Should I give up?

Setec Astronomy said:
Why would they do that? The only reason I can think of, and I guess this might make sense to a dealer, is that when people come in with their swirled-up black car, it's easier for them to polish out.
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I don't remember the exact reason, but Ron Ketcham from Detailer Buddies on FB explained why. I'll try to find the answer.
 
WRAPT C5Z06 said:
Well, here is a fact and this was told to me by someone in the automotive paint industry. With the NEWER high end GM black vehicles, they're is using a softer clear on BLACK paint. You have very soft paint and just being black, you will see everything. I don't care how good you take care of ANY black vehicle, you're gonna see noticeable defects, especially on newer GM black paint. Either deal with it, or buy another color. Seriously.
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I would have to disagree. I've done a black Impalla and two black Camaro's a 12 and a 14 and all three were pretty tough clear coats to correct. Just like with my Audi, the clear is very tough but when perfectly corrected to a mirror finish, it will scratch very easily and show it with ease. I don't think the clear finish is any different, just shows more imperfections more easily being pure black.

I literally go out in my garage now with my finger, wipe a smudge on my car and leave a fingerprint sized set of scratches. LIght pressure, a finger and split second. Then to correct it I need polish, pad and 5lbs of force or a minute with my ibrid Nano. Sounds crazy but true. I usually valet my car when traveling but I refuse to let them get my luggage as they tend to rub knees on my back bumper and it drives me crazy how it gets scratched up. Call me OCD but I get my own luggage and I close my trunk by my license plate cover not by the deck lid.

I rinseless this this kind of dirt all day long with no issues. Here's another typical winter shot. A good pre-soak and about 6-8 480gsm Eagle Edgeless MF Towels folded for 16 surfaces works wonders.
 
Don M said:
I use the bowtie in the center of the trunk to close the lid
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haha! so I'm not the only Crazy buckeye here ;)

hey, I'll let you vouch for the paint on my Audi, you've seen it up close. It owns me but that's okay as I enjoy it. I stand by the fact that it's technique when drying. I have had to fix up a few areas here and there but overall the McKee's 37 coating, and she is wearing a couple coats, saved me. Really has gone a HUGE way at preventing Micro Marring.
 
Eldorado2k said:
And why is your name Ford Fest, but you bought a Yukon Denali? Lol. J/k
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Hahaha..... I was about to ask the same question. Then remembered I have 3-4 "Chevy Truck" t-shirts that I got as freebies from various shows, yet I drive a Ford. I wonder how many people have seen me get in/out of my truck with those shirts on and scratched their heads LOL. Not thread hijacking just me laugh.
 
I feel your pain. I bought a 2016 Silverado in black this year. But it hasn't been as bad as I thought it would be. After doing a correction and seal, my wash method is nothing revolutionary but it is carefully done. I use 2 buckets with Grit Guards and Grit Guard Wash Boards in both buckets. I'll wash the window and top half of a door, then go back to the rinse bucket. Scrub on the wash board, go to the soap bucket, scrub on the wash board in there a little more, move on to the next panel.

When I used to wash my cars, I noticed how much left over soapy water there was in the bucket. Why waste it? Reload your wash mitt as often as possible. Do a window, rinse, reload. Top of a door, rinse, reload. Half of the hood, rinse, reload. Be excessive with the soap bucket. Rinse the truck down good and a drying with the Master Blaster and all has been well. But I'm not going to lie... I also bought a white car as a daily driver in the winter :laughing:
 
From a paint expert, Ron Ketcham on GM using softer clear on their high end black vehicles.... "I[FONT=&quot]t is a difference in the trailing solvent of the clear so it will flow out more, which results in less orange peel."[/FONT]
 
pdqgp said:
haha! so I'm not the only Crazy buckeye here ;)

hey, I'll let you vouch for the paint on my Audi, you've seen it up close. It owns me but that's okay as I enjoy it. I stand by the fact that it's technique when drying. I have had to fix up a few areas here and there but overall the McKee's 37 coating, and she is wearing a couple coats, saved me. Really has gone a HUGE way at preventing Micro Marring.
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I can vouch for the Audi, it's finish is better than mine. I've reached the Zen of 'Being better than most' as being acceptable.

As for drying the car, I NEVER use a DRY mf to dry the car, I get them wet and wring them out really good - they are softer and absorb water better that way too. I also ALWAYS use either D115, or Ultimate Spray Wax etc as a drying aid to add lubricity to help prevent marring
 
WRAPT C5Z06 said:
I don't remember the exact reason, but Ron Ketcham from Detailer Buddies on FB explained why. I'll try to find the answer.
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Dealers don't make any money on details so I highly doubt that.
 
FWIW: Have a black 2016 WRX, boght new 10/2015. Loaded with swirls when I picked it up. Light compound & polish April 2016 followed by WG Uber Ceramic, topped monthly with Kamikaze Overcoat or Gyeon Cure or Gyeon Wet Coat. Made it through the summer/fall with minimal swirling and I'm not even too OCD about hand washing. Probably a combo of less washing, coating inherant protection properties, boosters added protection but seems to have worked well to keep defects minimized. Subie paint notoriously soft so in the end, satisfied with the protection. And in winter in NE Ohio it will see trips through a basic touchless tunnel wash monthly just to get nasty caked on salt off. Seems to be working.

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Wrap it in matte gray😎

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I have a black '15 Yukon bought right off the truck. I haven't had a black vehicle since a '06 Z71, I remember why now. Like someone said find good enough and live with it,give up (I have) or trade it in. I quit worrying about the outside living in west Texas and not having a garage. Having four kids I don't have time to be as OCD as I used to be,at least with a black vehicle. I keep the inside spotless though! I'll trade it in a year so the dealership can worry about it. I have a '15 Silver Ice Sierra and love how easy it is to care for,reminds me why all my vehicles have been silver,white or tan the past 10 years besides the Yukon. I release all my penned up OCD on the truck! 99% of people won't notice what we do on black vehicles. I know it's hard but try and enjoy the ride and quit worrying about the paint,you'll just go crazy and hate a awesome vehicle.


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pdqgp said:
I would have to disagree. I've done a black Impalla and two black Camaro's a 12 and a 14 and all three were pretty tough clear coats to correct. Just like with my Audi, the clear is very tough but when perfectly corrected to a mirror finish, it will scratch very easily and show it with ease. I don't think the clear finish is any different, just shows more imperfections more easily being pure black.
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I said*high end* GM cars, not just Chevy. Impala and Camaro are hardly considered high end. I'm talking Escalade, Corvette, Denali, etc...
 
That would mean newer Corvettes & Cadillacs have soft black paint? That would be surprising. But hey anything can happen.


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WRAPT C5Z06 said:
I said*high end* GM cars, not just Chevy. Impala and Camaro are hardly considered high end. I'm talking Escalade, Corvette, Denali, etc...
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I know for a fact Vettes and Caddy's don't have soft paint though. YMMV. I'll let Ron chime back in as he knows better than anyone.
 
Dark GM Paint is a bugger. I used to have similar issues with the Dark Blue GM paint.

Below is what I changed, listed in the order of what I feel helped the most. Not fool proof and I'm sure others may disagree. Just what has helped me.

1. Use 4-5 different mitts when washing and swap out the 'rinse' bucket often. Grit guard or not, particles get trapped in mitts regardless of swirling and rubbing on the guard.

2. Use 3-4 drying towels kept in plastic bags until ready to use. If there is any draft/wind at all where you are washing, regardless of how good and quick you washed the vehicle, new scratch capable particles will find there way to it quickly. I also think they come from the water we tend to rinse with.

3. Although I love the feel of big fluffy wool mitts, and they advertise to trap particles "deep in the fibers to protect the paint" I believe the particles get so "trapped" in wool mitts that they don't always wash out and contribute to what you are experiencing. No matter how "deep in the fibers" the particles are, they move to the surface when washing with them. I have switched to all Microfiber mitts. Microfiber fingers are shallower and easier to notice the trapped particles. They also give more feedback in my opinion. I know it's super geeky, but it has seemed to help.

4.I tend to go "against conventional wisdom" when washing. I wash the dirtiest sections of the car/truck first always wiping 'down', then move up to the top and wash back to the bottom. Swapping mitts out often.

This photo is a poor attempt to illustrate. I divide the vehicle up in 3rds. I wash the bottom (green) third first, swapping mitts out two or three times. Then do the top (purple) section with a new mitt or two. Finalizing with another new mitt or two on the middle (blue) section. The arrows are meant to illustrate the direction I wipe.

Probably has little to do with anything, but I like to think I came up with a new idea to change the car cleaning world forever (joking)
 
UTdetailing said:
Dark GM Paint is a bugger. I used to have similar issues with the Dark Blue GM paint.

Below is what I changed, listed in the order of what I feel helped the most. Not fool proof and I'm sure others may disagree. Just what has helped me.

1. Use 4-5 different mitts when washing and swap out the 'rinse' bucket often. Grit guard or not, particles get trapped in mitts regardless of swirling and rubbing on the guard.

2. Use 3-4 drying towels kept in plastic bags until ready to use. If there is any draft/wind at all where you are washing, regardless of how good and quick you washed the vehicle, new scratch capable particles will find there way to it quickly. I also think they come from the water we tend to rinse with.

3. Although I love the feel of big fluffy wool mitts, and they advertise to trap particles "deep in the fibers to protect the paint" I believe the particles get so "trapped" in wool mitts that they don't always wash out and contribute to what you are experiencing. No matter how "deep in the fibers" the particles are, they move to the surface when washing with them. I have switched to all Microfiber mitts. Microfiber fingers are shallower and easier to notice the trapped particles. They also give more feedback in my opinion. I know it's super geeky, but it has seemed to help.

4.I tend to go "against conventional wisdom" when washing. I wash the dirtiest sections of the car/truck first always wiping 'down', then move up to the top and wash back to the bottom. Swapping mitts out often.

This photo is a poor attempt to illustrate. I divide the vehicle up in 3rds. I wash the bottom (green) third first, swapping mitts out two or three times. Then do the top (purple) section with a new mitt or two. Finalizing with another new mitt or two on the middle (blue) section. The arrows are meant to illustrate the direction I wipe.

Probably has little to do with anything, but I like to think I came up with a new idea to change the car cleaning world forever (joking)
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And now that I am sitting here thinking/reading about how much time, mitts and etc I go through, I may as well go with a rinse-less wash. Bubble bursted!
 
@UTdetailing. I keep my drying towels in a large clean zip lock bag until ready to use too.


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Have you tried the two bucket method one bucket with a grit guard and clear water, the other bucket with your favorite auto shampoo?
 
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