!

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Well it is the rotation that the majority of the correction comes from right? So a machine where rotation can't be slowed or stopped (Flex) should have significantly more correcting ability than one that can (PC), no?

Ding ding ding ding... we have a winner...

Another way of describing correction ability is the ability to remove paint quickly. The rotary is king when it comes to removing paint quickly due to it's direct drive single action rotation. The next step down are tools like the Flex 3401 for the reason Rasky stated.

I think there was a least two other active threads on the very same subject that kept the mods busy.

It just goes back to the old phenomena about how when sitting behind a keyboard "some" people will say things on a forum that they would never say if they were in nose punching distance from the person they are talking to.


Why is the Flex 3401 considered so powerful?


Or

Why are threads about which tool is best so powerful?


Seriously, it's all good as long as everyone just takes an extra moment to think before posting and remembers it's just car wax man... or in this case power tools

:laughing: