Should I give up?

[Mantilgh]

When I doubt, rinse it out.

Sometimes I use the hose to rinse my mitt before I go back into the rinse bucket just to be safe.

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

I know for a fact Vettes and Caddy's don't have soft paint though.

I GUARANTEE you the OP has soft black paint.

 

[BMW435]

When I doubt, rinse it out.

Sometimes I use the hose to rinse my mitt before I go back into the rinse bucket just to be safe.

I do the same exact thing.


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[Ford Fest]

I know your frustration. Have had many black Daily Drivers including my current one. Good news is there's a problem and that's good because problems can be fixed. Let's just look at what it could be step by step. Forgive me I joined the thread late and didn't read every reply before hitting the reply button myself.


As most on this forum, I have spent hundreds on premium wash mits, pads, MF, washes, WW, detail sprays, drying aids, coatings etc that are only used for this car. I have used the 2 bucket method for every wash, using one mit for the body above the door trim and another for below the trim. I followup with blow drying and using detail spray as a drying aid. I only use the front to back wash pattern to wash or to remove light dust. I truly thought I have taken every precaution, but as I was walking back to the car in the parking lot I saw swirls; a lot of swirls. If it's this bad with the washing methods, coating etc that I have used, how bad would it be if I used an automatic car wash?

Could be products, could be technique. No slam at all intended as I'm sure like all of us you are careful and have good intentions. I do as well and can only really share what I do and use in hopes that it might shed light on some things compared to what you're doing. Just trying to help. Overall all the above sounds great. I'm not a two bucket guy when washing but that's me. I use two microfiber sponges and the same top/bottom technique. Instead of a rinse bucket I simply use the hose to blast off the sponge after each pass/section I wash. I use only the weight of the sponge as pressure with only a single pass over each area, never back and forth. I also wash front to back and dry or buff in the opposite directions only as to fully see if any scratches or marks appear which process is causing them. IN my case I've found every single time that I see a mark or imperfection that it's in my drying or buffing strokes.

I air dry 95% off my car and never wipe with a dry towel, always one that has been wet and squeezed out to the point where it's wet but won't leave streaks. I wet it in a 1gal pale that I fill part way with Uber Rinseless or CarPro Echo combo'd or simliar and distilled water. Wet the towel, wring out and go.

Wash wise, I am 90% Rinseless with a modified version of Gary Deal. 10% I may use a bucket. Even in harsh winter crap. I personally find the technique very safe and honestly a lot quicker overall and less messy. Lastly, I focus more too so while it sounds odd that I can focus and be more precise yet finish faster, I think it because there are less steps and less prep/clean up. I would as I did read, correct the front three panels and start over. Hood and two front fenders.

Happy to chime in again, but hope the above gets you a start or some information that's helpful. Hang in there.

Thanks for the reply, no slam taken That's why I posted, I need help.

Please clarify about washing and drying. You're not saying you wash left to right and dry up and down, right?

What kind of MF sponge is everyone using? I have a couple of the one in the photo. It doesn't seem to hold suds if that makes sense.

 

[Ford Fest]

I feel your pain. I bought a 2016 Silverado in black this year. But it hasn't been as bad as I thought it would be. After doing a correction and seal, my wash method is nothing revolutionary but it is carefully done. I use 2 buckets with Grit Guards and Grit Guard Wash Boards in both buckets. I'll wash the window and top half of a door, then go back to the rinse bucket. Scrub on the wash board, go to the soap bucket, scrub on the wash board in there a little more, move on to the next panel.

When I used to wash my cars, I noticed how much left over soapy water there was in the bucket. Why waste it? Reload your wash mitt as often as possible. Do a window, rinse, reload. Top of a door, rinse, reload. Half of the hood, rinse, reload. Be excessive with the soap bucket. Rinse the truck down good and a drying with the Master Blaster and all has been well. But I'm not going to lie... I also bought a white car as a daily driver in the winter :laughing:

Sounds like our wash techniques are about the same

Thank you to everyone for posting! I truly appreciate the feedback!

In regard to the McKees coating. I applied it a couple of months ago. What's involved to go back and correct the paint? Should I be top coating the McKees with something?

Reading through the posts, I think I may have found a potential issue. After I do a final rinse, I blow dry as much of the paint as possible. Then I mist the panel and a waffle towel with detail spray (currently Wolfgang) wipe down the panel with the damp towel and follow it up with a dry waffle towel. Maybe the dry towel is causing an issue???

Thoughts?

 

[Eldorado2k]

Same here, as well as my wash mitts. Each has their own zip lock bag.


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Sometimes I use the hose to rinse my mitt before I go back into the rinse bucket just to be safe.

That's the only way I roll... The only purpose the Grit Guard serves during my bucket wash is preventing my mitts from touching the bottom of the empty bucket I toss them into as I reach for a new 1 from my wash bucket.

What kind of MF sponge is everyone using? I have a couple of the one in the photo. It doesn't seem to hold suds if that makes sense.

Meguiars Microfiber Wash Mitts: Can't really go wrong with these mitts. They're soft enough to trust, inexpensive, white [which is great because you can tell if it's clean or not]... The only minor gripe is that they're a tad thinner than some of the other more expensive wash media, but they're a solid choice nevertheless.

Viking Microfiber Wash Mitt: This 1 has been with me for a while now.. It's a solid mitt, scrubs more than the usual mitt and has never scratched anything. No complaints.

Gyeon Smoothie Mitt: This works, feels, and costs every bit premium. It holds a tremendous amount of suds. So much that you could almost get yourself in trouble because it could literally go on and on before "needing" to dunk back into the bucket for more suds... The only minor gripe is that the blue mixed with white color makes it a bit hard to totally see if it's completely clean after rinsing it off during a wash. My other gripe is that I want like 4-5 more of them.lol.

Noodle mitts: These are my least favorite. I dunno, maybe it's because I can get them @the 99 cent store and they feel exactly like the more expensive noodle mitts. Lol.

I'd recommend the Megs mitts because you can pick up a few and not have to cringe at the total price.

P.S. I cut the cuff off of all my mitts as soon as I get them. It's not like I ever put my hand in them anyways.. But if you like to wear them you shouldn't cut the cuff off.

Hope this helps, good luck! I wish I had a black car.




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[UTdetailing]

Reading through the posts, I think I may have found a potential issue. After I do a final rinse, I blow dry as much of the paint as possible. Then I mist the panel and a waffle towel with detail spray (currently Wolfgang) wipe down the panel with the damp towel and follow it up with a dry waffle towel. Maybe the dry towel is causing an issue???

Thoughts?

I would be surprised.

One way to check is inspect where you start your drying at in comparison to where you finish. If the scratching gets progressively worse toward the end of where you dried then you are picking up contaminates. If it is consistent then perhaps it is the towel.

I like waffle weave towels and use them often, but the "fluffier" drying towels like Big Blue Microfiber Drying Towel, 40 x 28 are less likely to scratch in my experience.

Last thought from me, use as little pressure as possible when drying.

 

[Ford Fest]

Last thought from me, use as little pressure as possible when drying.

That could be part of the problem. It seems I have heavy hands in whatever I do.

 

[fightnews]

anybody with a black daily driver ever notice tiny little pits in the direct sunlight? especially on the hood? i cant be the only one?

 

[TTQ B4U]

That could be part of the problem. It seems I have heavy hands in whatever I do.

Back to my point earlier about washing in one direction and drying in the other :xyxthumbs:

You'll know for sure then which side of the equation the problem is on.

 

[Eldorado2k]

Back to my point earlier about washing in one direction and drying in the other :xyxthumbs:

You'll know for sure then which side of the equation the problem is on.

I think it would be sort of inconvenient if not difficult to wash in 1 direction. My wash mitt goes back and forth.. Going in 1 direction would be gentle to a fault.


I honestly think OP is most likely instilling swirls during the drying process. If I were him on what appears to be soft black paint, I would choose either to blow dry or towel dry but not both.. Or better yet, towel dry 1st, and follow up with the blower 2nd, but only for the purpose of blowing out the cracks & crevices while patting dry with a waffle weave in the other hand all around the SUV.

As far as the waffle weaves used to dry the vehicle, I always start off with a dry towel. I use nothing but waffle weaves and I will never understand the logic of a damp/wet waffle weave supposedly drying better than a fresh dry towel... Damp towel = streaks, and streaks require more rubbing of the paint.

I would also ditch any kind of "drying aid" because it's more than likely the main reason he's scratching the paint. Why would that be? Because if you think about it, when drying a panel with a Dry waffle weave, all you need to do is pretty much lay the towel on the panel and drag it across the paint with only the weight of the towel, and as long as you've got a decent lsp on your paint it should be nearly bone dry just that easy.

But if you spray the panel down with the unnecessary "drying aid" can you simply lay that towel and drag it across the panel and be done with it? No, not usually, because a quik detailer/spray wax/or any other thing you're spraying on there requires you to rub it off the paint, and if you combine a heavy hand with soft paint what do you think could happen? This is why I think "drying aids" are so overrated and more of an unnecessary mistake than an aid of any kind.

A clean microfiber waffle weave alone will not scratch paint that's just been washed and rinsed clean... But if you rub your soft paint enough times with it [or any microfiber towel] it certainly has a better chance of instilling swirls.

Just my 2 cents.


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[TTQ B4U]

I think it would be sort of inconvenient if not difficult to wash in 1 direction. My wash mitt goes back and forth.. Going in 1 direction would be gentle to a fault.

I'm talking front to back for example on Fenders and doors. Dry up and down. I do a modified version of Gary Dean Rinseless and do this.

I honestly think OP is most likely instilling swirls during the drying process. If I were him on what appears to be soft black paint, I would choose either to blow dry or towel dry but not both.. Or better yet, towel dry 1st, and follow up with the blower 2nd, but only for the purpose of blowing out the cracks & crevices while patting dry with a waffle weave in the other hand all around the SUV.

Agree. It's likely during drying. Putting a coating on it will go a long way but won't prevent improper technique. I use a blower and get it 95%+ dry. I then go over it with my detail spray and very lightly damp cloth to wipe then a final very light buff. Zero issues. YMMV.

 

[UTdetailing]

...choose either to blow dry or towel dry but not both.. Or better yet, towel dry 1st, and follow up with the blower 2nd, but only for the purpose of blowing out the cracks & crevices while patting dry with a waffle weave in the other hand all around the SUV.

:dblthumb2: This is what I do also, if I use a blower at all.

I would also ditch any kind of "drying aid" because it's more than likely the main reason he's scratching the paint. Why would that be? Because if you think about it, when drying a panel with a Dry waffle weave, all you need to do is pretty much lay the towel on the panel and drag it across the paint with only the weight of the towel, and as long as you've got a decent lsp on your paint it should be nearly bone dry just that easy.

But if you spray the panel down with the unnecessary "drying aid" can you simply lay that towel and drag it across the panel and be done with it? No, not usually, because a quik detailer/spray wax/or any other thing you're spraying on there requires you to rub it off the paint, and if you combine a heavy hand with soft paint what do you think could happen? This is why I think "drying aids" are so overrated and more of an unnecessary mistake than an aid of any kind.

Couldn't agree more...
Waffle Weave for drying, it takes little to nothing more than simply laying it on top of a wet surface. Deep Pile or "fluffy" for quick detailers/spray waxes.

My general rule is use a towel/applicator that accomplishes the task with as little pressure as possible.

 

[Nor Cal ZL1]

I would hit it with some car pro essence+ on the hood. That should get looking much better. Then use Car Pro ECH20 as a drying aid/detail spray. I as think it may be during the last process and the car being dry. If you do just the hood as a trial, dry half wet with ECH20 as a drying aid/detail spray, and the other half dry then ECH20 as a detail spray. Just need to identify at what point it is hapening. Essence+ will make it look much better without starting over. ECH20 I am also super impressed with how it looks, and works. Had to shrink these shots so the resolution is not so great. Here is my ride with Ech20. The side shot the gill area has PPF. With ECH20 it virtually is undetectable.

 

[Eldorado2k]

You may also want to consider Carpro Reload as a final wipe/spray sealant. It does a pretty remarkable job of hiding swirls and adding gloss, especially on black vehicles.


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[GSKR]

I think it would be sort of inconvenient if not difficult to wash in 1 direction. My wash mitt goes back and forth.. Going in 1 direction would be gentle to a fault.


I honestly think OP is most likely instilling swirls during the drying process. If I were him on what appears to be soft black paint, I would choose either to blow dry or towel dry but not both.. Or better yet, towel dry 1st, and follow up with the blower 2nd, but only for the purpose of blowing out the cracks & crevices while patting dry with a waffle weave in the other hand all around the SUV.

As far as the waffle weaves used to dry the vehicle, I always start off with a dry towel. I use nothing but waffle weaves and I will never understand the logic of a damp/wet waffle weave supposedly drying better than a fresh dry towel... Damp towel = streaks, and streaks require more rubbing of the paint.

I would also ditch any kind of "drying aid" because it's more than likely the main reason he's scratching the paint. Why would that be? Because if you think about it, when drying a panel with a Dry waffle weave, all you need to do is pretty much lay the towel on the panel and drag it across the paint with only the weight of the towel, and as long as you've got a decent lsp on your paint it should be nearly bone dry just that easy.

But if you spray the panel down with the unnecessary "drying aid" can you simply lay that towel and drag it across the panel and be done with it? No, not usually, because a quik detailer/spray wax/or any other thing you're spraying on there requires you to rub it off the paint, and if you combine a heavy hand with soft paint what do you think could happen? This is why I think "drying aids" are so overrated and more of an unnecessary mistake than an aid of any kind.

A clean microfiber waffle weave alone will not scratch paint that's just been washed and rinsed clean... But if you rub your soft paint enough times with it [or any microfiber towel] it certainly has a better chance of instilling swirls.

Just my 2 cents.


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watersprite chamoi is really what he should be using.

 

[GSKR]

watersprite chamoi is really what he should be using.

Then go over it with a qd after its dry.Black is one of those colors you can't just wash and walk.Needs booster after every wash and I wouldn't use any towels on that.

 

[Don M]

Black is one of those colors you can't just wash and walk.Needs booster after every wash.

That's why I love D-115 from Megs Detailer's Line. I use it every time I wash as a drying aid.

 

[WRAPT C5Z06]

Are the white towels with the black border the Rag Company 800? If so, those are my favorite drying towels by far! Top of the line Korean MF and so soft!

 

[Eldorado2k]

Are the white towels with the black border the Rag Company 800? If so, those are my favorite drying towels by far! Top of the line Korean MF and so soft!

Are you talking about the ones on the top left corner? Those are actually Megs microfiber wash mitts.


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