Eldorado2k
Well-known member
- Nov 9, 2015
- 14,545
- 645
- Thread starter
- #21
The so called ease of use means squat if the paint looks like crap 4 weeks later... I had to clay and polish these defects off.
Is it ok to top HD Speed with a sealant?
- Thread starter Eldorado2k
- Start date
The so called ease of use means squat if the paint looks like crap 4 weeks later... I had to clay and polish these defects off.
The so called ease of use means squat if the paint looks like crap 4 weeks later... I had to clay and polish these defects off.
Oh I agree, been there done that lol...it's mind boggling how popular it seems to be with so many, i just don't get it. I never got the cut some say they do now the durability some say they do. I still have the bottles they sent me to test for them lol.
mwoywod
New member
- Apr 3, 2016
- 881
- 0
Products I've used after polishing with HD Speed that have lasted at least 6 months.
M37 Hi-def paint sealant, jescar powerlock+, FK1000p, & Ultimate Fast Finish
I usually apply the paint sealant immediately after finishing a vehicle with HD Speed.
The sealant/montan wax in HD Speed seems to last about 4-6 weeks on glass and on paint and the only time I've used it as a standalone was when first testing it's durability on the hood of my truck.
Like others have said, M37 360 is probably a better if you can't get past the thought of topping an AIO.
HD speed is the best option if you want a product that finishes as good or better than the best finishing polishes, is easier to use, easier to remove, isn't oily at all, and doesn't need to be worked for 4-8 passes to create the best finish possible. The one massive drawback of HD Speed is the durability.
Like others have mentioned, UFF is fantastic on top of HD Speed.
M37 Hi-def paint sealant, jescar powerlock+, FK1000p, & Ultimate Fast Finish
I usually apply the paint sealant immediately after finishing a vehicle with HD Speed.
The sealant/montan wax in HD Speed seems to last about 4-6 weeks on glass and on paint and the only time I've used it as a standalone was when first testing it's durability on the hood of my truck.
Like others have said, M37 360 is probably a better if you can't get past the thought of topping an AIO.
HD speed is the best option if you want a product that finishes as good or better than the best finishing polishes, is easier to use, easier to remove, isn't oily at all, and doesn't need to be worked for 4-8 passes to create the best finish possible. The one massive drawback of HD Speed is the durability.
Like others have mentioned, UFF is fantastic on top of HD Speed.
custmsprty
New member
- Apr 11, 2012
- 7,496
- 0
My personal experience with Poxy is quite the opposite. Let me preface this buy saying I live in Florida " The Sunshine State". It was 90 today, full blown 10 on the UV scale. Florida is the testing ground graveyard for car care products.
I did this Camaro a few years ago. It sits outside 24/7. I applied Poxy after Speed in May 2015 and this was picture was take in August 2015 after a heavy rain. approximately 4 months of tropical sun and daily torrential rains. The other important key factor is their was no applications of any type of booster, detail spray etc during that time. And it was also dirty at the timeof the photo which also inhibits beading. That's what I call a real world test. So all in all I'd say Poxy did pretty good. Most people on this forum can't go a week without a wash and a topper of some sort. I've purchased and used most of the top sealants discussed on this forum and Poxy hangs right in there with all of the ones I've used. The list is too long for me to post.
Speed would not wear away underneath, Speed has Poxy in it so the two products work "synergistically".
I'm not defending HD or any other products, just posting what my personal experience with the products I've purchased has been in the environment I live in.
I recently used BF AIO, I saw no major benefits or longevity over Speed so for the cost I'm sticking with Speed. I've had a bottle of Menzerna Powerlock on the shelf for 3 years now. When I initially purchased it way back when I used it and if beading is the criteria we are using for longevity then it failed big time down here. It was dead in less than 6 weeks.
View attachment 63483
View attachment 63484
Route246
New member
- Mar 4, 2017
- 1,037
- 0
I don't know. I wash weekly and use OCW+FastWax as a drying agent. All of our vehicles get this treatment. I estimate ($40/gal on sale) that it costs $0.31/oz and I use about 4-6 oz. per vehicle as a drying agent, less than $2/vehicle. I can easily afford $2/vehicle/week, given the protection I get from doing this. I don't know why more people don't do this with their personal vehicles. I buy the spray wax on sale and use a lot of it (32 oz bottle doesn't last long).
476s lasts a long time in NorCal because our weather is moderate. The weekly spray wax is a bonus. I use AIO once or twice a year, based on a test spot result.
BTW, I work my real job during the week and Saturdays are reserved for our vehicles. Intense wash and wax activity is a form of aerobic exercise for me. It beats running, swimming and the gym because it has the benefit of a detailed finish on the paint. I am pretty spent and tired when I'm done. This is intentional. Anyone who details cars knows that if you step up the pace you can get a real nice workout.
FWIW, I used HD Speed on my parents' car and then applied WGDGPS. A month later, the beading was mostly gone. When I use WGDGPS on my car, the beading lasts for months. There are some clear differences in the way I take care of my car vs my parents, but I can't help but think that the speed affected the sealant durability. I want to try it again on my car at some point.
Eldorado2k
Well-known member
- Nov 9, 2015
- 14,545
- 645
- Thread starter
- #27
For the record: I honestly couldn’t care less about it’s lack of beading 4 weeks later, I sort of expected that... My concern is how it allowed the paint on the horizontal panels to become etched with dirt and water spots. I had already planned on laying down a proper layer of protection the next time I saw the truck, what I didn’t expect was to have to polish it.
mwoywod
New member
- Apr 3, 2016
- 881
- 0
You know how lots of people started using M205 with a microfiber cutting pad rather than using a cutting compound to remove heavy defects? Saying you don't understand why people like HD Speed because it doesn't have a ton of cut and it's not as durable as a dedicated paint sealant would be like me saying I don't understand how people like M205 because it doesn't cut nearly as much as everyone says.
Most guys know HD speed doesn't have a ton of cut and it has terrible durability compared to dedicated paint sealants. There isn't an AIO that is perfect at everything. I just think it's crazy that (other than the recently released Blackfire One-step) there is virtually no other AIO that is as user friendly or is capable of finishing as good or better than 90% of finishing polishes, none of them are as easy to use on soft finicky paints without leaving behind a bunch of residual oils, not to mention how trim and sun friendly HD speed is.
I say I don't understand why people like it so much because of my personal and extensive history with the product. Also M205 is a far different horse than Speed so it's really not that comparable, although it might seem to be at first glance. M205 was always good and worked as advertised, actually better since day one. I can't say the same about Speed, in all my testing of it, it never performed as advertised at all. I've had these same arguments many times over about 7 or 8 years ago when Speed first came out, it's crazy how the same things pop up again.
mwoywod
New member
- Apr 3, 2016
- 881
- 0
that would be really disappointing. You'd think it would provide a level of protection for at least a month.
custmsprty
New member
- Apr 11, 2012
- 7,496
- 0
I agree 100%.
When HD Speed came out it set the bar for AIO's and their competition has been chasing them since then. Over all value imho goes to Speed. Value being quality, cost, ease of use etc.
Let me also note, 3D manufactures their own products, you can see there production facility online. It costs a ton of money to set up a bare bones blending and packaging line. I've been selling packaging systems for 28 years. Many of the products discussed here are made by contract manufacturers.
Buying products in drums and repackaging and labeling is not manufacturing, it's repackaging.
This is a labeling system I sold to a liquid ferilizer manufacturer, $16,000 just for the labeler.
View attachment 63491
View attachment 63492
This is a 5 gallon manual bucket labeler, $12,000
View attachment 63493
I would expect as much. WGDGPS needs a nice clean product free surface to adhere to.
I say I don't understand why people like it so much because of my personal and extensive history with the product. Also M205 is a far different horse than Speed so it's really not that comparable, although it might seem to be at first glance. M205 was always good and worked as advertised, actually better since day one. I can't say the same about Speed, in all my testing of it, it never performed as advertised at all. I've had these same arguments many times over about 7 or 8 years ago when Speed first came out, it's crazy how the same things pop up again.
Also, isn't it just silly and totally defeats the purpose of an AIO if you need to top it with something? You're far better off using a good polish and a sealant.
I believe that when the silicone in Speed wears off, this is what happens, you're just left with bare paint left to the environment.
custmsprty
New member
- Apr 11, 2012
- 7,496
- 0
Not really, since there are hundreds of threads here with people posting about topping coatings. We're talking coatings. Why would you need to top a coating or maintain a coating if the manufacturer says it's good for 1 year or two years etc. That I will never understand. I'm not spending $80-$100 on a coating and expecting to have to use a relaod or topper to maintain it.
IMHO every product has it's place.
mwoywod
New member
- Apr 3, 2016
- 881
- 0
I think you missed my point.
Your problem with HD Speed is that it doesn't have as much cut or as good of protection as people say it does. My point is that just because some people said they've used it for removing deep defects doesn't mean that is how the product was intended to be used. Just like how M205 wasn't intended to be used for heavy defect removal.
HD Speed was designed to remove light swirls, make the paint shiny, save time, and leave behind some protection. It was never advertised to remove heavy defects or provide the longest lasting protection. Much like how M205 wasn't intended to be used for heavy defect removal. It wouldn't be reasonable to say M205 is a bad product "because it doesn't cut like a heavy compound"
Eldorado2k
Well-known member
- Nov 9, 2015
- 14,545
- 645
- Thread starter
- #37
Wouldn’t the residual oils found in a polish and the wax found in an AIO pretty much cancel each other out if they were to be put head to head? I’d actually give the nod to just about any polish with abrasives in it over an AIO. Cleaner waxes have forever been known for masking defects. Polishes not so much, given they’re not “pure” polishes aka glazes.
I think the general makeup of an AIO had shortcomings all around. Less cut than a polish, less protection than a sealant. Honestly other than time savings I see no advantage in an AIO at all.
It goes a little deeper than than just my problems with it. My problems arose from the initial claims that were found to just not be true. But that was a conversation for 7 years ago, no need to get into the details again now.
custmsprty
New member
- Apr 11, 2012
- 7,496
- 0
I have had nothing but stellar results and happy customers with Speed. It is one of the easiest to use all around products I have ever had the pleasure of using. And like I said, it set the bar, the competitors have been chasing it since it's release. At with that, I'm checking out on this thread, later................