I'm baffled - still have swirls after hours of work

Mike Phillips has a book out called "The Art of Detailing" and a video to go with it. It's available from AutoGeek. I highly recommend it.
 
Where are you located? Feel free to pm me if you want. If you're close enough I'm open to helping out if interested.
 
CM8 6MT said:
Agree with FivePoint.0 here...one of the most over looked aspects to folks new to the detail scene.
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Yes, I remember when I first started, I used one pad for the entire car and never cleaned it..LOL! Now, I use my compressor to clean after every section.
 
Bill220 said:
I copied & pasted a bunch of the suggestions made here, printed it and will refer to it when I'm in the garage. Got my black pads and high quality MF towels yesterday but the Brinkman hasn't arrived. Once it gets here, I'll polish the trunk lid again and post up some progress pictures.
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Great idea and don't give up, update pics when possible and what you used.
 
FivePoint.0 said:
Yes, I remember when I first started, I used one pad for the entire car and never cleaned it..LOL! Now, I use my compressor to clean after every section.
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And now days we all hope to learn from our own mistakes, read a LOT, and ask for help in places like AGO before we start down the road to 'machine buffing insanity'. ;)
 
Bill220 said:
I've been reviewing this thread for the past few days and it seems evident to me that there are a variety of things that I did wrong.

1. assumed that my super bright lights in my garage would show any swirls or flaws.
2. used the wrong product to start with
3. bought cheap MF towels and paid the price for being cheap
4. I'm moving too quickly and rushing to get done
5. didn't prime my pads and assumed that pad conditioner took the place of priming
6. need to clean and/or swap pads more often

I copied & pasted a bunch of the suggestions made here, printed it and will refer to it when I'm in the garage. Got my black pads and high quality MF towels yesterday but the Brinkman hasn't arrived. Once it gets here, I'll polish the trunk lid again and post up some progress pictures.
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Bill,

I'd say if you get 4, 5 & 6 right then 1, 2 & 3 will be a breeze. ;)
Please let us know how it progresses.
 
freddie46 said:
From your description of the steps you took, I didn't see a step for paint clay. If this step was skipped you could be grinding surface contaminants into the paint. I suggest you start over with a wash, then paint clay step with a good lubricant, then tape off a test area where you can try various pads, polishes and waxes until you find the right combination that will eliminate the swirls. That way you aren't having to do the whole car over multiple times and reduce the risk of damaging your clear coat. Always use the least aggressive combination of pads and polishes/compounds to get the job done. Finally as someone has already suggested, invest in high quality micro fiber for drying, and removing polish and wax. Try Griot's Garage to select the towels. They have a clear description of which towels to use with each step. Their products are outstanding the only products I use.
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It didn't need claying at all. It's pretty much a garage queen (99% of the time). I had clayed and sealed it over the summer. I did the baggie test and felt nothing on the paint. I did re-strip it, however. I will be sure to do a test spot and use my new Brinkman Light.

Thank you.
 
freddie46 said:
Mike Phillips has a book out called "The Art of Detailing" and a video to go with it. It's available from AutoGeek. I highly recommend it.
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I'm going to purchase and download the ebook today.

rwright said:
Where are you located? Feel free to pm me if you want. If you're close enough I'm open to helping out if interested.
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About 15 minutes North of Pittsburgh. Thanks!

FivePoint.0 said:
Yes, I remember when I first started, I used one pad for the entire car and never cleaned it..LOL! Now, I use my compressor to clean after every section.
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I wish I had an air compressor. The closest thing I have is a Vac n Blo Metropolitan, which probably isn't strong enough.

cartman57 said:
Great idea and don't give up, update pics when possible and what you used.
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I will for sure. I'm hoping to get to it on Saturday.

cardaddy said:
Bill,

I'd say if you get 4, 5 & 6 right then 1, 2 & 3 will be a breeze. ;)
Please let us know how it progresses.
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I hope so! :)
 
Round 2:

Got my Brinkman and high quality MF towels in the mail today so after work I headed down to attempt to apply what I've read here and The Art Of Detailing (ebook).

I did one half of the trunk lid (09 Mustang, very short lid).

Black LC (flat) pad, M205, speed on 4 1/2 (kept bogging or skipping on 4). I have the backing plate marked so I know it was spinning. I did my best to move at about an inch per second, 6 passes (3 vertical, 3 horizontal). Wiped it down with a my new high quality microfiber towel and 11% IPA. The swirls are still there. I did this 3 more times, same result. The freshly polished side is only marginally better than the untouched one.

Now what, fellas?


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Bill220 said:
Round 2:

Got my Brinkman and high quality MF towels in the mail today so after work I headed down to attempt to apply what I've read here and The Art Of Detailing (ebook).

I did one half of the trunk lid (09 Mustang, very short lid).

Black LC (flat) pad, M205, speed on 4 1/2 (kept bogging or skipping on 4). I have the backing plate marked so I know it was spinning. I did my best to move at about an inch per second, 6 passes (3 vertical, 3 horizontal). Wiped it down with a my new high quality microfiber towel and 11% IPA. The swirls are still there. I did this 3 more times, same result. The freshly polished side is only marginally better than the untouched one.

Now what, fellas?


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Try m205 on white or orange. If that doesn't work, move up to m105
 
What temp is your garage? If its below 40° or extra dry you may need an extra squirt of detail spray to keep it lubricated if its skipping. As stated above it sounds like you need to get more aggressive.
 
Not sure why you have M205 on speed 4....I usually run it at 5, then 5 1/2 for the last passes, then lighten up the pressure on the last pass.
 
IMO take 205 and start moving up the aggressive scale with your pads and see what happens. Once you have reached the most aggressive pad with 205 and no luck then might want to try going back 105 with least aggressive pad and work your way up the aggressive scale.
 
Bill220 said:
Round 2:

Got my Brinkman and high quality MF towels in the mail today so after work I headed down to attempt to apply what I've read here and The Art Of Detailing (ebook).

I did one half of the trunk lid (09 Mustang, very short lid).

Black LC (flat) pad, M205, speed on 4 1/2 (kept bogging or skipping on 4). I have the backing plate marked so I know it was spinning. I did my best to move at about an inch per second, 6 passes (3 vertical, 3 horizontal). Wiped it down with a my new high quality microfiber towel and 11% IPA. The swirls are still there. I did this 3 more times, same result. The freshly polished side is only marginally better than the untouched one.

Now what, fellas?


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The process you described (Blk LC pad with 205 on speed 4) is the step you would do after corrections. You do this to refine the paint.

For moderate correction, you need to be at 5 or 6 with a cutting pad (possibly with M105) and firm pressure.

For Heavy correction, shrink your work area even more and proceed with the above.

What you are experiencing... is the "Art" of the detailing process. You probably realized by now that there is more to this then just picking up a few polishes and a buffer. There is no such thing as "One Method" that works with every car. There will be trails and errors and that's the importance of a test spot....to establish a method for the vehicle that you are working on.

Have patience. It will work for you.

Good Luck.
 
inyadreems said:
IMO take 205 and start moving up the aggressive scale with your pads and see what happens. Once you have reached the most aggressive pad with 205 and no luck then might want to try going back 105 with least aggressive pad and work your way up the aggressive scale.
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+1 Good tip
 
Bill220 said:
Nobody scratched the trunk. It wasn't like that until I polished it. The car never goes anywhere where I have to park and leave it. It's a toy.


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Haven't read the whole thread so I don't know if this was asked already. Are they all over or localized to that area,the trunk? And if they're all over please post some pics of other problem areas.
 
+1 on the more pictures...

But as I have stated before, as far as it was possible to tell from the first pictures, which were kind of small, it wasn't haze from compound but scratches from something.... maybe you weren't working exactly clean on the first time and ended up putting some little deep scratches... and if that's the case (which seems to be by now), you should need to go the aggressive route as others have stated...

Just make sure, if you do need to get to m105 to correct it, work on very small areas.... make sure you put some pressure, but not a lot on speed 6... and if it doesn't do the job, increase pressure and reduce arm speed still on speed 6.

After you successfully remove these scratches, move to 205 2 to 4 medium high pressure (speed 6), followed by 2 moderated pressure (speed 5) and 2 light pressure (speed 4)
 
RMM said:
You're moving too fast and probably not applying enough pressure.
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Bill220 said:
I think you're right.
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Kind of busy doing the rest of the setup for this weekend's classes but from this pictures this looks like an easy fix.

First read this,

DA Polisher Trouble Shooting Guide


How to troubleshoot a problem
Find a section where you see the defects and place a tape-line across it so the defects are on both sides of the tape line.

Next buff on just one side using good technique with your compound and polish like you're doing a Test Spot.


How To Do a Test Spot
(and why it's so important)


Carefully wipe off the residue from your last machine polishing step using a clean, dry microfiber towel folded for ways like shown here,

How to correctly fold and use a Microfiber Towel


Then inspect and tell us what you see.



:)
 
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